Spanish Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 minute ago, Paul71 said: A few calling for Cocu to go. The number of managers we have had is exactly the reason we are were we are. But yes let's sack another and take more steps backwards. The last time the playing staff really progressed was under clough. Why? because he had a few years. You may have a point but you could gamble on keeping someone who ultimately fails. Blind Retention is no guarantee of success. Choosing the right guy and sticking with it is best but without hindsight how do you know the right horse to back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramarena Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, Paul71 said: A few calling for Cocu to go. The number of managers we have had is exactly the reason we are were we are. But yes let's sack another and take more steps backwards. The last time the playing staff really progressed was under clough. Why? because he had a few years. Someone mentioned on another thread that this situation has been threatening to happen for a few seasons bur we've kept throwing money or loans at it to paper over the cracks and chase for a top 6 spot. This season we have shed a lot of players from the squad and not added enough quality and it shows. It's definitely looking like a transition season and rebuild in the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 57 minutes ago, Rambalin said: Team for Middlesbrough Roos Wisdom. Davies. Beilik. Malone Shinnie Bogle. Dowell. Lawrence Martin. Marriott. Wisdom will strengthen the defence he is defensively better than Bogle. Malone for Lowe not much between them but I think Cocu prefers him at home. Bogle on the right of the three in midfield he started has a winger and being in front of Wisdom should strengthen that flank going both ways. Plus this gets Marriott up top with Martin. This team is a thing of beauty, bless you @Rambalin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 minute ago, Spanish said: You may have a point but you could gamble on keeping someone who ultimately fails. Blind Retention is no guarantee of success. Choosing the right guy and sticking with it is best but without hindsight how do you know the right horse to back Cocu has had 13 games. If you sack him and say bring Hughton in, what do you do if he struggles in his first 13 games? Sack him? At some point we need to grin and bare it but give a Manager some time. Cocu hasn't even had a full transfer window yet. I think the football has been dire, no game plan, don't get the tactics but at some point we need to be patient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 13 minutes ago, Spanish said: You may have a point but you could gamble on keeping someone who ultimately fails. Blind Retention is no guarantee of success. Choosing the right guy and sticking with it is best but without hindsight how do you know the right horse to back A few years of stability, even without success; would be better than swapping managers out every 6-14 months imo. The squad has been on a gradual decline since we swapped Clough for McClaren and then got rid at the first sign of trouble. It's not some incredible coincidence that we've been getting worse year on year while not holding any manager for more than a season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyPowell Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 8 minutes ago, Spanish said: You may have a point but you could gamble on keeping someone who ultimately fails. Blind Retention is no guarantee of success. Choosing the right guy and sticking with it is best but without hindsight how do you know the right horse to back 15 minutes ago, Spanish said: You may have a point but you could gamble on keeping someone who ultimately fails. Blind Retention is no guarantee of success. Choosing the right guy and sticking with it is best but without hindsight how do you know the right horse to back The worst choice would be sacking any manager after 14 games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 1 minute ago, SaintRam said: A few years of stability, even without success; would be better than swapping managers out every 6-14 months imo. The squad has been on a gradual decline since we swapped Clough for McClaren and then got rid at the first sign of trouble. It's not some incredible coincidence that we've been getting worse year on year while not holding any manager for more than a season. Well it partly is. Overall how good has our recruitment been? We got lucky (ha) with Vydra in the end, but the rest of them? Would the managers have had better results with better players recruited, like Lampard last year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 20 minutes ago, Paul71 said: A few calling for Cocu to go. The number of managers we have had is exactly the reason we are were we are. But yes let's sack another and take more steps backwards. The last time the playing staff really progressed was under clough. Why? because he had a few years. I'd be ok with Cocu going if I thought we had someone lined up that would be any more interesting. I'm kind of bored of fresh starts. Bored of believing "This guy seems promising" If we get another manager I'll be less excited for the next game than with Cocu in charge I don't know how anyone can stomach another change. After Clough it was exciting. I was gutted about Mac but I thought shiny new Clement might be the next big thing. 15 coaching teams later the buzz wears off doesn't it? Just give Cocu some transfer windows. I don't even care to see Wembley any time soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S8TY Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 sacking Cocu ??? So a new man comes in...same players ( because beleive it or not you can't bring players in until the transfer window opens )...what will change...nothing! give the manager a chance to get his players in.....any manager would struggle with this lot...as I've said before...write down the whole squad on a bit of paper and have a good look at it !! Keogh,Hudds injured and Wilson,Temori,Johnson,Mount,Bryson,Nugent not around anymore..... its not a great squad I'm afraid ....Frank left us in the lurch......lets get it right....give Cocu time .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silko Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 It’s a way off yet but before we all slash our wrists (totally justified with our showings this year) ... let’s see if he gets anyone in January if nothing happens then we have to query what’s he’s doing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Ram Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 2 hours ago, LazloW said: @Boycie has been quite calm. Looks like he has done some dodgy wiring.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 4 hours ago, GenBr said: In the game against Wigan Malone's crossing was so bad I just assumed there was someone in the upper tier of the crowd that he was trying to hit for some reason. Lowe came on and did more in 5 minutes than Malone did the entire game. Lowe shouldn't have been dropped in the first place and I am glad he has finally got his chance to start in his own position. His crossing was terrible, granted. But he was one of two players that was actually trying to drive the team forward. Much more worrying was the fact that we were relying on our full backs to start any attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramarena Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, Alpha said: I'd be ok with Cocu going if I thought we had someone lined up that would be any more interesting. I'm kind of bored of fresh starts. Bored of believing "This guy seems promising" If we get another manager I'll be less excited for the next game than with Cocu in charge I don't know how anyone can stomach another change. After Clough it was exciting. I was gutted about Mac but I thought shiny new Clement might be the next big thing. 15 coaching teams later the buzz wears off doesn't it? Just give Cocu some transfer windows. I don't even care to see Wembley any time soon! True. It's also been sad to watch the playing staff decline in quality since Mac 1. From Grant Wisdom. Keogh. Bucko. Fozzy Thorne Bryson/Hendrick Hughes Ward Russell Martin To Roos Bogle. Davies. Clarke. Lowe Beilik. Shinnie Holmes. Dowell. Lawrence Martin The only current player that'd make the Mac 1 team is Bogle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yani P Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 This was always coming.. I said before the season started we would struggle down to the ridiculous drawn out Lampard saga.. It screwed up our pre season and gave any new manager no time to plan for the season ahead.. This is what you end with I'm afraid.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 11 minutes ago, Alpha said: Just give Cocu some transfer windows. I don't even care to see Wembley any time soon! That's the worst part of it all though. At least with Frank we thought we'd get some good loans. Will we at least get some 'interesting' foreign players with Cocu? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S8TY Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 I'd personally give Fozzy a start in front of Clarke and would even be tempted to try Wisdom and Fozzy together in under23s games....just a thought as we look poor defensively Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcfcfan1 Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 If we are within 3 pts of rele I wouldnt mind pulis for the rest of the season Dont think I can stomach a rele battle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 24 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Well it partly is. Overall how good has our recruitment been? We got lucky (ha) with Vydra in the end, but the rest of them? Would the managers have had better results with better players recruited, like Lampard last year? Thats all affected by the constant disruption though surely. Also, we didn't actually really have better results last year. We recruited great loanees because we had Lampard and with those truly great Championship players our overall performance within the division was above average, because the rest of our squad was average-below average. We scraped into the playoffs. My point is this, A manager brings someone in, leaves soon after, that player isn't suitable for the next guy and bam waste of money. Or a manager comes in, gets rid of a good player that doesn't suit them (See: Martin, Hughes) and then leaves, leaving us to go back to trying to play to the overall squads strength WITHOUT the best parts of that system. Can also be grateful to Mr.Clement for forcing in a "Madrid" style analytics department for recruitment purposes, and then using those analytics to sign players (at huge cost) he'd clearly never seen play as none of them suited even his style. Don't make the mistake of thinking the recruitment system has been in constant stability this whole time. Different managers want different levels of input; they want it done in different ways; they want different types of players. Plus we had the huge ******* Mr. Rush putting average joes on huge wages too. Stability will just help. Across the board. I like Cocu but frankly I don't care who that stability is with. I said I wanted stability with Lampard, I said I wanted it with ducking Rowett because we need it, damn it! Seems easy enough to me to stick with the guy we have now and if we don't improve ducking suck it up. We aren't going up any time soon whatever we do, I think we've far more chance of bringing that timeline closer with stability than without it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 2 hours ago, Ellafella said: But the Manager keeps picking them. It’s the Manager’s job to pick the team. You can’t defend a manager by saying the players aren’t up to it. If the players aren’t good enough he should be playing youth...which is what apparently Cocu’s brief is. Nobody would moan if the youth lost so long as they left everything on the pitch. Cocu’s current selections don’t seem to give everything and they don’t appear to understand the system..,that to me indicates that Cocu is not the right fit for the job. If that’s the case, another 10 months won’t change it. I'm a big ol' advocate of the youth. But if we replaced everyone who's not up to promotion worthy performances in our squad with youth we would 100% get relegated, cos that's basically the whole team - and our youth isn't that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted October 26, 2019 Share Posted October 26, 2019 9 minutes ago, Ramarena said: True. It's also been sad to watch the playing staff decline in quality since Mac 1. From Grant Wisdom. Keogh. Bucko. Fozzy Thorne Bryson/Hendrick Hughes Ward Russell Martin To Roos Bogle. Davies. Clarke. Lowe Beilik. Shinnie Holmes. Dowell. Lawrence Martin The only current player that'd make the Mac 1 team is Bogle. Not so sure, Wisdom was awesome in his first spell with us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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