Derby v Cheltenham (A) Match Thread

[May Contain Nuts]

No team with aspirations to finish higher than 12th would have been happy with our performance and/or result. Any better?

I've just watched the highlights myself and was expecting the chances missed (2nd half) to be easier than they were, tbh.

Barkhuizen - Results from a cross. The ball's a few inches too far behind him to be able to get his foot properly behind it, just under. Difficult

Bird - Results from a cross. It's a half volley from outside the area with a packed box. Would have to have been a great goal but not a clear chance. 

Çollins - Results from a cross. It's a thigh-height volley from a ball played slightly behind him and at speed. Similar to his Carlisle goal but the ball was moving quicker. Would have needed a very good finish, or a lucky bounce.

Çollins 2 - First bit of passing football on show where the opposition have to move around and leave gaps. Ultimately still results from a cross. Should have scored but very good goalkeeping to close down the space and angles quickly. "On another day" the ball hits the underside of the keeper's leg and goes in, from an identical finish.

Çollins 3 - Nearly the perfect Warne goal. Starts with a long ball, a couple of clever touches / passes in the middle of the pitch (heaven forbid) to a striker running onto the ball. Good first touch by Collins but the defender sticks to his task well, has the wherewithall to stick a leg out and make it a difficult strike. If Collins hits it in the optimal place for the ball to end up in the net, it hits that leg, so he has to hit the ball higher and bend it more than than he'd want. Not easy.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Foreveram]

12 hours ago, angieram said:

Back from the match. On the booing, it seemed to come from some fans behind the goal. There was none near us on the side, Warne was walking across towards us but the minute he heard it he turned tail and went back towards the dugout. 

I don't think it was many, tbh, but I was a fair way from where it seemed to be coming from.

I was a bit disappointed with the team selection when we were back to two in midfield, after it worked so well at Blackpool.

Also Wilson out, he missed a couple of chances midweek, but he looked really creative, and just remind me how many goals has Mendez-Laing scored this season? Was pleased to see Barkhuizen get a well-deserved start, though. I'd have dropped ML. Where has that confident finishing from this time last season gone?

I don't think Collins and Waghorn work well together either, but that might be because I want to see a genuine number 10 in there instead.

I thought we worked hard, it was very warm. They got away with a lot of physical contact and a lot of play-acting. Fozzy particularly looked shattered at the end. 

I thought the whole team was lifted when Bird came on but would have liked to see him with Smith and Fornah, because it continued to leave us very vulnerable on the counter with just two in there. Yes, I know he made that mistake for their goal, but thought he was doing okay otherwise.

Bird just oozes class though, and was making such a difference. What a shame we then moved him to make room for Hourihane, who offered little. Would the goal have come if we didn't? Probably not.

Today there was lots of effort, little class (Bird and Barks apart) and a bit of confusion about where each other ought to be in the box. Should this keep happening so far into the season? Felt like a step backwards after Tuesday's promise.

The booing came from the usual suspects, who got into the ground just after kickoff, spent most of the game arguing with the stewards or trying to chat up one young steward who wasn’t remotely interested, standing on the stairways despite repeatedly being asked to move and chanting we’re Derby County we do as we want.

Several of them stood directly on the barrier and behind the goal blocking the view of anyone on the front row, by this time the stewards had just given up.

If you asked them for a summary of the game they wouldn’t have a clue, but then booing at the end because we didn’t win.

Still, their opinion matters, right.

[Foreveram]

12 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

And yet there are enough examples of a good manager getting better results out of a squad players than the previous manager, are there not?

Nice to hear from you again, I was quite worried when you were absent from the pages of our recent victory.☺️

[alram]

11 minutes ago, Shuff264 said:

The football is really turgid stuff, first half was dreadful.

So incredibly one dimensional, get it out wide and hope the winger can beat the full back and cross.

No plan for if that doesn't work, seemingly full backs are being told not to overlap and we aren't trying to progress play through the middle.

Early subs made sense and did improve us but he lost the plot towards the end.

Bird had a big impact playing from deep, when he got pushed further forward he got crowded out, I thought the obvious change would have been Smith off (who'd had a poor game) and drop Bird back in with Sibley at 10.

The change to a back 3 and bringing Washington on absolutely killed us and Cheltenham could've had a winner.

We need to be vastly more creative and actually attempt to score goals in ways other than crosses and set pieces, but I don't see this changing.

Think Warne is a little bit lucky that  there is no home game next weekend, a bad result there would have gone down very poorly.

I think warne is lucky in general, I don’t think we deserve the amount of points we have got so far this season

 

but better to be lucky than good I suppose

[Tyler Durden]

1 hour ago, Leeds Ram said:

At times it's like he's watching a completely different game and he's rarely able to justify his answers with any quantitative or strong qualitative analysis. It always reminds me of someone who's been caught out not doing their background research and saying something on the fly. 

It's interesting that you're advocate of quantitative and qualitative analysis on one hand but on the other you mention Warne subjectively being more prickly in post match interviews (however that is quantitatively defined is beyond me) than other Derby managers according to your memory.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Tyler Durden

[On the Ram Page]

13 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

Well, I'd prefer you not to tell me how to post on a social forum.

Prickly

[Foreveram]

11 hours ago, Leeds Ram said:

I didn't watch the game or go, so I can't comment on the performance aspect. However, the radio derby interview was bizarre and concerning. He should put his face next to the radio derby logo on the f****** why wall because he shouldn't be doing post-match pressers if he can't sufficiently answer basic questions. More concerning about his lack of reasoning on Sibbo was his revealing why he didn't use the middle of the pitch... because we have quick wingers, and they play 3 at the back. If he played Bird in the middle, Hourihane as a 10, and Waghorn as a CF, the movement and penetration that could have been offered would have disrupted their back 3 making gaps in the middle to take advantage of. If you just keep crossing it in, they can stay in a neat line and defend the space easily. If that's the level the bloke is operating at, I finally know why when teams come to Pride Park with a semblance of a game plan, he can't break them down. Tactically, he sounds clueless and out of his depth managing a professional club. 

On the fans booing, given the performances this season and off the back of last season, people are losing their patience. We're sitting in 8th place, and for many games, we haven't looked like a dominant force. I was hoping Blackpool was a turning corner, but it doesn't sound like it after this. People have paid a lot of money to go and watch a third-division team play. If they've had enough of whatever Warne has decided to serve up I can't say I blame them. The job seems to be getting to him and he doesn't appear to be enjoying himself. Surely a mutual parting of the ways must be considered if there isn't a drastic improvement by Christmas. 

Like you said you didn’t watch the game or go, so you can’t comment 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Leeds Ram]

7 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

It's interesting that you're advocate of quantitative and qualitative analysis on one hand but on the other you mention Warne subjectively being more prickly in post match interviews (however that is quantitatively defined is beyond me) than other Derby managers according to your memory.

You do realise the context is completely different right? I would hope a coach, when thinking about how to set the team up, has both qualitative and quantitative reasons behind their decision-making, which they can then explain to the press when asked about it. When discussing someone's temperament on the radio from a mere observer it seems a bit ridiculous to expect the same kind of preparation.... but that's just me 

[Leeds Ram]

12 minutes ago, On the Ram Page said:

Prickly

wum

[Walkley Ram]

22 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

The booing came from the usual suspects, who got into the ground just after kickoff, spent most of the game arguing with the stewards or trying to chat up one young steward who wasn’t remotely interested, standing on the stairways despite repeatedly being asked to move and chanting we’re Derby County we do as we want.

Several of them stood directly on the barrier and behind the goal blocking the view of anyone on the front row, by this time the stewards had just given up.

If you asked them for a summary of the game they wouldn’t have a clue, but then booing at the end because we didn’t win.

Still, their opinion matters, right.

 

8 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

Like you said you didn’t watch the game or go, so you can’t comment 🤷🏻‍♂️

So people who go to the game aren't allowed an opinion, but neither are people listening in on the radio.

Who's allowed an opinion then? Let me guess, is it you?

[On the Ram Page]

3 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

You do realise the context is completely different right? I would hope a coach, when thinking about how to set the team up, has both qualitative and quantitative reasons behind their decision-making, which they can then explain to the press when asked about it. When discussing someone's temperament on the radio from a mere observer it seems a bit ridiculous to expect the same kind of preparation.... but that's just me 

You do talk a load of crap. Time you had a holiday to clear your head and get a bit of realism

[Leeds Ram]

10 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

Like you said you didn’t watch the game or go, so you can’t comment 🤷🏻‍♂️

And I haven't on the particulars of the performance. 

[Tyler Durden]

6 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

You do realise the context is completely different right? I would hope a coach, when thinking about how to set the team up, has both qualitative and quantitative reasons behind their decision-making, which they can then explain to the press when asked about it. When discussing someone's temperament on the radio from a mere observer it seems a bit ridiculous to expect the same kind of preparation.... but that's just me 

No the context is only completely different as you choose it to be as it doesn't fit your narrative. 

I choose the context to be exactly the same - you advocate quantitative analysis but you then talk about purely subjective criticism on the other.

Seems like you want things all ways 

Edited October 8, 2023 by Tyler Durden

[Leeds Ram]

Just now, Tyler Durden said:

No the context is only completely different as you choose it be as it doesn't fit your narrative. 

I choose the context to be exactly the same - you advocate quantitative analysis but you then talk about purely subjective criticism on the other.

Seems like you want things all ways 

So you think one person commenting on a forum in their spare time on a Sunday requires the same kind of expectations and preparation as a professional in order to be able to maintain integrity when commenting.... strikes me as a ridiculous proposition tbh. 

[Leeds Ram]

2 minutes ago, On the Ram Page said:

You do talk a load of crap. Time you had a holiday to clear your head and get a bit of realism

That's your view. But you've offered nothing to change my mind except a bit of a dig and an insult so it should come as no surprise that I don't really take what you say or think to heart. 

[Archied]

12 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

It's also comforting to know that when you share that you have suffered with depression all of your life this is greeted with a laughing emoji reaction.

Kind of a long the lines of my take on the we are all derby thread , we get a frustrating result / performance and all the usual suspects are out in force spouting the same old same old ( seen warne called a prat earlier ) and it makes the disappointment even more of a downer , get a good result / performance it’s all , don’t give it back we are all derby , duck that , it’s game on from now on 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Caerphilly Ram]

1 hour ago, derbydaz22 said:

Teams looking to get promotion will not be happy with a point at Cheltenham for Gods sake.

But that isn’t what the poster I was responding to said. They said no other team in this league would be happy, some would, therefore it is by definition hyperbole. 

[Walkley Ram]

 

1 minute ago, Leeds Ram said:

So you think one person commenting on a forum in their spare time on a Sunday requires the same kind of expectations and preparation as a professional in order to be able to maintain integrity when commenting.... strikes me as a ridiculous proposition tbh. 

I'm currently writing my thesis on why Paul Warne isn't doing a very good job. Once it's peer reviewed I'll let people on here read it.

[Tyler Durden]

2 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

So you think one person commenting on a forum in their spare time on a Sunday requires the same kind of expectations and preparation as a professional in order to be able to maintain integrity when commenting.... strikes me as a ridiculous proposition tbh. 

No it's called hypocrisy I believe that you advocate one standard to criticise someone but you then don't apply that same standard yourself. 

[Leeds Ram]

Just now, Tyler Durden said:

No it's called hypocrisy I believe that you advocate one standard to criticise someone but you then don't apply that same standard yourself. 

It would be hypocrisy if I were the same in my professional job. Otherwise, it's not hypocrisy because I don't expect the standard to apply uniformly and in all contexts.