Referees

[Jram]

21 hours ago, The Last Post said:

I'll tell you a little story, I'm a qualified referee, Passed my course in the 90s as A referee told me "if you think it's easy take a course" I did and refereed in the Derby Taverners League(Sunday Morning) You start at the bottom division and work your way up through good marks, I got to run the line in a Cup Final in my 1st year...not bad I thought, You may not be surprised how thick some players are when it comes to the rules, These are the ones who are out on the lash on a Saturday night...turn up Sunday Morning and still half cut and thought they were Paul Gascoyne 🙄 

So my story is this, I was refereeing a game Between and older mans team and a younger mans team, The older players thought they could take advantage of the younger lads...only the younger lads were just as enthusiastic and wouldn't back down, One tackle by a younger player embarrassed the older player...the older player(who I knew)shouted for a free kick...I told him he's been at it all game and he got what was fare, He then decides to get in my face(big mistake)and called me a Bast**d, Not having it, So I nutted him, Blood and snot all over his face, A few choice words were spoken by him and the rabble on the side-line, Water off a ducks back as they knew who I was.

Nowt came of it, But that was the last game I refereed as I resigned from the leagues referees, I'm a big critic of officials, It's not an easy job...but some make a rod for their own backs at times by poor performances...no it's not an easy job, But they make it difficult by the performances...ie the Bolton game.

The referee last season I think it was Chelmsford...a female Ref, One of the best displays last season I saw...I wonder why🤷‍♂️

 

 

 

#DHOTYA

[ap04]

13 hours ago, nick_d said:

got all of the major decisions right

She got them both wrong (penalty we were awarded and hand ball for the equaliser).

 

9 hours ago, B4ev6is said:

It was offside

It was not, it as miles onside.

 

[The_Sheriff]

Another great performance by this ref at pride park.

Not being sarcastic.

I moan about refs often enough so credit where due

[jimtastic56]

On 17/09/2023 at 06:05, G-Ram said:

The refereeing is poor but its the same ref for both sides.

Start playing well, Creating more chances & we'll find we'll get more decisions or the poor decisions will affect the game less if we are three up.

Yes the officiating hasnt been the best but its the standard for the division we find ourselves in. We need to stop moaning about it & start playing proper football 

Pompey manager was furious with the ref . Saying Fornah should have been sent off in the first half for 2 bookables . He said the pen was harsh and why did the ref stop the game when Hourihane went down ? Still we only have to wait till tomorrow and we can produce another 20 pages of criticism of of the officials once again.

[MadAmster]

On 17/09/2023 at 11:23, ap04 said:

She got them both wrong (penalty we were awarded and hand ball for the equaliser).

 

 

 

 

As a recently retired ref, I'd be interested to know why you think it wasn't a penalty. Defender had his arm well above his head. That is not a natural position. Penalty all day long IMO. 

She did miss the handball for their equaliser though. She should also have walked Fornah. We got away with that.

[ap04]

19 hours ago, MadAmster said:

As a recently retired ref, I'd be interested to know why you think it wasn't a penalty. Defender had his arm well above his head. That is not a natural position. Penalty all day long IMO. 

She did miss the handball for their equaliser though. She should also have walked Fornah. We got away with that.

Sorry, I assumed this as the ball deflects off his body onto the arm - there was a recent recommendation to Uefa on this and every such incident I have seen has not been penalised, for example this in the weekend.

As it turns out unnatural position may be the only factor at least in England, it would be useful if you have more info on this.

About the Fornah incident I am not sure it was a free kick at all.

[ossieram]

On 17/09/2023 at 06:05, G-Ram said:

The refereeing is poor but its the same ref for both sides.

Start playing well, Creating more chances & we'll find we'll get more decisions or the poor decisions will affect the game less if we are three up.

Yes the officiating hasnt been the best but its the standard for the division we find ourselves in. We need to stop moaning about it & start playing proper football 

Yes it's the same ref for both sides, but that doesn't mean they ref the same for both sides.

[MadAmster]

3 hours ago, ap04 said:

Sorry, I assumed this as the ball deflects off his body onto the arm - there was a recent recommendation to Uefa on this and every such incident I have seen has not been penalised, for example this in the weekend.

As it turns out unnatural position may be the only factor at least in England, it would be useful if you have more info on this.

About the Fornah incident I am not sure it was a free kick at all.

Here's an excerpt from UEFA with regard to this season's interpretation of the rule where there's a deflection...

European governing body UEFA, has moved to do just that with guidelines for the 2023/24 season already released. Most importantly, the European governing body wishes to relax the whistling of handball offences with regards to deflections, as well as relaxing the punishment for yellow and red cards shown.

The guidelines for 2023/24 suggest that "no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body, and, in particular, when the ball does not go towards the goal."

Both at the game and on the RamsTV highlights earlier today, I was, and still am, of the opinion the ball deflected off Waggy and not off the defender's body. In that case a penalty was the correct decision. If the deflection was off the defender himself then no penalty should have been given but, as I said, I thought the deflection was off Waggy, hence my take on it.

[May Contain Nuts]

36 minutes ago, MadAmster said:

Here's an excerpt from UEFA with regard to this season's interpretation of the rule where there's a deflection...

European governing body UEFA, has moved to do just that with guidelines for the 2023/24 season already released. Most importantly, the European governing body wishes to relax the whistling of handball offences with regards to deflections, as well as relaxing the punishment for yellow and red cards shown.

The guidelines for 2023/24 suggest that "no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body, and, in particular, when the ball does not go towards the goal."

Both at the game and on the RamsTV highlights earlier today, I was, and still am, of the opinion the ball deflected off Waggy and not off the defender's body. In that case a penalty was the correct decision. If the deflection was off the defender himself then no penalty should have been given but, as I said, I thought the deflection was off Waggy, hence my take on it.

It hits their player on his side / upper thigh before being deflected up toward his arm. In which case, no penalty.

 

Edited September 19, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[MadAmster]

21 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

It hits their player on his side / upper thigh before being deflected up toward his arm. In which case, no penalty.

 

Looks that way.. If it came off his side it shouldn't have been given...

[ap04]

52 minutes ago, MadAmster said:

Here's an excerpt from UEFA with regard to this season's interpretation of the rule where there's a deflection...

European governing body UEFA, has moved to do just that with guidelines for the 2023/24 season already released. Most importantly, the European governing body wishes to relax the whistling of handball offences with regards to deflections, as well as relaxing the punishment for yellow and red cards shown.

The guidelines for 2023/24 suggest that "no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body, and, in particular, when the ball does not go towards the goal."

Both at the game and on the RamsTV highlights earlier today, I was, and still am, of the opinion the ball deflected off Waggy and not off the defender's body. In that case a penalty was the correct decision. If the deflection was off the defender himself then no penalty should have been given but, as I said, I thought the deflection was off Waggy, hence my take on it.

As Kokosnuss mentioned above it 100% comes off the defender, and I am yet to see one like this being given.

However the above is just a recommendation to Uefa from a panel, no guideline has been issued. From the little I read the official Ifab/fa rules here still mention nothing on deflections just unnatural position, or the 2nd case here for example, so maybe penalty was correct after all.

[May Contain Nuts]

Maybe but there's ab unnatural about the position of his arms', for the action he was making

Tough call for a ref whatever the case, nice to have something going our favour. (Even if we did waste the advantage)

Edited September 19, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[MadAmster]

15 hours ago, ap04 said:

As Kokosnuss mentioned above it 100% comes off the defender, and I am yet to see one like this being given.

However the above is just a recommendation to Uefa from a panel, no guideline has been issued. From the little I read the official Ifab/fa rules here still mention nothing on deflections just unnatural position, or the 2nd case here for example, so maybe penalty was correct after all.

Which highlights just how difficult refereeing can be and often is. Fans should possibly cut refs some slack on a lot of occasions although the criticism is, all too often, also warranted. 

[WestKentRam]

16 hours ago, ap04 said:

As Kokosnuss mentioned above it 100% comes off the defender, and I am yet to see one like this being given.

However the above is just a recommendation to Uefa from a panel, no guideline has been issued. From the little I read the official Ifab/fa rules here still mention nothing on deflections just unnatural position, or the 2nd case here for example, so maybe penalty was correct after all.

Good point this.

I've been pondering the Portsmouth game over the last few days reading and listening to reports of the goals and a rewatch of the highlights to be my own sofa-VAR.

I agree that from my reading of the laws it doesn't matter if it did come off Waghorn or not, it should still be a penalty to us, especially as the defender's arms in the position they are in essentially 'make him big' like a goalkeeper would do trying to stop a cross or shot.

Given that there was also a clear handball in the build up to their goal when their player brought the high ball down and controlled it with his arm, I'm putting my rose tinted specs on and saying their goal should have been disallowed and we should have won 1-0. My 'Spreadsheet of Injustice' will be updated.

[jimtastic56]

That’s really going to help the third tier - the Arabs want the best Prem refs for their League and will pay them over the odds. Everyone gets bumped up and we end up with non - league refs. Brill 

[Seaside Ram]

Well after the worst ever penalty award at Shrewsbury Saturday, was NML offside tonight ? 

When things even themselves out from these last 3 yrs we’re in for one hell of a lucky end of season 😂

[Srg]

No, it was onside. Luckily it didn’t matter. Shame really because I actually thought the ref was alright - I suppose this was the linesman’s error. 

[sage]

2 minutes ago, Srg said:

No, it was onside. Luckily it didn’t matter. Shame really because I actually thought the ref was alright - I suppose this was the linesman’s error. 

I thought we was very lenient with Hourihane in terms of a yellow card, some cynical little fouls as he was isolated.

[tinman]

Thought the ref was really good tonight. Shame the Lino in front of the Toyota stand got confused. 

[Zag zig]

The referee was pretty good tonight, all the bookings were fair and just, he let the game flowed as much as he could; though rightly Waggy chided him for getting in his way.