The Administration Thread

[Curtains]

5 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

Unfortunately, I don't think I'm wrong about the current situation - and we certainly don't have months. The administrators have to do the best they can for the creditors and running at a loss with no one to underwrite it certainly isn't in the creditors' interest. If liquidation is the best option, it's better to liquidate with the maximum of assets left. 

The chink of light that I can see is that either Gibson or the EFL think this through and change their positions. If they really go through with this is could destroy the whole structure of football and effectively end the EFL, such would be the precedent set by empowering malicious financial claims between clubs.

I think, on reflection, things are 50-50 at present. There's a good chance the EFL will back down - if they don't, I can't see how we survive in this form.

Ashley will wait to the brink of liquidation after we have sold a few players to get to the end of the season.

All the other EFL clubs IMO want us to sell players. .

In retrospect it’s not wise for Rooney to have touted buying players and not selling any. 
 

I don’t think we will keep Rooney and he’s been brilliant but probably a bit gullible .

Don’t blame him thought at all. 

Edited January 14, 2022 by Curtains

[Indy]

6 minutes ago, LeedsCityRam said:

A day that started with hope that we were about to confirm PB status ends with more misery & one of our best players leaving. Only at this club.

The EFL can openly lie in their statements they are not getting involved but by insisting the matters with Parmo parasite & Waitrose parasite are concluded before we can move to PB status, they are guaranteeing both clubs a settlement without DCFC having the opportunity to fight them. Its an abuse of their power & furthermore the inevitable stalemate is in contravention of insolvency law in not allowing recompense of creditors because of speculative claims with no legal or contractual weight. @i-Ram is completely correct that this needs injunctive relief to force the EFL to back down. Given the additional aggravating factors of conflict of interest within the EFL & their constant shifting of the goalposts throughout the process, Im confident this would be a quick decision in our favour.

We talk about what can be done as fans, crowdfunding legal representation may be a good start. I would say that Mr Morris should be at the head of that queue given his role in this bloody mess.

Does anyone know how quickly an injunction can be served? And what might it allow? Would it enable naming the preferred bidder, taking on the deposit, exiting administration and paying creditors? Could it compel the EFL to substantiate any attempt to not register players (a restraint of trade)?

[Ram-Alf]

Just now, chipperram said:

Where do UEFA or FIFA sit in the football governance/authority scale. Surely the EFL has somebody they are accountable to. If not they are a huge self licking lollipop.

FIFA Governs world football

UEFA Governs European football

Both the above are often at loggerheads, Why, Because Europe is where the money is.

FA lost it's authority when the Premier League was born

EFL were left with the dregs of what was left over

[Ken Tram]

What is liquidation? The end of the club?

Would we then start again as Derby City in a lower League, or can we keep the same name?

Do the Administrators have to take the best offer? Is the value simply what someone will pay for us? Therefore could we be sold for £1 before liquidation becomes an option - or is the minimum acceptable offer going to be the value of assets that can be sold if we went into liquidation?

Edited January 14, 2022 by Ken Tram

[MaltRam]

2 minutes ago, chipperram said:

The thing is there are no cases to settle, just threats to sue us, that is why arbitration is being suggested. Only after arbitration would it go to court. We should just crack on with the take over, Steve Gibson will drop the threat once we have clear owners, he is pushing the administrators, with EFL deference, hoping they will cave in and give him some money or as is more likely string it out until we are no longer competitive in terms of suitable team players. Thus seeing us relegated, his real main aim. Slimy and  manipulative comes to mind.

We can't crack on with the takeover because the EFL say we need to provide proof of funds for the rest of the season.

We can't give that because that Bamford at boro and his septic mate from Wycombe are claiming they are owed compo.

We can't settle those claims because we have no money to pay, and we can't see them in court because no legal claim has been bought.

No one is willing to step up for the £50m it takes to get out of admin and resolve all this because without a legal resolution it might technically take another £50m to pay the bubble haired shitehawk off.

Only the EFL can plot a course through the maelstrom, and they won't without having their feet held to the fire in public, because they are corrupt and ruled by vested interests with an agenda against us.

In short, we the fans are the only hope. Forget RT, they're useless. We need leaders to step up from within, as happened before with the 3 amigos but on a massively larger scale.

I'll join anything, do anything, and I'll find a few quid to help but I'm neither smart or connected enough to lead. Anyone?

Am I missing anything?

[chipperram]

5 minutes ago, Curtains said:

But prospective owners  are unlikely  proceed with the threat hanging over them .

Only Ashley has the clout to save us on the brink of liquidation.

Get to the end of the season by selling a few players in the window and try and sort mess out then 

I agree with your reply, I a must saying that if somebody did take it on they would be doing whilst sticking their fingers up at Gibson.  Theoretically anyone taking over the club would stop it as Gibson wants us relegated not liquidated. 

I do worry what would happen if we were liquidated, I imagine there are some unsavoury characters out there that would make it their aim to destroy Gibson’s property and in general his life difficult etc as retribution. I am certainly not one by the way.

[Philmycock]

2 minutes ago, Ken Tram said:

What is liquidation? The end of the club?

Would we then start again as Derby City in a lower League, or can we keep the same name?

Do the Administrators have to take the best offer? Is the value simply what someone will pay for us? Therefore could we be sold for £1 before liquidation becomes an option - or is the minimum acceptable offer going to be the value of assets that can be sold if we went into liquidation?

Maybe the administrators know the answer ?

[PistoldPete]

42 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Well it’s nice for you to be right sometimes.

I would prefer to be wrong about the EFL. But it seems I am not. 

[MACKWORTHRAM]

Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere.

But does this mean that Boro and Wycombe can legally not sue us until we are out of administration? So effectively the EFL are breaking the law?

[Gaspode]

If the EFL insist the Admins settle the claims before we announce the preferred bidder, they can sort it very quickly - simply write to both parties and tell them that they’ve considered their claims and decided that they have no merit - neither are therefore on the creditors list and the claims can be considered legally settled. We can move on and come out of administration. If the two chancers want to pursue separately they can raise a proper case after we have new owners….. if they have the balls

[Ram-Alf]

3 minutes ago, Needlesh said:

We can't crack on with the takeover because the EFL say we need to provide proof of funds for the rest of the season.

We can't give that because that Bamford at boro and his septic mate from Wycombe are claiming they are owed compo.

We can't settle those claims because we have no money to pay, and we can't see them in court because no legal claim has been bought.

No one is willing to step up for the £50m it takes to get out of admin and resolve all this because without a legal resolution it might technically take another £50m to pay the bubble haired shitehawk off.

Only the EFL can plot a course through the maelstrom, and they won't without having their feet held to the fire in public, because they are corrupt and ruled by vested interests with an agenda against us.

In short, we the fans are the only hope. Forget RT, they're useless. We need leaders to step up from within, as happened before with the 3 amigos but on a massively larger scale.

I'll join anything, do anything, and I'll find a few quid to help but I'm neither smart or connected enough to lead. Anyone?

Am I missing anything?

No summarized very well

[RadioactiveWaste]

2 minutes ago, Ken Tram said:

What is liquidation? The end of the club? Yes

Would we then start again as Derby City in a lower League, or can we keep the same name? We'd be starting in a lower leage from scratch. If the phoenix club buy the rights to the name, they can be Derby County football club (Rangers did this)

Do the Administrators have to take the best offer? Is the value simply what someone will pay for us? Therefore could we be sold for £1 before liquidation becomes an option - or is the minimum acceptable offer going to be the value of assets that can be sold if we went into liquidation? It's a case of what creditors will agree to, and if they think they'd get more from the club being liquidated than they're getting from the take over.

 

[SBW]

5 minutes ago, Needlesh said:

We can't crack on with the takeover because the EFL say we need to provide proof of funds for the rest of the season.

We can't give that because that Bamford at boro and his septic mate from Wycombe are claiming they are owed compo.

We can't settle those claims because we have no money to pay, and we can't see them in court because no legal claim has been bought.

No one is willing to step up for the £50m it takes to get out of admin and resolve all this because without a legal resolution it might technically take another £50m to pay the bubble haired shitehawk off.

Only the EFL can plot a course through the maelstrom, and they won't without having their feet held to the fire in public, because they are corrupt and ruled by vested interests with an agenda against us.

In short, we the fans are the only hope. Forget RT, they're useless. We need leaders to step up from within, as happened before with the 3 amigos but on a massively larger scale.

I'll join anything, do anything, and I'll find a few quid to help but I'm neither smart or connected enough to lead. Anyone?

Am I missing anything?

So the realistic option, as it stands

 

Settle with Boro/Wycombe, and in doing so, add them as 'footballing creditors' and as such they will be owed 100% and the new owner would be liable to those costs?

 

That, or not pay the creditors as should be the case, but then lose 15 points next season? 

 

Outside of Boro/Wycombe backing down, or the EFL deciding all of a sudden a PB can be named without agreeing with Boro/Wycombe, I can't see an alternative?

[RadioactiveWaste]

I'm going to log out until tomorrow and see what the Islay single malt does for my mood.

 

 

[PistoldPete]

5 minutes ago, Ken Tram said:

What is liquidation? The end of the club?

Would we then start again as Derby City in a lower League, or can we keep the same name?

Do the Administrators have to take the best offer? Is the value simply what someone will pay for us? Therefore could we be sold for £1 before liquidation becomes an option - or is the minimum acceptable offer going to be the value of assets that can be sold if we went into liquidation?

Liquidation is not the  end of the club, it would be the end of the Corporate entity that owns the club. . 

Anyway the statement tonight from the admin team does not suggest to me we are close to liquidation of the Company at least not an involuntary liquidation. We have three bidders and a clear legal opinion on a way forward. 

We are at loggerheads with the EFL which we have been in truth for two years now. They are clearly deceitful , incompetent and vindictive. 

But we will survive. We are Derby. 

 

  

[Curtains]

3 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

Liquidation is not the  end of the club, it would be the end of the Corporate entity that owns the club. . 

Anyway the statement tonight from the admin team does not suggest to me we are close to liquidation of the Company at least not an involuntary liquidation. We have three bidders and a clear legal opinion on a way forward. 

We are at loggerheads with the EFL which we have been in truth for two years now. They are clearly deceitful , incompetent and vindictive. 

But we will survive. We are Derby. 

 

  

It will be close but we will survive in some shape or other.

It would appear Wayne wants to see out the season .

I think I’m going to have a JD and relax 

Edited January 14, 2022 by Curtains

[chipperram]

10 minutes ago, Needlesh said:

We can't crack on with the takeover because the EFL say we need to provide proof of funds for the rest of the season.

We can't give that because that Bamford at boro and his septic mate from Wycombe are claiming they are owed compo.

We can't settle those claims because we have no money to pay, and we can't see them in court because no legal claim has been bought.

No one is willing to step up for the £50m it takes to get out of admin and resolve all this because without a legal resolution it might technically take another £50m to pay the bubble haired shitehawk off.

Only the EFL can plot a course through the maelstrom, and they won't without having their feet held to the fire in public, because they are corrupt and ruled by vested interests with an agenda against us.

In short, we the fans are the only hope. Forget RT, they're useless. We need leaders to step up from within, as happened before with the 3 amigos but on a massively larger scale.

I'll join anything, do anything, and I'll find a few quid to help but I'm neither smart or connected enough to lead. Anyone?

Am I missing anything?

 To answer your first 3 paras;

We can crack on, the PB would need to put their deposit in the account first though.

They are only claiming, and seemingly only to us in reality as the EFL are standing off.

Weshouldn’t need the money for the claims, the claim(threat of claims) wouldn’t stand up in court if it got to that.

These are only my views, they may be wrong but they are mine. 

[CornwallRam]

2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Why not? The Admin have said they are confident they can get proof of funding for us to show we can fulfil our games.

Because there are three sources of possible funding

1 - a loan from MSD or similar. I saw a poster earlier calling this a soft loan, which is wrong. These post admin loans are the hardest of loans possible and rank even above the administrator's fee as priority debt. Without the likelihood of a takeover to repay these loans, the administrators would be acting against the interests of the creditors to take out another loan.

2 - funding by a preferred bidder. This can't happen until the EFL sanction it -  and they (currently) won't without us settling with Boro and Wycombe

3 - selling players. This is the only feasible route at present. The problem is that it depletes the assets if we sell and carry on trading - as opposed to selling as many as possible and then quickly liquidating. For the administrators to go down that route they need to be confident that the club will eventually get taken over, and that takeover will bring in more than liquidation. As things stand, I don't think they can argue that, as no takeover is possible.

I'd say they have a few days to get the EFL to change position. If not, liquidation is the best option for the creditors - especially whilst the transfer window is open. 

[SBW]

1 minute ago, chipperram said:

 To answer your first 3 paras;

We can crack on, the PB would need to put their deposit in the account first though.

They are only claiming, and seemingly only to us in reality as the EFL are standing off.

Weshouldn’t need the money for the claims, the claim(threat of claims) wouldn’t stand up in court if it got to that.

These are only my views, they may be wrong but they are mine. 

Q's statement to me read as though they cannot 'crack on' as EFL won't let them name a preferred bidder (EFL have to approve the business plan?) until the Boro/Wycombe claims as resolved? 

[duncanjwitham]

9 minutes ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere.

But does this mean that Boro and Wycombe can legally not sue us until we are out of administration? So effectively the EFL are breaking the law?

The problem is, we aren’t talking about actual legal action, we’re talking about clubs wanting to use the EFLs arbitration process. So it’s not entirely clear that that law is in anyway relevant.