derby8 Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 51 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said: Who would decide who goes into this super league ? This would be terrible in my opinion. It would devalue the domestic league in the same way as cups. This elitist kind of thinking just serves to make a few select clubs much richer while hindering any progress for most clubs in this country. Suddenly the Premier League would not have the pull anymore without certain clubs. Also, it isn’t a given who will be relegated at the start of a season- promoted teams don’t always go down straight away. I think Mel Morris has been right, a fairer TV deal for the championship is needed, especially when there is demand-some clubs would attract bigger audiences than Premier League teams The latest thinking seems to be that financial returns are maximised staying in the PL and with an expanded CL, rather than a super league with teams leaving the PL. Could result in fewer PL teams to accommodate the extra CL fixtures, or withdrawing from the LC. Implications domestically. PL teams not in euro comps could have too few fixtures. Possibly re-vamp the LC along the lines of the revised CL, PL teams not in europe, championship teams. L1 and L2 teams may be part-time. Many possibilities, the status quo looks increasingly untenable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said: Surely a salary cap (percentage of income) would ensure the elite remain as the elite? I thought you meant a proper salary cap. This alternative would be awful though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derby8 Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 Just now, Spanish said: I thought you meant a proper salary cap. This alternative would be awful though L1 and L2 clubs proposed flat rate salary caps, as opposed to percentage of income, now withdrawn, legal reasons I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i-Ram Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 Half of all Championship clubs on the brink of collapse? Let it happen, poo happens. Football needs a really good shake. It really is no different to the fact that half of all British retailers, and pubs and restaurants, are on the brink of collapse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkFruitsRam7 Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 32 minutes ago, Dean (hick) Saunders said: Something needs to change though right? Aye, but not that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 14 hours ago, Coconut said: ..and completely meaningless. Hooray, you're the best of the rest. That's your limit. That's all you'll ever be. Those shitty little clubs who've had more beneficial circumstances and/or luck than you in the short term (in the grand scheme of things) will now forever be seen as the elite the country has to offer, and you'll never be able to challenge that. Whatever you do from this point is insignificant, nobody cares, and you'll never ever ever have the chance to reach the national conscience again because in this particular 10/20 year period in your 140 year history you weren't good enough. duck that. This is the only correct response to scrapping relegation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Dean (hick) Saunders said: Something needs to change though right? The direction of travel is DCFC May never being part of the PL majority again. I this were to be true then what do we want? Being part of a sustainable football league with chance of winning and growing it as a brand could have potential. Like darts breakaway... Different Boxing Boards etc. If the PL/EFL fairness could be fixed it would still be my preferred choice. But if it stays as it is then EFL will wither and die anyway? That worked so well the BDO has eventually ceased to exist. (It was managed very badly tbf, but then again so is the EFL so it could meet the same fate) The difference with those sports is that, as long as you're good enough, you can enter whichever competition you damn well please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram-Alf Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 Football is sinking as fast as the Titanic did imo, USA sports pay their star players multi times what our star football players earn, Agents are sucking more and more money out of the game, Players are now a huge commodity, Sky with it's billions from it's customers at home and overseas set the bench mark for wages and agents know this. To have a wage cap will stop the free market in negotiations, Players sell their talents, Agents talk on behalf of their employer and a deal may be struck, All this is the fault of the Fans as we demand better players whether it makes our clubs skint who cares, They'll be another paymaster on his/her horizon. We get what we demand and when the bubble bursts we cry Foul, We point fingers at the mismanagement of the club and blame others when things go wrong. Never mind...the Sun still rises in the Morning and it's another day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derby8 Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 15 minutes ago, James Pond said: Football is sinking as fast as the Titanic did imo, USA sports pay their star players multi times what our star football players earn, Agents are sucking more and more money out of the game, Players are now a huge commodity, Sky with it's billions from it's customers at home and overseas set the bench mark for wages and agents know this. To have a wage cap will stop the free market in negotiations, Players sell their talents, Agents talk on behalf of their employer and a deal may be struck, All this is the fault of the Fans as we demand better players whether it makes our clubs skint who cares, They'll be another paymaster on his/her horizon. We get what we demand and when the bubble bursts we cry Foul, We point fingers at the mismanagement of the club and blame others when things go wrong. Never mind...the Sun still rises in the Morning and it's another day. First things first, on 15 April 1912 it was Fulham 0 Derby 0, down by the Thames, on the day the Titanic sank. An appropriate fixture. Finances, just one rule, clubs should balance their books, with agreed owner contributions allowed, limits on creative accountancy, and borrowing only for capital projects, need to submit budgets and outturns with points penalties for infringements. Not far from where we are now, but with some additional financial staff appointed at the EFL to control the system effectively. Publish comparative financial tables as well as the sporting ones and take a clear birdseye view of what's going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 I've been very pro-dismantling promotion and relegation for a while now. The current system does make for good entertainment, however it also makes football incredibly unsustainable. The Football League can become a national league, whereby the traditional virtues of the game are protected and supported in their own right. The Premier League can continue to become a glamour league where they could implement a wage cap, with all teams having to spend within a certain % of each other (like the NFL) so that becomes more competitive across the board and the Football League will then become more marketable and enjoyable in its own right. We all know the current situation has to change - allowing relegated teams a massive head start doesn't sit right with me and teams in this division without those funds have to THEN compete financially which has caused this massive issue. This year we could see all three relegated teams bounce straight back and win promotion. Bournemouth are making a meal of it, but Norwich and Watford are steamrolling teams at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rammy03 Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 22 minutes ago, Ambitious said: We all know the current situation has to change - allowing relegated teams a massive head start doesn't sit right with me and teams in this division without those funds have to THEN compete financially which has caused this massive issue. This year we could see all three relegated teams bounce straight back and win promotion. Bournemouth are making a meal of it, but Norwich and Watford are steamrolling teams at the moment. Stopping promotion and relegation would destroy what makes English football great. But other than that I agree. These parachute payments are a farce. It's completely unfair, the gap is too big. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 26 minutes ago, Ambitious said: This year we could see all three relegated teams bounce straight back and win promotion. Bournemouth are making a meal of it, but Norwich and Watford are steamrolling teams at the moment. Yep and 2 of the 3 promoted clubs likely relegated, with the 3rd relegated club only going up in the previous season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 14 minutes ago, Rammy03 said: Stopping promotion and relegation would destroy what makes English football great. But other than that I agree. These parachute payments are a farce. It's completely unfair, the gap is too big. It would only be stopped in one division - promotion and relegation would still remain in the Football League. If that is really the only promotion and relegation that really matters then we're also buying into the narrative that the Championship is only interesting because of the possibility and relevance to the Premier League hence the issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheresOnlyWanChope Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 35 minutes ago, Ambitious said: I've been very pro-dismantling promotion and relegation for a while now. The current system does make for good entertainment, however it also makes football incredibly unsustainable. The Football League can become a national league, whereby the traditional virtues of the game are protected and supported in their own right. The Premier League can continue to become a glamour league where they could implement a wage cap, with all teams having to spend within a certain % of each other (like the NFL) so that becomes more competitive across the board and the Football League will then become more marketable and enjoyable in its own right. We all know the current situation has to change - allowing relegated teams a massive head start doesn't sit right with me and teams in this division without those funds have to THEN compete financially which has caused this massive issue. This year we could see all three relegated teams bounce straight back and win promotion. Bournemouth are making a meal of it, but Norwich and Watford are steamrolling teams at the moment. Promotion and relegation need to exist at top level just as much as local Sunday football. The football league will not be as enjoyable, imagine winning the division and not being promoted? Fine if you’re in the top division but not football league! There are plenty of examples of teams coming down from the Premier League and not going straight back up. Without a chance at promotion, I think it will make for a rather dull league, and a lot of cost cutting everywhere (short term would maybe be a good thing) but no growth in football clubs, including infrastructure, community stuff, staff intake, exciting players, stadium spending etc etc. Solution isn’t to scrap promotion and relegation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 13 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said: Promotion and relegation need to exist at top level just as much as local Sunday football. The football league will not be as enjoyable, imagine winning the division and not being promoted? Fine if you’re in the top division but not football league! There are plenty of examples of teams coming down from the Premier League and not going straight back up. Without a chance at promotion, I think it will make for a rather dull league, and a lot of cost cutting everywhere (short term would maybe be a good thing) but no growth in football clubs, including infrastructure, community stuff, staff intake, exciting players, stadium spending etc etc. Solution isn’t to scrap promotion and relegation But the Championship would be the new top of the pyramid, with the long term aim to replace the PL? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 29 minutes ago, Carnero said: Yep and 2 of the 3 promoted clubs likely relegated, with the 3rd relegated club only going up in the previous season. @Davidstill thinks all 3 will be relegated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rammieib Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 I want to be in the Premier League. Juist about all fans do as well - we sold out when Man Utd came to town last season (5000 Man Utd fans I know), most fans want to see the best teams coming to Pride Park and I'm no different. The Championship product isn't great - the old cliche of how exciting the league is and so on, but I hardly ever sit down and watch a Champ game if its not Derby and most teams who we face now, I'd be struggling to name you 6 or 7 players from the opposition. 10/15 years ago it wasn't like that. Also on top of this - most grounds are only 50-70% full. The atmosphere's are no longer there. What I'm saying - we haven't got a product like the PL we can sell to generate more money. Something needs doing though - salaries need capping, agent fee's need capping, transfer fee's etc - but there will always be a legal challenge somewhere to deem it illegal and so on. As for the new rehashed Champions League - well, if the PL ever want to reduce to 18 teams, they need 14 teams to vote in favour of this, and I don't think they will, not without a serious redistribution of wealth, which the big teams won't give them either. All said and done - the current model continues. It'll physically take 2 or 3 Champ teams to just cease trading as a legal business for the EFL or PL to realise there is an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheresOnlyWanChope Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: But the Championship would be the new top of the pyramid, with the long term aim to replace the PL? But surely it couldn’t replace the PL because it would be missing certain prestigious teams, it would never be as lucrative surely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 18 minutes ago, Spanish said: @Davidstill thinks all 3 will be relegated ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuespachRam Posted March 9, 2021 Share Posted March 9, 2021 It would be great if they scrapped promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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