Derby in advanced talks with American billionaire Michael Dell over major financial injection

[Ramslaar]

2 minutes ago, Chester40 said:

Made this point before, but I never understand the constant badgering of people who claim to be ITK to declare where their information comes from. 

If I really was told something in confidence by a source (maybe a relative who is involved in the accounting or legal side of things) then I would do exactly what @Dcfc_20 has done, allude to this knowledge but say I can't really say more (for fear of getting my friend /relative the sack).

Sure we have all been in the situation where a senior manager we are close to at work has let us know certain things that we then hint at to colleagues without letting on too much for it be clear who our source is. 

Just shouting them down means nobody is going to want to say anything for fear they are ridiculed and disbelieved.

It just puts off honest people who may really have heard things...because believe it or not there must be people who are ITK who are married, siblings of other people they confide in!

I would add, reading his posts, I have a very healthy dose of disbelief for this particular poster so I won't be burning effigies of Mel anytime soon based on his claims. 

Yes you are totally correct I for one was just unhappy that he has just tryed to pin all on mel.yes I know he is not blameless I get that but for someone that's ITK he didnt even know the basics which I find very odd.he would never have said some of the things he did if he had half a clue, that or he is being fed alot of poo by someone

[Reggie Greenwood]

8 hours ago, Dcfc_20 said:

I think it hasn’t been confirmed that happened or perhaps that’s what the club has come out with (don’t believe it one bit) and that 30 million probably won’t be used to keep the club financially safe more to most likely pay off Gabay after he borrowed 80 million from him. More and more borrowing always works out doesn’t it? 

 

the Gabay loan has already been paid off. Conway confirmed this when he had to do a follow up tweet to his “exclusive”. 
do keep up 

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, Ramslaar said:

We are slowly but surely starting to see fruits of the millions that mel invested in the academy all it took was a manager that was willing to do it.

This is based on what? To play youth they have to be good enough or the only choice! Lampard played Bogle, etc...

[Mihangel]

1 hour ago, Chester40 said:

If I really was told something in confidence by a source (maybe a relative who is involved in the accounting or legal side of things) then I would do exactly what @Dcfc_20 has done, allude to this knowledge but say I can't really say more (for fear of getting my friend /relative the sack).

would add, reading his posts, I have a very healthy dose of disbelief for this particular poster so I won't be burning effigies of Mel anytime soon based on his claims. 

Sorry for the edit BUT, that's why people give them a hard time, they lack credibility. There's actually nothing in what they've posted to particularly disbelieve because there's nothing of substance.

Also, that someone 'knows somebody close to the club' is also, generally, of little value, this is board level stuff, Dave from the club shop is unlikely to provide much insight.

[Ramslaar]

6 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

This is based on what? To play youth they have to be good enough or the only choice! Lampard played Bogle, etc...

Bogle and who? Played bird once and never again

[Ramslaar]

12 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

This is based on what? To play youth they have to be good enough or the only choice! Lampard played Bogle, etc...

All other managers have been out for themselves, even lampard.cocu is a totally different ilk as you can see from the players hes played.you may say he has had to but if you look at his record at Psv I'd beg to differ.its what he does. Plays youth builds them sells them on for good profit.at psv correct me if I'm wrong but in 4 years he bought 40mil of players and sold nearly 200mil

[hintonsboots]

28 minutes ago, ShoreRam said:

Dave from the club shop is unlikely to provide much insight.

Could help with that XXXL or XXL choice. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

In the broad sense, I think Mel has genuinely given it his best shot and is trying to find an honourable exit, however, he genuinely loves DCFC and doesn't want to leave us in the lurch.

The £30m loan is basically"get through the Corona crisis" funding.

No sensible person is going to be investing in second division football teams in the current climate, unless, they see a chance to grab something in distress at a fraction of what it's worth.

The extent to which we're in the dog poo I do not know, but, I well believe we need to be realistic that the next few seasons aren't going to be particularly glamorous.

That doesn't mean they won't be fun, and k think as much as not making it up was a shame, we had a good few years of being a top team at the right end of the league.

[Uptherams]

11 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

In the broad sense, I think Mel has genuinely given it his best shot and is trying to find an honourable exit, however, he genuinely loves DCFC and doesn't want to leave us in the lurch.

The £30m loan is basically"get through the Corona crisis" funding.

No sensible person is going to be investing in second division football teams in the current climate, unless, they see a chance to grab something in distress at a fraction of what it's worth.

The extent to which we're in the dog poo I do not know, but, I well believe we need to be realistic that the next few seasons aren't going to be particularly glamorous.

That doesn't mean they won't be fun, and k think as much as not making it up was a shame, we had a good few years of being a top team at the right end of the league.

£46.8m spent on wages is utterly ridiculous. Even half that is huge. We won't know for a few years, but if this season's wage bill is above £25m then the club is being completely mismanaged. I don't care if we get taken over by Jeff Bezos and are pushing for promotion. The wage bill should at least be lower than revenue. Our revenue tends to hover around the £30m mark. 

[Sparkle]

We probably owe Ipswich,Peterborough, Huddersfield,Brentford and Arsenal transfer fees still I would suspect, whilst hoping Watford and Huddersfield owe us something ( the Malone and Ince fees may have cancelled themselves out ) 

[RamNut]

I don’t judge the success of a manager by the value of players sold.

the current moment reminds me a bit of the two occasions when Roy mac was manager.

after peter Taylor we had a mix of young players and has beens. steve cherry, Paul blades, Graham Harbey, Andy garner, steve spooner, tony Reid. And then Robertson, who like Rooney, couldn’t run. (Maybe we should have played him in holding midfield?). Plus kenny burns, Dave Watson, Archie Gemmill ( a better comparison to Rooney), and one or two gems - Wilson and Davison. It’s easy to pick youngsters. The crowd is generally supportive, and easy to justify signing the freebie veterans. But Arthur cox came in and with the help of Ron jukes superscout, totally rebuilt it from scratch And built two promotion winning sides.

similarly after cox, Roy mac was back in charge. we had a lot of young players with veteran Gordon Cowan pulling the strings in midfield. Kitson was the Tom lawrence of his day. Michael Forsyth was the Craig Forsyth. But then again Jim smith came in and set about building a team based on excellent recruitment.

we seem to lack the recruitment skills to find the players to fill the gaps, and therefore we could struggle to turn a collection of good youngsters into a winning team.Maybe at psv cocu was the coach and recruitment was by others? It’s an important summer for him to take charge of the recruitment and show us his vision - if he has one - but the financial situation might yet prevent that. 
 

[Stive Pesley]

11 hours ago, SaintRam said:

think of it this way - we either get this 30m commercial loan to be financially safe this season - or we lose 2+ of Bird, Sibley, Knight, Bogle etc. to cover it, likely for less than their worth. Bird and Sibley most likely.

A very good point. Plus - those players are young and improving all the time so unlikely to lose their value.

We may have formally secured this loan against the stadium, but essentially it's these academy players who are underwriting it

[CornwallRam]

8 hours ago, Ramslaar said:

Look I dont want to be horrible but alot of what you have said so far has made no sense.if you are truly Itk I understand you not wanting to give out your source but take a tip from me dont bother posting if you know you cant say how you know.

Just to defend the poster here - what he said makes perfect sense. Now it may not be true, but that's not the same thing.

He could be someone making stuff up for attention, or he could be a concerned fan who has heard some worrying information. Very few of us on here have a clue what's going on within the club - the days of information leaking out like a sieve are long gone. Just because you think he's probably wrong, doesn't mean that he is.

Time might tell - although these things often don't come out for many years unless something really dramatic happens.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

3 hours ago, Ramslaar said:

Yes you are totally correct I for one was just unhappy that he has just tryed to pin all on mel.yes I know he is not blameless I get that but for someone that's ITK he didnt even know the basics which I find very odd.he would never have said some of the things he did if he had half a clue, that or he is being fed alot of poo by someone

Ramslaar, I agree with all you have said in this thread but, and not being mischievous, are you in the know? I suspect you are!

[Ramslad1992]

32 minutes ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said:

Ramslaar, I agree with all you have said in this thread but, and not being mischievous, are you in the know? I suspect you are!

He can’t say... he’d get banned.

[RoyMac5]

2 hours ago, Ramslaar said:

All other managers have been out for themselves, even lampard.cocu is a totally different ilk as you can see from the players hes played.you may say he has had to but if you look at his record at Psv I'd beg to differ.its what he does. Plays youth builds them sells them on for good profit.at psv correct me if I'm wrong but in 4 years he bought 40mil of players and sold nearly 200mil

I'm not arguing with what Cocu is trying to do. I'm saying you can't make silk purses out of sows ears! Who has left our Academy and made a high level career that we've missed out playing? Not many if any is the point. 

To bring through youth the quality has to be there.

[sage]

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I'm not arguing with what Cocu is trying to do. I'm saying you can't make silk purses out of sows ears! Who has left our Academy and made a high level career that we've missed out playing? Not many if any is the point. 

To bring through youth the quality has to be there.

There is an argument that some of our previously promising players had their progress delayed and their potential reduced by DCFC not giving them a chance off the bench (due to the bloated squad) or letting them go out on loan (having a successful u23 team seemed a priority). An example of that is Charles Vernam who had to drop down to League Two and will be in League One next year. He was in my opinion a better footballer at 18/19 than Morgan Whittaker but due to how we were managed received less opportunities.

 

[Ghost of Clough]

13 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I'm not arguing with what Cocu is trying to do. I'm saying you can't make silk purses out of sows ears! Who has left our Academy and made a high level career that we've missed out playing? Not many if any is the point. 

To bring through youth the quality has to be there.

They weren't given the opportunities to prove themselves.

Lowe made 12 apps in the 16/17 season, and put in some exceptional performances (notably the Wolves game). As the mangers after that decided to sign expensive backups instead of trust Lowe, he had to wait another 2 years to make another first team appearance with us (5 games last season), and it wasn't until this season that he was given a real go at it. His 16/17 season performances merited being backup once Fozzy returned from one of his numerous injuries. Given Fozzy's injury history, we probably would have seen the likes of MacDonald get a go in the first team as well. This may have ever resulted in him pushing on and becoming a squad player himself, or earning a loan move to progress. Instead, both Lowe and MacDonald 'stagnated'.

Jamie Hanson suffered the same as Lowe. Scored in 1 of his 2 games under McClaren in the 14/15 season, then was dropped completely. 19 apps in the 15/16 season (averaging a very good 2 points per game) before fading away due to a bloated squad. At the very least he was a useful squad/utility player, a valuable attribute when trying to keep the wage bill down.

Bennett. A few apps here and there under Clough (managing him well as a 15/16 year old). Then nothing until Lampard last season. His injuries didn't help, but he deserved more opportunities than what he got. Another useful squad player.

The likes of Elsnik hardly got the opportunities either.

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

They weren't given the opportunities to prove themselves.

Lowe made 12 apps in the 16/17 season, and put in some exceptional performances (notably the Wolves game). 

Jamie Hanson suffered the same as Lowe. 

Bennett. His injuries didn't help, but he deserved more opportunities than what he got. Another useful squad player.

The likes of Elsnik hardly got the opportunities either.

Or they weren't then good enough and/or fit. Hardly a pot of gold there though is there!

 

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, sage said:

There is an argument that some of our previously promising players had their progress delayed and their potential reduced by DCFC not giving them a chance off the bench...An example of that is Charles Vernam who had to drop down to League Two and will be in League One next year. 

Well hopefully we've got a sell on fee! Seriously though, he was better than who in the squad was the point when going for promotion.