Gritstone Ram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 9 minutes ago, Duracell said: Have a feeling that if we finish in the top 6 (which, for the record, I don't think we will), some posters will be saying it's only because there were 18 teams worse than us. Something's up if your team won 5-0 and your first thought is to tell everyone how it wasn't actually that good. It wasn't the overall performance it was that in parts of the match it was blatantly obvious that there were big holes in our midfield. Hulls bad finishing masked over the deficiencies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boycie Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, David said: I was looking for you seeing as you didn’t turn up for work last night I was doing research, as watching at home isn't the same as being there. You don't see the same game from your armchair. @Bris Vegas is the casing point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, hkrammm said: I would put Wisdom back in place of Davies, who again is unimpressive as some posters have pointed out. Baird, on the other hand, deserves to keep his shirt. Personally I think it is down to who we are facing. Wisdom is younger, stronger and probably the better all round bet but Baird is a fantastic player to have around. I thought he was magnificent last night against the players I expected to threaten most. He won't play 40 games but if he plays 10 like that then I'd be a happy man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistaram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 2 hours ago, Ellafella said: Who doesn't enjoy 5-0 at home? It was great...the most enjoyable thing for me was the outpouring of atmosphere from the fans. Pride Park was banging and rocking...great stuff.... BUT....Hull had the lion's share of possession, more corners, less fouls, more shots. They should have scored 3 goals and could have had 4/5 too. So, Derby well done but I'm still not convinced by the game plan...We gave Hull the middle of the park; quite often when the ball broke loose in midfield there was no white shirt to pick it up but there usually was a Hull player. Yes it was exciting and quick and Vydra's goals were superb; Lawrence looked very good (except for the rugby tackle to give Hull the penalty...Carson and the South Stand combined well with strange voodoo like movement to put the hoodoo on the Hull taker who aimed it for the moon) but Hull's defence was like a dish of butter in front of a roaring coal fire... conclusion...we were "at it" after the Sheffield debacle and Hull turned up in their smoking jackets and pince nez after hammering Bolton. still a long way to go and we still don't have a midfield. Ella " Hull had the lions share of possession " To much emphasis on possession hence why were still in this division Millwall 23%possession Norwich 77% Millwall4 Norwich 0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, Gritters said: It wasn't the overall performance it was that in parts of the match it was blatantly obvious that there were big holes in our midfield. Hulls bad finishing masked over the deficiencies. It's easy to see why Gary was so disappointed to lose out on 'Keith'. Those of us of a certain vintage will easily remember that silky smooth Everton midfield of Harvey,Kendall,Ball (flowed off the tongue as easily as Best,Law,Charlton). However,there was another excellent,but totally different Everton midfield to follow,fronted by Peter Reid.Peter,an excellent footballer to boot, would quickly get about the pitch and be in the face of opponents.If he couldn't nick the ball himself,he'd hold play up until the rest of the pack arrived,whereupon the opponent would be devoured.Whenever I see wildlife programmes featuring packs in action, I always think back to Peter Reid.We saw a bit of the thing I'm getting at in the build up to Bradder's second,with Tom being the pack leader and Nuge quickly joining in.Snarl,panic. If Keith were the quickest 'closer down' in the Championship,then he was obviously going to be our Peter Reid. The pack mentality would be part of the aggression that Gary likes to talk about a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellafella Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 hour ago, ramblur said: I'd like to give Baird a special mention.The highlights I saw showed him in possession,clearly surveying the scene ahead for options,and then pinging an absolute peach of a long diagonal ball almost to the edge of the box.I'm sure he played another similar ball in the game,unless I'm imagining the same thing twice.He seems to be playing both completely relaxed (which you have to be,to play any sport really well) and well motivated,a sometimes tricky combination that,imo,Mason has to try to master.If you get either badly wrong it can be a disaster (Gascoigne,FA Cup).In the current set up,I'd have no qualms about playing him in midfield,if the need arose.The guy's obviously a good footballer. I feel really sorry for him,in that during the latter years of his career it's only natural that he'd be wanting as much game time as possible,which he probably won't get,without injuries.To his credit,he comes in when needed and gives it his all,with a fair amount of skill,so it's a very big thank you to Chris from me.I hope we have good runs in the cups,hopefully continuing our journey in one on Tuesday.If only I could believe in fairy tales,Chris could be captaining 2 winning Rams sides to victory at Wembley,in the same competition. To get thumped by better class opposition,they'd have to heavily outscore us,and I can't see that happening if we carry on in the same vein as last night.Also,you have to factor in Gary saying that there's still a lot to work on.If this is work in progress,I for one can't wait to see the finished article. Agree about Baird. Wisdom (not Andre but the faculty) and maturity in abundance. never panics, has intelligence. Nothing fancy but sublime perception and slide-rule passing skills. Doesn't even look like a footballer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellafella Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 minute ago, ramblur said: It's easy to see why Gary was so disappointed to lose out on 'Keith'. Those of us of a certain vintage will easily remember that silky smooth Everton midfield of Harvey,Kendall,Ball (flowed off the tongue as easily as Best,Law,Charlton). However,there was another excellent,but totally different Everton midfield to follow,fronted by Peter Reid.Peter,an excellent footballer to boot, would quickly get about the pitch and be in the face of opponents.If he couldn't nick the ball himself,he'd hold play up until the rest of the pack arrived,whereupon the opponent would be devoured.Whenever I see wildlife programmes featuring packs in action, I always think back to Peter Reid.We saw a bit of the thing I'm getting at in the build up to Bradder's second,with Tom being the pack leader and Nuge quickly joining in.Snarl,panic. If Keith were the quickest 'closer down' in the Championship,then he was obviously going to be our Peter Reid. The pack mentality would be part of the aggression that Gary likes to talk about a lot. Lovely analogy that encapsulates exactly what GR's plan is. Group behind the ball when out of possession, then hunt like a pack of wild hungry dogs when the ball breaks to us...speed, ruthlessness and hunger and fire and rip the opposition's flesh off their bones and drink the warm dripping blood, taste their entrails...that sort of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritstone Ram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, ramblur said: It's easy to see why Gary was so disappointed to lose out on 'Keith'. Those of us of a certain vintage will easily remember that silky smooth Everton midfield of Harvey,Kendall,Ball (flowed off the tongue as easily as Best,Law,Charlton). However,there was another excellent,but totally different Everton midfield to follow,fronted by Peter Reid.Peter,an excellent footballer to boot, would quickly get about the pitch and be in the face of opponents.If he couldn't nick the ball himself,he'd hold play up until the rest of the pack arrived,whereupon the opponent would be devoured.Whenever I see wildlife programmes featuring packs in action, I always think back to Peter Reid.We saw a bit of the thing I'm getting at in the build up to Bradder's second,with Tom being the pack leader and Nuge quickly joining in.Snarl,panic. If Keith were the quickest 'closer down' in the Championship,then he was obviously going to be our Peter Reid. The pack mentality would be part of the aggression that Gary likes to talk about a lot. I would give you two likes if I could. You have got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritstone Ram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 minute ago, Ellafella said: Lovely analogy that encapsulates exactly what GR's plan is. Group behind the ball when out of possession, then hunt like a pack of wild hungry dogs when the ball breaks to us...speed, ruthlessness and hunger and fire and rip the opposition's flesh off their bones and drink the warm dripping blood, taste their entrails...that sort of thing. Don't leave any scraps for the Vultures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigmaRam Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 9 minutes ago, Ellafella said: Lovely analogy that encapsulates exactly what GR's plan is. Group behind the ball when out of possession, then hunt like a pack of wild hungry dogs when the ball breaks to us...speed, ruthlessness and hunger and fire and rip the opposition's flesh off their bones and drink the warm dripping blood, taste their entrails...that sort of thing. Blimey someone's got a dark side!! ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 33 minutes ago, Gritters said: It wasn't the overall performance it was that in parts of the match it was blatantly obvious that there were big holes in our midfield. Hulls bad finishing masked over the deficiencies. The thing is though did hull have that many 'genuine' chances ? Bar the penalty I can only really think of the diving header (when we already comfortable 5 up). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richinspain Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Didn't watch the game unfortunately (this will probably be the first game I watch the full 90 minutes when it's uploaded), but from the comments this was exactly the type of performance I was expecting from a GR team. I said weeks ago that I had plenty of hope for this coming season, and that hoof ball was not something I expected to see. Although GR was a bald eagle player he reminds me more of Arthur Cox. Win your individual battles and allow your extra quality to shine through! We've seen for the past 3 or 4 seasons what possession for possession's sake can bring. Possession alone certainly doesn't bring points. You have to have end product as well. Going back to Arthur Cox, he built a side based on the same principles that GR is now applying: the right player in the right system. He slowly improved on each individual player until he managed to get us to 5th in the old first division. The principal however remained. Work hard, win your individual battles for the team and then let your individual talent take over. I don't know if possession figures exist from his time, but I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't very similar to what GR's team will be looking like. I personally prefer this type of football. Quick and incisive. 3, 2, or even 1 pass and defence is suddenly turned into a scoring opportunity. Dean Saunders seemed to like it too! Barcelona's tiki taki football is great, but they've got (or at least had) about £400 million worth of strikers to stick the ball into the net. I don't think we'll be playing with the same amount on quality and success as last night for the next 40 games, but at least I think it'll be more exciting than the last couple of seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Just now, brady1993 said: The thing is though did hull have that many 'genuine' chances ? Bar the penalty I can only really think of the diving header (when we already comfortable 5 up). Dicko hit Carson's chest from 3 yards, Grosicki volleyed over, Dawson headed just wide early on. We are playing a high tempo pressing game with 4 forwards. This will leave us exposed at the back at times. Vydra is a case in point. Scored 2 and buzzed around their box well but gave the ball away several times in our half. Better teams will punish that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworthram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 2 hours ago, Ellafella said: Who doesn't enjoy 5-0 at home? It was great...the most enjoyable thing for me was the outpouring of atmosphere from the fans. Pride Park was banging and rocking...great stuff.... BUT....Hull had the lion's share of possession, more corners, less fouls, more shots. They should have scored 3 goals and could have had 4/5 too. So, Derby well done but I'm still not convinced by the game plan...We gave Hull the middle of the park; quite often when the ball broke loose in midfield there was no white shirt to pick it up but there usually was a Hull player. Yes it was exciting and quick and Vydra's goals were superb; Lawrence looked very good (except for the rugby tackle to give Hull the penalty...Carson and the South Stand combined well with strange voodoo like movement to put the hoodoo on the Hull taker who aimed it for the moon) but Hull's defence was like a dish of butter in front of a roaring coal fire... conclusion...we were "at it" after the Sheffield debacle and Hull turned up in their smoking jackets and pince nez after hammering Bolton. still a long way to go and we still don't have a midfield. I'm not disputing that fact that Hull were poor and we're far from the finished article but, how do you define lions share? I would hardly call 58% v 42% lions share (which implies they dominated). Also, more shots? only 3 more and some of those (including the penalty) were so wayward they barely count. Finally, yes they had some very good goal scoring chances and, on another day would have bagged a couple but, don't forget, we scored 5 and their keeper also pulled off a couple of fantastic saves. So, in summary, I an generally agreeing, it could have been a different story and I'm certainly not getting carried away but some of the stats you are quoting (number of fouls?) paint a much more negative picture than is appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 16 minutes ago, ramblur said: It's easy to see why Gary was so disappointed to lose out on 'Keith'. Those of us of a certain vintage will easily remember that silky smooth Everton midfield of Harvey,Kendall,Ball (flowed off the tongue as easily as Best,Law,Charlton). However,there was another excellent,but totally different Everton midfield to follow,fronted by Peter Reid.Peter,an excellent footballer to boot, would quickly get about the pitch and be in the face of opponents.If he couldn't nick the ball himself,he'd hold play up until the rest of the pack arrived,whereupon the opponent would be devoured.Whenever I see wildlife programmes featuring packs in action, I always think back to Peter Reid.We saw a bit of the thing I'm getting at in the build up to Bradder's second,with Tom being the pack leader and Nuge quickly joining in.Snarl,panic. If Keith were the quickest 'closer down' in the Championship,then he was obviously going to be our Peter Reid. The pack mentality would be part of the aggression that Gary likes to talk about a lot. I think it's the one thing we are missing at the minute, the midfield can't quite back up the pressing from the front 4. A couple of times last night Hull broke through the press of the front 4 and then were immediately at the defence because Huddlestone/Johnson weren't quite quick enough to properly close down so ended up caught in no man's land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 11 minutes ago, Ellafella said: Lovely analogy that encapsulates exactly what GR's plan is. Group behind the ball when out of possession, then hunt like a pack of wild hungry dogs when the ball breaks to us...speed, ruthlessness and hunger and fire Our chief weapon is surprise... surprise and fear...fear and surprise.... Our two weapons are surprise and fear.....and ruthless efficiency.... Our three weapons are fear, and surprise, and ruthless efficiency....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 1 minute ago, sage said: Dicko hit Carson's chest from 3 yards, Grosicki volleyed over, Dawson headed just wide early on. We are playing a high tempo pressing game with 4 forwards. This will leave us exposed at the back at times. Vydra is a case in point. Scored 2 and buzzed around their box well but gave the ball away several times in our half. Better teams will punish that. The Dicko chance I'm not really counting because at that angle it'd have taken something spectacular to beat Carson and he did well just to get that on target. The grosicki chance is fair enough (I'd forgot about that) but it would have taken a good finish to score. The Dawson chance I must have missed (missed the first 10ish minutes). The point you make about our game plan is apt though, the only times hull looked like the might hurt us was when we they broke through the press of the front 4 and the midfield didn't quite have the pace to back up the press, so the midfield ended up getting cut through because they were caught between sitting and pressing. Fortunately last night the defence was good enough to snuff most of their attacking play out and keep Hull to half chances for the most part. Your point about Vydra giving the ball away i think could apply to a few players last and it was the one real downside for me is that I thought at times we gave the ball away a bit cheaply or tried to force the play a bit too much (and consequently lost possession). Hopefully this improve as players get more accustomed to the playstyle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malagaram Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Hope you feel well soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramarena Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 Can we deduct 3 goals from our tally please? 2-0 would be much better seeing as our possession stats weren't too high and hull had a couple of chances that they fluffed. Maybe we should only take 2 points instead of all three as well......much better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted McMinn Football Genius Posted September 9, 2017 Share Posted September 9, 2017 There's a funny thing going on around us Rams fans at the moment and I would liken it to "Every silver lining has a cloud" We win 5-0 yet some are still not happy, I'm not a happy clapper by any means but the constant negativity is tiring! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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