TimRam Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, B4ev6is said: Hull never looked like scoring if anything could have 10-0 to derby. Their shooting was wayward at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Andicis said: And yet the extra possession Hull had didn't help them. But they did have six chances away from home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andicis Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 9 minutes ago, RamNut said: But they did have six chances away from home. Penalty, diving header, volley from Grosicki, only 3 chances of note. Where is the need for negativity? We won 5-0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4ev6is Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Thats what i am pointing out and currentley 4th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKRam Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Such a relaxing Saturday watching the scores with a 5-0 under our belts. Sunderland fans streaming out at 0-1..... jeeez 0-2 they're emptying by the thousands. Crazy. Looking forward to Wednesday ripping florist apart and yes I'd like Butters to score if he's playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigmaRam Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, B4ev6is said: I think lawarance will start new striker from shiffield wednesday probley start. I believe Winnall is cup tied so can't play Tuesday mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 5 hours ago, sage said: Dicko hit Carson's chest from 3 yards, Grosicki volleyed over, Dawson headed just wide early on. We are playing a high tempo pressing game with 4 forwards. This will leave us exposed at the back at times. Vydra is a case in point. Scored 2 and buzzed around their box well but gave the ball away several times in our half. Better teams will punish that. 5 hours ago, brady1993 said: The Dicko chance I'm not really counting because at that angle it'd have taken something spectacular to beat Carson and he did well just to get that on target. The grosicki chance is fair enough (I'd forgot about that) but it would have taken a good finish to score. The Dawson chance I must have missed (missed the first 10ish minutes). The point you make about our game plan is apt though, the only times hull looked like the might hurt us was when we they broke through the press of the front 4 and the midfield didn't quite have the pace to back up the press, so the midfield ended up getting cut through because they were caught between sitting and pressing. Fortunately last night the defence was good enough to snuff most of their attacking play out and keep Hull to half chances for the most part. Your point about Vydra giving the ball away i think could apply to a few players last and it was the one real downside for me is that I thought at times we gave the ball away a bit cheaply or tried to force the play a bit too much (and consequently lost possession). Hopefully this improve as players get more accustomed to the playstyle. Like GR said afterwards, we're still a work in progress. Being sloppy in those types of positions is expected so early in the season. I'd rather the likes of Vydra, Weimann & Lawrence lose the ball trying something inventive, instead of a silly 10 yard back pass. I'm sure he's still not 100% happy with the balance in midfield, perhaps a fully fit Thorne will (while not making us a lot more mobile) will be able to plug some of the gaps Hull exploited by his reading of the game. As some have pointed out, we must be either really pedantic, or deluded to how good we should be, if we're picking holes in a 5-0 drubbing of a recently relegated Premiership side. The way we were pressing in the middle 3rd will produce gaps in the other side are quick enough to bypass us, but again, with time, we'll get better at it. On a side note, did Toral actually touch the ball??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Sagan Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 2 hours ago, Ellafella said: Not really...you can't score if you don't have the ball (unless it's Sheff Utd versue Derby) so the more possession the opposition have the less likely you are to score. Logic really...so I'm not totally convinced by not having possession... Very sorry, Ella, but I can't agree. Picking our defeats by three or more goals in the last couple of seasons and checking the BBC stats for our possession: Rams 0-3 Birmingham 59% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35269686 Burnley 4-1 Rams 60% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35340305 Rams 0-3 Hull 59% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36238771 Norwich 3-0 Rams 40% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38433796 (10 men) Brighton 3-0 Rams 56% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/39149498 Brentford 4-0 Rams 49% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/39523067 You'll see in four of those games we dominated possession, one was split evenly and only the game where we played with 10 men did the opposition also see more of the ball. Is this a bizarre and unusual statistic relating to Derby? Picking 11 vs 11 all other high-winning-margin Championship games from this season and giving possession of the losing side: Cardiff 3-0 Villa 65% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40834637 Hull 4-0 Bolton 39% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40970868 Barnsley 3-0 Sunderland 59% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40983504 Millwall 4-0 Norwich 72% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40983497 Rams 5-0 Hull 58% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41119533 Bolton 0 Boro 3 34% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41132802 Leeds 5-0 Burton 31% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41132801 It seems to me that the aberrations are the Bolton and Burton games where these teams are relegation candidates and could not compete in those games. The normal scenario from a large win when teams are more evenly matched is for the opposition to have the lion's share of possession but be picked off chasing the game, as we saw last night. Long may it continue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEL Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, EnigmaRam said: I believe Winnall is cup tied so can't play Tuesday mate Correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Sorry Andy,just seen it was you and not Tom that was leader of the pack (cue @curtains & shangri-las) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 3 hours ago, Warren Hobhead said: Feeling more optimistic after that. So much so I'm off to Barnsley, despite the wife saying I'd promised her a meal that night. Take her with you. Chippy tea on the walk to the ground, footy for pudding. Perfect evening! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, angieram said: Take her with you. Chippy tea on the walk to the ground, footy for pudding. Perfect evening! Come on angie,you know she'll have other ideas for afters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcidaho Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Lawrence reminds me of Beckham in his prime. Bit of a dribble to take it up the pitch, then to deliver great crosses. I agree with others that this will be more fruitful than the Tom Ince way, where he tried to do everything himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiddingsRam Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 7 minutes ago, jcidaho said: Lawrence reminds me of Beckham in his prime. Bit of a dribble to take it up the pitch, then to deliver great crosses. I agree with others that this will be more fruitful than the Tom Ince way, where he tried to do everything himself. Blackman in his prime ? He had about 12 good games for Reading hardly a prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Willow Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 22 minutes ago, jcidaho said: Lawrence reminds me of Beckham in his prime. Bit of a dribble to take it up the pitch, then to deliver great crosses. That's exactly what I've been thinking myself this afternoon, so I went on youtube to watch David Beckham's highlights, but D. Beckham played his crosses slightly differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Willow Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 10 minutes ago, RiddingsRam said: Blackman in his prime ? David Beckham, isn't Nick Blackman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Hobhead Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 4 hours ago, Carl Sagan said: If that's the Rowett style beginning to emerge it was great to watch. Let's hope so. Great pressing and fast attacking full of intent. I also noticed a lot of long forward passes were all along the ground rather than lifted, exactly what I'm watching with Man City now. You felt we could score every time we went forward. Loved the desire of all the strikers. The possession stats some are spouting on here is a nonsense. Once ahead we drew them onto us so we could break quickly and capitalize. I also liked what Rowett said after the match - that he'd told the players it was easier to play like that as a reaction after the Sheff Utd defeat, but he wants them to play like that after we've already won three in a row, and that's how teams stay top of the league. So many times these last few seasons we've gone top, only to get a nosebleed and wilt. Enjoy Barnsley, Warren. Hope Thorne starts to give a selection dilemma. And you'll get to watch Bird's debut. It'll be a second string, but everyone playing on Tuesday now knows they need to up their game to get into starting contention for the league side. Barnsley are no mugs. I'm looking forward to it. I expect a stronger side than GR hinted at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellafella Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 2 hours ago, Carl Sagan said: Very sorry, Ella, but I can't agree. Picking our defeats by three or more goals in the last couple of seasons and checking the BBC stats for our possession: Rams 0-3 Birmingham 59% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35269686 Burnley 4-1 Rams 60% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35340305 Rams 0-3 Hull 59% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36238771 Norwich 3-0 Rams 40% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38433796 (10 men) Brighton 3-0 Rams 56% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/39149498 Brentford 4-0 Rams 49% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/39523067 You'll see in four of those games we dominated possession, one was split evenly and only the game where we played with 10 men did the opposition also see more of the ball. Is this a bizarre and unusual statistic relating to Derby? Picking 11 vs 11 all other high-winning-margin Championship games from this season and giving possession of the losing side: Cardiff 3-0 Villa 65% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40834637 Hull 4-0 Bolton 39% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40970868 Barnsley 3-0 Sunderland 59% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40983504 Millwall 4-0 Norwich 72% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40983497 Rams 5-0 Hull 58% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41119533 Bolton 0 Boro 3 34% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41132802 Leeds 5-0 Burton 31% http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41132801 It seems to me that the aberrations are the Bolton and Burton games where these teams are relegation candidates and could not compete in those games. The normal scenario from a large win when teams are more evenly matched is for the opposition to have the lion's share of possession but be picked off chasing the game, as we saw last night. Long may it continue! Very good Carl! So you've found about 13 games that match your argument. But let's see now, how many teams are there in the English League system - about 96 and they play 40 odd games per season so that's about 4,000 games. So you think assessing 13 games that you "looked up" (not even a random sample) is statistically representative of all football league games? I don't think so...I would be very surprised if possession didn't account for at least 15-20% of the variance in winning outcomes. A simple chi square analysis would probably do, but for predictive power it would have to be a multiple regression analysis. If I find the time I might do the work and see what comes out...bashing in the data from WhoScored.com might be a bit of a ball-ache but running the multiple regression through SPSS wouldn't take long. It's probably already been done and featured in The Numbers Game so that may help, but 13 games selected by your "biased" curiosity would not cut the scientific mustard and convince a statistician that your findings are robust, reliable or have any predictive validity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 I see the treetards did well with their 56% of possession today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BondJovi Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 I used to love how much possession we had. I grew to despair at our cbs and keeper playing keep ball. When we did finally move forward the opposition were all set and ready. It is all about tempo. Move it quickly and move it with purpose and things happen. I admired Barcelona but it bored the hell out of me. If Hull was a sign of what Rowett wants then I greatly look forward to the rest of the season. I get the feeling some people are looking for problems, not got time for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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