New Manager

[Barney1991]

Should never have got rid of maclaren 2nd time around his interview podcast was really interesting when he said the players he had couldn't play the way he wanted and him and Morris has identified the summer as a big change. He was then sacked and Rowett came in I would have kept him on for another seasons. Some managers just suit certain clubs and he hasn't done aswell at qpr and forest but just something about Derby and maclaren suited each other I like him and was willing to get past the Newcastle thing as he admitted he was wrong and we should have just moved on from it but I feel Morris always had it against him 2nd time around 

[Will Hughes Hair]

I suspect it will cost something like 4m GBP to get rid of Cocu and overhaul the backroom team. Then there’s compensation and signing on bonuses for the new team.  So another 2m there and they’ll  want a kitty for new players too.

With FFP is still in play I think I’d rather add the six million quid to the kitty and support Phil in getting three or four quality players.

[Anag Ram]

It does seem ridiculous that you have to pay compensation to a manager who couldn’t be doing a worse job.

We are rock bottom, so in theory any one of us could have done a similar job.

 

[deanoakaram4life]

1 minute ago, Will Hughes Hair said:

I suspect it will cost something like 4m GBP to get rid of Cocu and overhaul the backroom team. Then there’s compensation and signing on bonuses for the new team.  So another 2m there and they’ll  want a kitty for new players too.

With FFP is still in play I think I’d rather add the six million quid to the kitty and support Phil in getting three or four quality players.

Absolutely no to this. FFP renews with new ownership so Mel should do the honourable thing and sack him with his own money.

I can’t see him doing it though. He’s run the club down to it’s knees over the past 2 years. 

[Curtains]

1 minute ago, deanoakaram4life said:

Absolutely no to this. FFP renews with new ownership so Mel should do the honourable thing and sack him with his own money.

I can’t see him doing it though. He’s run the club down to it’s knees over the past 2 years. 

I think you are wrong about FFP mate it doesn’t renew 

[IronRam 140.6]

3 hours ago, Leicester Ram said:

Knight, Sibley, Bird, Buchanan, Whittaker etc were all born by 99 at the earliest, similarly to me (97) they’ll have grown up with the Spanish national side of 08-12 and the Barcelona sides of that era being the gold standard.

I don’t think “passy, passy” style is as new or outlandish as you think it is, grass roots is different now and these lads have been in our academy for years. Nothing wrong with a continental style, any style executed effectively will work but what I do agree with is that this side needs to play with for more aggression.

Need more concerted and well channeled aggression not just when we’re pressing or defending off the ball but we need a more decisive, aggressive attacking mentality. Far too often we’ve seen this team hesitating in the final third, needs to stop.

Which is probably what I was trying to say but craply.

Look at the styles of 90's Man Utd and Arsenal invincible's. Leeds under Bielsa, Leicester of the last few years. All quite different styles but common theme being those styles aggressively pursued. Our languid, slow, chess-like approach very seldom works over here. Serie A, la liga with the top two taken out maybe. 

In fact I don't really recall our slow style being used to great effect by anyone? Maybe some of the Chelsea stuff under Mourinho was closest I can think. 

[Ghost of Clough]

35 minutes ago, brady1993 said:

I don't think I ever mentioned promotion in that post outside of referring to what Jokanovic had done previously.....

Of course it's absurd to think about promotion this season but I genuinely believe that this squad has enough talent in it to challenge for a top 6 position (again not this season), there have been plenty worse squads that have done. 

With everything that went on last season we managed to finish 6 points of top 6, we lost Martin which is a blow but he wasn't even a guaranteed starter and we've improved elsewhere. 

I don't think top 6 this season is beyond the capability of this squad. We would need 70 points from our remaining 35 games (top 2 form for the rest of the season). We picked up 27 points from 14 games in our run after Christmas before fitness and a small squad caught up with us. We've lost Lowe, Bogle and Martin, but picked up Ibe, Jozwiak, Byrne, Marshall, te Wierik (and Bielik) so we should have a squad capable of at least pushing for top 6 come the final day of this season.

It is a big ask and requires an immediate turnaround of results though.

[Jimbo Ram]

13 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

It does seem ridiculous that you have to pay compensation to a manager who couldn’t be doing a worse job.

We are rock bottom, so in theory any one of us could have done a similar job.

 

Maybe the moral of the story is don’t hand out 4 year contracts.....

[CornwallRam]

1 hour ago, LincsRam said:

To me the manager is the most important part of the team, i would rather we push out the boat and get a decent manager who is successful, maybe even again from abroad in the same vein as Marcelo Bielsa (Leeds) or Nuno Espírito Santo (Wolves), managers who are liked by their ex fans who have gone elsewhere to bigger clubs.

I would not like to go the route of failed league managers e.g Sam Allardyce etc or the inexperienced route of Rooney / Wassall.

If we had to go down the route of managers from the UK then there is Nigel Adkins (left Hull due to no finance), Eddie Howe (knows the championship), Cowley brothers (did well at Lincoln, failed at Huddersfield) or look at the best manager in League 1/2 and head hunt them.

Derby are a big club, we should be a very attractive proposition.

When has Allardyce failed?

[Jimbo Ram]

4 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

When has Allardyce failed?

Generally done ok, didn’t do so well at Sunderland ?

[GboroRam]

9 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Maybe the moral of the story is don’t hand out 4 year contracts.....

To play devil's advocate, Cocu's appointment was accepted almost universally. We all wanted to believe.

[brady1993]

1 minute ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I don't think top 6 this season is beyond the capability of this squad. We would need 70 points from our remaining 35 games (top 2 form for the rest of the season). We picked up 27 points from 14 games in our run after Christmas before fitness and a small squad caught up with us. We've lost Lowe, Bogle and Martin, but picked up Ibe, Jozwiak, Byrne, Marshall, te Wierik (and Bielik) so we should have a squad capable of at least pushing for top 6 come the final day of this season.

It is a big ask and requires an immediate turnaround of results though.

I agree it's not impossible, but it's very unlikely and don't think it can be seriously considered anymore. It'd be an extended run of exceptional form, basically playing like a top 2 side (as you said) for the majority of a season. I'm more positive than most but I doubt that the squad is capable of sustaining that. And that's without considering that confidence is starting to look pretty shot in the squad which can be a tricky, patchy thing to turn around. The only way you'd do anything close to that is by rolling the dice a little on the academy talent (which is something I'd do to an extent anyway) on the chance that they really start to flourish (think we are starting to see signs of that with Buchanan and Knight). Build the side around Bird, Sibley, Knight and Buchanan with the like of Whittaker, Stretton and Archie Brown a lot closer to the first team squad and see if they can really fulfil their potential. 

[CornwallRam]

9 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Generally done ok, didn’t do so well at Sunderland ?

Took over when they were in the relegation zone and kept them in the Premier League, which is more than they managed after he left. Not what I'd call failure.

[DarkFruitsRam7]

Not a fan of contributing to a thread discussing our 'next manager' when we already have one in place, but...

I think I've found @angieram's perfect candidate, if only for his desire for his team to throw the ball forwards!

 

[brady1993]

23 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

When has Allardyce failed?

It depends on your definition of failed I guess. He's never done outright badly though (from a results perspective at least) as far as I can recall other than perhaps with England.

[Ramarena]

21 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

When has Allardyce failed?

Probably only Blackpool, you could try and argue he took the magpies down too but they were struggling when he arrived.

Hes an interesting option I suppose. I didn’t realise he’s had as many success or good league placings as he has.

That said he’s still a no for me, so much baggage and cost. He definitely wouldn’t win over our purists either.

That said I’d like to hear some of the ideas as to why from those suggesting him, as Ive seen a few people name him but not give much justification as to why...............you never know you might change my mind!

[Rampant]

52 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

We are rock bottom, so in theory any one of us could have done a similar job.

 

I know nothing about tactics or man-management but I would have offloaded Fozzy and given Malone the two year deal tbh. That puts me one up on Cocu.

[DarkFruitsRam7]

Allardyce would demand a huge salary and 2 years at the very least. I'm no snob - I just don't think it's anywhere near feasible.

[CornwallRam]

35 minutes ago, Ramarena said:

Probably only Blackpool, you could try and argue he took the magpies down too but they were struggling when he arrived.

Hes an interesting option I suppose. I didn’t realise he’s had as many success or good league placings as he has.

That said he’s still a no for me, so much baggage and cost. He definitely wouldn’t win over our purists either.

That said I’d like to hear some of the ideas as to why from those suggesting him, as Ive seen a few people name him but not give much justification as to why...............you never know you might change my mind!

He got Blackpool to the play-offs and was sacked in the summer.

Newcastle were 11th when he was sacked and didn't get relegated for 18 months.

Obviously he's played some pretty agricultural stuff, but I remember his Bolton side being great to watch. My point is that he isn't a manager with a rigid style - he alters it to fit the players and the situation.

The real baggage is the dodgy England bung stuff. I'm not sure I'd be happy with him as our manager for that reason - but if we're going to be run by Saudis?

[brady1993]

2 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

He got Blackpool to the play-offs and was sacked in the summer.

Newcastle were 11th when he was sacked and didn't get relegated for 18 months.

Obviously he's played some pretty agricultural stuff, but I remember his Bolton side being great to watch. My point is that he isn't a manager with a rigid style - he alters it to fit the players and the situation.

The real baggage is the dodgy England bung stuff. I'm not sure I'd be happy with him as our manager for that reason - but if we're going to be run by Saudis?

Personally I'd have 3 reservations: the dodgy england stuff, the long streaks of agricultural football (your point about Bolton is fair though) and that he's not managed anyone since May 2018 which is a fair stretch.