Mel Morris fan club

[Leeds Ram]

3 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

He did a one hour interview with local jouranlists straight after the administration. Met with manager and players.

If he was involved in confidential discussions with EFL and with potential buyers there is very little he could have said.

Yes there has been a lot of over the top criticisms from many sources... some of it quite libellous.  Derby are in a mess for many many reasons, and Mel Morris is only one of those many reasons.

 

 

 

 

Rooney said he found out on the tv in his interview and basically took him to task for how he addressed the players and himself... there was complete radio silence leading up to the administration with people who attended the fan meeting also left in complete shock, that is not open or honest communication by any definition. I haven't read all of the thread but I haven't seen any libellous accusations thus far. 

[Red Ram]

9 hours ago, PistoldPete said:

Exactly. However badly Mel Morris spent his money he knew what his budget was. Until COVID blew his  budgeting plans out of the water.

Then why did HMRC file a winding up order in January 2020, before COVID had even got started?

[PistoldPete]

1 minute ago, Red Ram said:

Then why did HMRC file a winding up order in January 2020, before COVID had even got started?

You mean the order that was settled within four days of it being issued?  The one in january 2020 when he had signed contracts for the club to be taken over so any debts should have been paid by someone else?

[i-Ram]

4 minutes ago, Red Ram said:

Then why did HMRC file a winding up order in January 2020, before COVID had even got started?

I love facts me.

[PistoldPete]

10 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

Rooney said he found out on the tv in his interview and basically took him to task for how he addressed the players and himself... there was complete radio silence leading up to the administration with people who attended the fan meeting also left in complete shock, that is not open or honest communication by any definition. I haven't read all of the thread but I haven't seen any libellous accusations thus far. 

There won't be any libellous accustaions on this thread , our mods are too good for that, but one mainstream journalist for example  accused Morris of getting PPS valued by one of his mates. If that is the sort of ridiculous accusation that is flying around in mainstram media , well you try checking out social media and  see what sort of rubbish is put out there.

[Rev]

39 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

Yes there has been a lot of over the top criticisms from many sources... some of it quite libellous.  Derby are in a mess for many many reasons, and Mel Morris is only one of those many reasons.

One of many reasons?

He's one of two.

His incompetent guardianship, and Covid. What else can you add to the list?

 

[PistoldPete]

11 minutes ago, Rev said:

One of many reasons?

He's one of two.

His incompetent guardianship, and Covid. What else can you add to the list?

 

Oh how long have we got? EFL of course is the biggie missing from your list. All the media assassins. Gibson of course. Maguire. Keogh. Rush,  etc etc 

 

[Rev]

12 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

Oh how long have we got? EFL of course is the biggie missing from your list. All the media assassins. Gibson of course. Maguire. Keogh. Rush,  etc etc 

 

The EFL aren't the reason we can't pay what we owe, might as well lump Gibson in that group too, interested observers, nothing else.

Journalists report as they see fit, I've seen no article that has forced us into administration, and I'd include Maguire in that group.

Keogh and Rush were employees of the club, if their dismissals were legally watertight it wouldn't be a problem, if not that's the clubs fault, not theirs.

So we're left with Covid, and Mel withdrawing his funding.

 

As I said, one of two reasons.

 

 

 

[PistoldPete]

7 minutes ago, Rev said:

The EFL aren't the reason we can't pay what we owe, might as well lump Gibson in that group too, interested observers, nothing else.

Journalists report as they see fit, I've seen no article that has forced us into administration, and I'd include Maguire in that group.

Keogh and Rush were employees of the club, if their dismissals were legally watertight it wouldn't be a problem, if not that's the clubs fault, not theirs.

So we're left with Covid, and Mel withdrawing his funding.

 

As I said, one of two reasons.

 

 

 

EFL have obviously added to our problems in mulitple ways. Having to defend spurious claims about the stadium sale, reputational damage through inaccurate briefings by EFL to the press etc etc .. the list of EFL's wrongdongs is a very long one.  The amortisation issue is also a very marginal issue that if the EFL had really dealt with properly would either have been tackled in 2016 or not at all.  Instead tackling it five years after the event caused us multiple problems, and that case dragged on for far too long which is likely to cause us points deductions just when w ecan least afford them, and more financial woes. It is very likely that the EFL's vendetta against us put off potential buyers and  that of course affected our propects of avoiding administration, and continues to affect our prospects of emerging from it.

Then of course is the fact that their actions caused us to be unable to claim the covid support loan... etc etc.

All in all, I think EFL are already more culpable than Morris and as Morris has now gone we can hardly blame him for any continuing woes that are inflicted on us.. the blame is now firmly pointing at the EFL for anything wrong further that may happen.

 

Similar comments apply to all the keyboard warrior journalists , podcasters , rival club supporters , Gibson and co etc who have made ridiculous exaggerations and blamed Morris and the club of wrongdoing out of all proportion to what has actually happened. That puts off potential buyers , eggs on the EFL and provides self justification for ill judged  disproprtionate and ultimately counter productive  punishments from the EFL.

Keogh and Rush were employees..true.  if Keogh hadn't passed to Zamora none of this would have happened, if as club captain he hadn't led players on a drunken rampage through Allestree we would have been in a better place for sure .As for his £2m million compo well that wasn't Morris fault that's for sure, it's the kangaoo court that awarded it. .  what could Morris have done anyway , paid Keogh millions for sitting on his backside with his self inflicted injury? 

 

And who was it negotiated ridiculous player contracts many of them Wasserman clients? But Sam Rush. Yes Morris signed the cheques, silly fool, but really the whole thing was a mess up with multiple players at fault. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RAM1966]

2 hours ago, hintonsboots said:

There is still a massive amount of information not in the public domain. I think a post mortem of Mel’s tenure should not be started until the new owners are in place. Perhaps then we will have the full story, and be able to comment factually on how he has performed.

That's true here are some facts to be going on with:

Massive debt run up with HMRC - Administrators trying to negotiate with HMRC, this is reportedly employees Income Tax and NI, if those NI contributions are not paid it could affect employees state pension entitlements!!!!

Mel allowed the wage bill to climb to 161% of turnover - That's nothing short of reckless.

Mel has said he's lost £200M - In 6 years that is nothing short of p*ss poor stewardship.  This will only be true if he gives the ground back and writes off all the soft loans!

His choice and trigger finger with Managers in nothing short of shambolic.

His interfering in training sessions and entering the dressing room, displays all the signs of a micro manager, which is even worse when you know sod all about the game.

His communication with the fans has been poor, his final attempt to keep a lid on the fans with his NDA meeting was the final straw for most of us.

His final denial that he had anything to do with Admin and it was all the fault of Covid shows the sign of a man who thinks he's perfect.  We were already in breach of FFP, despite selling the club to himself, the 161% of turnover wage bill was sanctioned by him and ultimately is the main reason we are in the deep poo we are!!!

He's clearly turned a club that was on the brink of entering the premier league into an insolvent business and unless he writes off the soft loans and gifts the ground back we could well go out of business.

Yes we can leave the post mortem until after the deal goes through, but all of the above is a matter of fact and the mans inability to accept any responsibility is quite frankly unbelievable, its also an insult to the Fans of DCFC that he thinks we will swallow all his bullshite!!!    

Edited October 18, 2021 by RAM1966

[PistoldPete]

2 minutes ago, RAM1966 said:

That's true here are some facts to be going on with:

Massive debt run up with HMRC - Administrators trying to negotiate with HMRC, this is reportedly employees Income Tax and NI, if those NI contributions are not paid it could affect employees state pension entitlements!!!!

Mel allowed the wage bill to climb to 161% of turnover - That's nothing short of reckless.

Mel has said he's lost £200M - In 6 years that is nothing short of p*ss poor stewardship.  This will only be true if he gives the ground back and writes off all the soft loans!

His choice and trigger finger with Managers in nothing short of shambolic.

His interfering in training sessions and entering the dressing room, displays all the signs of a micro manager, which is even worse when you know sod all about the game.

His communication with the fans has been poor, his final attempt to keep a lid on the fans with his NDA meeting was the final straw for most of us.

His final denial that he had anything to do with Admin and it was all the fault of Covid shows the sign of a man who thinks he's perfect.

He's clearly turned a club that was on the brink of entering the premier league into an insolvent business and unless he writes off the soft loans and gifts the ground back we could well go out of business.

Yes we can leave the post mortem until after the deal goes through, but all of the above is a matter of fact and the mans inability to accept any responsibility is quite frankly unbelievable, its also an insult to the Fans of DCFC that he thinks we will swallow all his bullshite!!!    

I agree Mel Morris has been reckless, but much of your post is just innuendo. The claim that the most proximate cause of admin is COVID is something that is not being made just by Mel Morris but also the administrators who as insolvency prcationers are better placed to judge than you or I .

I don't think he was trigger happy with managers, in fact two of his managerial appointments were poached by other clubs, and Maclaren was effectively too.

 

etc etc

 

Basically we disagree.

 

 

[Rampage]

2 hours ago, PistoldPete said:

He did a one hour interview with local jouranlists straight after the administration. Met with manager and players.

If he was involved in confidential discussions with EFL and with potential buyers there is very little he could have said.

Yes there has been a lot of over the top criticisms from many sources... some of it quite libellous.  Derby are in a mess for many many reasons, and Mel Morris is only one of those many reasons.

 

 

 

 

Mel is a lifelong Derby County fan as are many of us. 

[jimtastic56]

Very good post by Ram1966. On the income tax issue- MM couldn’t sell DCFC because of the debt to the taxman. So now our fate is in the hands of the taxman . Will he write off the debt? If he does it schools and hospitals that are getting rinsed. It doesn’t make you feel good.

[Rev]

1 minute ago, Rampage said:

Mel is a lifelong Derby County fan as are many of us. 

I doubt many true life long Derby fans would have left the club in the state he has. 

Frankly, I'd see my family on the streets before I left this football club in the state he has. 

He took us on, he pushed the expenditure up, he should cover it until he's personally destitute, otherwise he should have stayed well away.

 

 

 

[hintonsboots]

1 hour ago, RAM1966 said:

That's true here are some facts to be going on with:

Massive debt run up with HMRC - Administrators trying to negotiate with HMRC, this is reportedly employees Income Tax and NI, if those NI contributions are not paid it could affect employees state pension entitlements!!!!

Mel allowed the wage bill to climb to 161% of turnover - That's nothing short of reckless.

Mel has said he's lost £200M - In 6 years that is nothing short of p*ss poor stewardship.  This will only be true if he gives the ground back and writes off all the soft loans!

His choice and trigger finger with Managers in nothing short of shambolic.

His interfering in training sessions and entering the dressing room, displays all the signs of a micro manager, which is even worse when you know sod all about the game.

His communication with the fans has been poor, his final attempt to keep a lid on the fans with his NDA meeting was the final straw for most of us.

His final denial that he had anything to do with Admin and it was all the fault of Covid shows the sign of a man who thinks he's perfect.  We were already in breach of FFP, despite selling the club to himself, the 161% of turnover wage bill was sanctioned by him and ultimately is the main reason we are in the deep poo we are!!!

He's clearly turned a club that was on the brink of entering the premier league into an insolvent business and unless he writes off the soft loans and gifts the ground back we could well go out of business.

Yes we can leave the post mortem until after the deal goes through, but all of the above is a matter of fact and the mans inability to accept any responsibility is quite frankly unbelievable, its also an insult to the Fans of DCFC that he thinks we will swallow all his bullshite!!!    

I rest my case m’lord.

[RAM1966]

1 hour ago, PistoldPete said:

I agree Mel Morris has been reckless, but much of your post is just innuendo. The claim that the most proximate cause of admin is COVID is something that is not being made just by Mel Morris but also the administrators who as insolvency prcationers are better placed to judge than you or I .

I don't think he was trigger happy with managers, in fact two of his managerial appointments were poached by other clubs, and Maclaren was effectively too.

 

etc etc

 

Basically we disagree.

 

 

Yes we do where are the Innuendos in what I have said?  

Yes we may of been able to limp on another year or so if covid had not struck, buy please do not try and make out he was running the club on a sound footing.  He himself said he has lost over £200m, to lose that in 6 years is a disastrous tenure.... 

Now lets get to managers

MacLaren - Sacked (some sympathy on this one)

Clement - Sacked unproven as a manager, he is a good No2 not a decent manager as he's been poor everywhere he has been.

Wassell - Appointed as we were skint (through previous sackings), removed from his post and sent packing back to the academy.

Pearson - Sacked (Mad as a box of frogs and falls out with every chairmen he's ever worked for)

McLaren2 - Sacked (Why go back?)

Rowett - Sold (Poor at best, would have ended up being sacked, boring poor football)

Lampard - Sold (backed his ones season poo or bust plan - Poor Selection at Wembley)

Cocu - Sacked (Massive gamble he couldn't adjust to the English game)

Rooney - Had Mel of been interested in staying on and money available he would have been sacked, thankfully he's turned a corner though

Every manager wants to build there own team - Forgive me for pointing out the bleeding obvious but how many £10ms did they above sackings cost and recruitment of players cost.  He deserves to have sp*nked £200M.

Do you really think his managerial appointments have been good?  If they have, how come with all the money he has spent backing them are we not in the Premier League?  Sacking 5 managers in 6 years is p*ss poor on Mels part as he appointed them!!!!!!

 

 

Edited October 18, 2021 by RAM1966

[Leeds Ram]

3 hours ago, PistoldPete said:

Oh how long have we got? EFL of course is the biggie missing from your list. All the media assassins. Gibson of course. Maguire. Keogh. Rush,  etc etc 

 

oh yeah the EFL, the media assassins and Gibson made us spend recklessly didn't they... 

[kevinhectoring]

2 hours ago, jimtastic56 said:

MM couldn’t sell DCFC because of the debt to the taxman

I think he couldn't sell it because of the ongoing EFL proceedings.  

[PistoldPete]

2 hours ago, Leeds Ram said:

oh yeah the EFL, the media assassins and Gibson made us spend recklessly didn't they... 

You asked for reasons why we were in a mess, not reasons for why we spent recklessly. But yes if EFL had negotiated a fairer tV deal for clubs like Derby, Mel  perhaps wouldn't  have felt the need to spend his own money to compete with teams in receipt of parachute money. The whole set up is not designed for a fair competition, as even Rick Parry has admitted.  

 Which are you, Leeds or a Ram?  

[PistoldPete]

2 hours ago, RAM1966 said:

Yes we do where are the Innuendos in what I have said?  

Yes we may of been able to limp on another year or so if covid had not struck, buy please do not try and make out he was running the club on a sound footing.  He himself said he has lost over £200m, to lose that in 6 years is a disastrous tenure.... 

Now lets get to managers

MacLaren - Sacked (some sympathy on this one)

Clement - Sacked unproven as a manager, he is a good No2 not a decent manager as he's been poor everywhere he has been.

Wassell - Appointed as we were skint (through previous sackings), removed from his post and sent packing back to the academy.

Pearson - Sacked (Mad as a box of frogs and falls out with every chairmen he's ever worked for)

McLaren2 - Sacked (Why go back?)

Rowett - Sold (Poor at best, would have ended up being sacked, boring poor football)

Lampard - Sold (backed his ones season poo or bust plan - Poor Selection at Wembley)

Cocu - Sacked (Massive gamble he couldn't adjust to the English game)

Rooney - Had Mel of been interested in staying on and money available he would have been sacked, thankfully he's turned a corner though

Every manager wants to build there own team - Forgive me for pointing out the bleeding obvious but how many £10ms did they above sackings cost and recruitment of players cost.  He deserves to have sp*nked £200M.

Do you really think his managerial appointments have been good?  If they have, how come with all the money he has spent backing them are we not in the Premier League?  Sacking 5 managers in 6 years is p*ss poor on Mels part as he appointed them!!!!!!

 

 

You say he was trigger happy , yet say Rowett should have been sacked after getting us into the playoffs. How many managers have forest had? Or Watford? Wassell was always a temporary appointment and he is still at the club. 

Stuff about the training ground and so on, pure gossip. 

Maclaren, Wassell, Rowett and Lampard all got Derby into the playoffs where they lost to teams in receipt of parachute money, with much bigger spending than ours. QPR bust the spending limits blatantly way more than we ever did, and both they and Villa spent two to three times our wage bill in order to defeat us in the play off finals.   Rowett went to Stoke because he thought he could do better there than at Derby  as they had more money than us. So how come Stoke finished below Derby the next season?

For all Morris reckless spending we actually overachieved within our budgets when compared to clubs around us who were spending far more. That is what even Rick Parry recognises is the fundamental problem with the Championship,  and that needs to be fixed.