Derby v Cheltenham (A) Match Thread

[derbydaz22]

18 minutes ago, Ramzabac said:

Nope..slept on it and I am still furious about yesterday’s match. I rarely comment on this forum, but I enjoy the comments and banter. Living just outside Cheltenham, this game is a bit special for us, with some of us living within walking distance of Whaddon Road and rarely being able to get tickets for away games. So we had 6 seats in the Cheltenham fans. 

Furious, because for the first 20 minutes of the second half Max Bird ran the game from central midfield and we had Cheltenham on the ropes. Then inexplicably Bird gets moved forward to the number 10 role to accommodate the ineffective Hourihane. After that we should still have won it against such poor opposition, but to move Bird was tactically inept and made us less effective.

100% agree Bird was a class above when he came on running the game from deep so what does Warne do ? Move him further forward to get Hourihane on the pitch. I just don’t get it.

[Ghost of Clough]

2 hours ago, IlsonDerby said:

This was the case 1 division above us until Bielsa took over at Leeds. They were a crap championship team and without much investment turned into a competitive (in the lower regions) premier league side. 
 

Obviously it’s extreme as it’s Bielsa but just showing that a team can be so so much better than their current offering. 

They had a £46m wage bill in their promotion season, which was higher than our peak spend under Rowett/Lampard

[Caerphilly Ram]

18 minutes ago, Jayram said:

Mate I was there yesterday and we did not play through the middle. When Bird came on he started to link up play but only out to the wings as per usual but then he got moved; there was absolutely no creativity in that middle. Warne even confirmed that he did not intend to play through midfield in his prickly post match interview. The performance wasn’t great against the worst team in this division by a country mile. In the cold light of day no other team in this division would be happy with either the performance or the result yesterday.

See this is another example of that extreme hyperbole that goes on without much balance. I think plenty of teams in this league would be happy to get a point away from home.

I didn’t say we, as Derby County fans or the club itself should be “happy with the result”, I also didn’t say we should be happy with the performance. What I did say is it’s nowhere near as a bad a performance as some are making it out to be. I get that Warne isn’t everyone’s choice, I understand why people aren’t enjoying some of the football this season, but yesterday we had plenty of possession, there were passes between blue shirts, and we had plenty of shots that were either poorly executed or well saved. It is a frustrating result, it’s 2 points dropped against a team we should have beaten, it’s not the worst we’ve played this season by a long distance. 

[Elwood P Dowd]

33 minutes ago, The Last Post said:

Not a dig just an observation, All games are winnable...but...Cambridge and Cheltenham decided to be party poopers.

Shrewsbury, Exeter, Stevenage and Northampton are the games left in October, 3 of those teams have poor results in their last 6 games, Stevenage with Evens in charge will be a battle that our lot had better be aware of and prepared for.

Once Cheltenham scored they were happy with the point they turned their home game into a “home game” problem for us.
 

Cheltenham, once they that scored, played in the same way that Cambridge did in our last home game and we find very difficult to break down teams that just sit back and defend.

Our good away form is based on counter attacking teams not breaking down packed defences, we need to find an answer to breaking down defences. 

Answers on a postcard to

Mr P Warne , Derby County, Pride Park, Derby

😂😂😂

Edited October 8, 2023 by Elwood P Dowd

[nottingram]

It does make me chuckle that some are forced into defending being negative when we have just drawn to what may be the worst ever team at this level who have not scored a single goal this season. And you then have to listen to the manager say he didn’t think we could play through them which just beggars belief really.

You can only write off so many results like yesterday, or Cambridge, or Wigan who are finding their level, before you find yourself stuck in a position you don’t want to be wondering how it happened. I would love to have the faith some do that things will get better but we are a year in now and I don’t think we’re better than the day he walked through the door. Our best player will leave for either nothing in the summer or next to nothing in January. 

[derbydaz22]

3 minutes ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

See this is another example of that extreme hyperbole that goes on without much balance. I think plenty of teams in this league would be happy to get a point away from home.

I didn’t say we, as Derby County fans or the club itself should be “happy with the result”, I also didn’t say we should be happy with the performance. What I did say is it’s nowhere near as a bad a performance as some are making it out to be. I get that Warne isn’t everyone’s choice, I understand why people aren’t enjoying some of the football this season, but yesterday we had plenty of possession, there were passes between blue shirts, and we had plenty of shots that were either poorly executed or well saved. It is a frustrating result, it’s 2 points dropped against a team we should have beaten, it’s not the worst we’ve played this season by a long distance. 

It’s not hyperbole we should be beating the worst side in the division by some distance and the worst thing for me is when we do try and play a bit of football we create chances so why don’t we get the football on the floor more ?

[Caerphilly Ram]

2 minutes ago, derbydaz22 said:

It’s not hyperbole we should be beating the worst side in the division by some distance and the worst thing for me is when we do try and play a bit of football we create chances so why don’t we get the football on the floor more ?

It is hyperbole to say “no other team in this division would be happy with the performance or result yesterday”. Plenty of other teams in this league would be happy to go away from home, dominate the game against their opponents, and have a point to take home. 

 

[Guest]

I think he's been bought time for a multitude of reasons - our status as a club 18 months ago, his record in this division and his warm fuzzy nature seems to make people want him to succeed, therefore award  him time, more than a Nigel Pearson esc personality.

It's difficult as a fan of any team to know what they should think such is the narrative around being told how we should think in football and life generally. To me, ultimately it comes down to results and in the absence of them consistently, an identity or style that gives you assurance that results are round the corner. As the table suggests, results have hardly been terrible or relegation form but that doesn't appease me in any way that this club is going in the right direction under his stewardship. We are existing and there seems to be some kind of acceptable amongst some that is fine 'because yeah but 18 months ago' 

[NottsRam77]

5 minutes ago, derbydaz22 said:

It’s not hyperbole we should be beating the worst side in the division by some distance and the worst thing for me is when we do try and play a bit of football we create chances so why don’t we get the football on the floor more ?

You Have to earn the right to play football.

i would have thought in this league that probably applies even more so

i remember robbie savage describing the midfield area in the champioship as “a battle ground” 

hes right u have to do the hard graft and te nasty stuff before u earn the right to play

Of course there are other ways to play .. keep the ball, if they dont have it they cat harm u etc but thats not warnes philosophy so it is what it is 

[derbydaz22]

2 minutes ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

It is hyperbole to say “no other team in this division would be happy with the performance or result yesterday”. Plenty of other teams in this league would be happy to go away from home, dominate the game against their opponents, and have a point to take home. 

 

Teams looking to get promotion will not be happy with a point at Cheltenham for Gods sake.

[angieram]

I think the point people are making about yesterday is that although we didn't do too badly playing the way we were set up, some of us feel we could have done so much better with a midfield three and playing football on the ground more. 

Cheltenham are poor. 

 

[derbydaz22]

1 minute ago, NottsRam77 said:

You Have to earn the right to play football.

i would have thought in this league that probably applies even more so

i remember robbie savage describing the midfield area in the champioship as “a battle ground” 

hes right u have to do the hard graft and te nasty stuff before u earn the right to play

Of course there are other ways to play .. keep the ball, if they dont have it they cat harm u etc but thats not warnes philosophy so it is what it is 

So we just have to accept this football and just pretend everything is ok?

[derbydaz22]

1 minute ago, angieram said:

I think the point people are making about yesterday is that although we didn't do too badly playing the way we were set up, some of us feel we could have done so much better with a midfield three and playing football on the ground more. 

Cheltenham are poor. 

 

100%

[Ghost of Clough]

29 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

At times it's like he's watching a completely different game and he's rarely able to justify his answers with any quantitative or strong qualitative analysis. It always reminds me of someone who's been caught out not doing their background research and saying something on the fly. 

There was an interview earlier this season. I can't remember the exact wording but it was along the lines of "when at Rotherham and playing away, he could tell the interviewer they played well because there weren't as many eyes watching the football on show". 

It seems he's still trying that same approach with us. It may also explain why we're doing worse at home. He's feeling the pressure to get us playing better football, which he is seemingly incapable of coaching into the players.

[Foreveram]

12 hours ago, oodledoodle said:

Absolute rubbish. Some of them were on Pepsi.

They definitely weren’t.

[vonwright]

1 hour ago, SSD said:

He seemed far too happy about a point gained and protecting the unbeaten run. 

Unbeaten runs are so over-rated. Wins are what matters. 

Better to win one and lose one than to draw two.

 

[On the Ram Page]

1 hour ago, Leeds Ram said:

In my professional environment I behave very differently from what I do on this forum as you might expect. This after all, is an ultimately anonymous social setting where we can be combative. We are not acting in a professional capacity representing the club or arguably fighting for our job. If the manager can't give an adequate explanation as to why he's not playing one of our best attacking players that is a cause for concern. If he can't field a simple tactical question without his back getting up that also makes me wonder is he like this if his players disagree? If so, how does that make them feel? I would say when Warne gets questions asking about tactics and selections he gets more prickly than a lot of other managers we've had tbh in their post-match pressers from what I remember. 

Thanks for proving me right. I’d prefer you to act in a professional way on this forum.

[HorsforthRam]

Last Friday I wrote the following on the Blackpool away thread:

I didn’t see this match. I’ve seen all our games either live or on RamsTV. Had a commitment to watch Harrogate v Wimbledon on the night but kept up to date on here and friends match day chat on WhatsApp.  I read this thread after the game and a few days after that and also watched the highlights on RamsTV. 
 

Had some time today so watched the whole of the second half, which was the one to watch according to most comments. Unfortunately, after having read the comments, I expected to see more expansive play and passing from us. Bar the moves for the goals, it was mostly Blackpool. We looked solid enough but all our long clearances fell to them and we didn’t keep the ball very long at all. Our best bit of passing was at 1-2 just after Barks had a chance to make it 3 and that passage of play went for a corner. 
Great win against a rival and a side unbeaten at home but I really expected a bit more football after having read this thread. Nevertheless, I hope it fosters some confidence going into the next game. 

IMO, we weren’t “amazing” against Blackpool. It was largely the same yesterday. We don’t look after the ball in the system and style we play and it’s a tedious watch. 

[Shuff264]

The football is really turgid stuff, first half was dreadful.

So incredibly one dimensional, get it out wide and hope the winger can beat the full back and cross.

No plan for if that doesn't work, seemingly full backs are being told not to overlap and we aren't trying to progress play through the middle.

Early subs made sense and did improve us but he lost the plot towards the end.

Bird had a big impact playing from deep, when he got pushed further forward he got crowded out, I thought the obvious change would have been Smith off (who'd had a poor game) and drop Bird back in with Sibley at 10.

The change to a back 3 and bringing Washington on absolutely killed us and Cheltenham could've had a winner.

We need to be vastly more creative and actually attempt to score goals in ways other than crosses and set pieces, but I don't see this changing.

Think Warne is a little bit lucky that  there is no home game next weekend, a bad result there would have gone down very poorly.

[Leeds Ram]

9 minutes ago, On the Ram Page said:

Thanks for proving me right. I’d prefer you to act in a professional way on this forum.

Well, I'd prefer you not to tell me how to post on a social forum.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Leeds Ram