Neville takes the money

[i-Ram]

2 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

Six and half thousand people died to build the stadia for this tournament that will be torn down once it's over - once some balls have been kicked across some grass. I couldn't care less about beer being served at matches or wearing rainbow armbands or not, but 6,500 people are dead. Many more were exploited and lived in misery.

England should have boycotted the tournament. All the pundits should have refused to go. None of the pundits cares about raising awareness as much as they care about lining their pockets and raising their profiles at the expense of vast numbers of dead people. 

You would think the least the entirety of the football world could do would be to come together and mourn the lost, wear black armbands, remember them before every.single.match. But then they might draw attention to the beautiful game not being quite so lovely or so lucrative once people truly lifted the veneer.

I’m not convinced England should have unilaterally boycotted the tournament, but I am disappointed they rolled over today so easily with the armband. The Iranian Team risk arrest, or worse, on their return but made a principled stand. Harry Kane should have worn his armband, and accepted his booking. Opportunity to make more noise about this disaster of a Tournament missed.

[Norman]

Someone makes fair points about a topic - next logical step is to accuse them of obsession. The weakest of arguments and the most pathetic of attempts to demean someone.

Someone posts a lot on a topic - next logical step is to accuse them of posting too much even though the accusers are the ones that post the most in this section and like to have their opinions heard the most.... then moan when someone counters their opinion.

Welcome to the echo chamber, then.

Tolerance is the new intolerant. Self-awareness replaced by ignorance.

[sage]

36 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

I’m not convinced England should have unilaterally boycotted the tournament, but I am disappointed they rolled over today so easily with the armband. The Iranian Team risk arrest, or worse, on their return but made a principled stand. Harry Kane should have worn his armband, and accepted his booking. Opportunity to make more noise about this disaster of a Tournament missed.

The decision was taken out of his hands. Maybe he would have taken the booking. We'll never know. 

[Carl Sagan]

2 hours ago, sage said:

Once England decided to go, it was a fair accompli for everything else to follow. 

Ideally this would have been done as a UEFA block boycott 

I would have supported them not going on principle but now they are there I want them to win. 

I do hope they find a way to protest. 

I understand and feel I'm a hypocrite for watching and wanting them to win. But we are talking about two 9/11s, except no one really is talking about it.

I don't really care about the rainbow armband as I see it as a sideshow and distraction from the deaths, but it's yet more moral cowardice not to wear it today if that's what you believe. The Iranian players didn't sing their anthem and their captain spoke out in support of the protest. Now his family might be imprisoned or dead. But Harry Kane didn't want to be booked. 

I want to see some moral courage from our players. Black armbands and a group silence before each game would be a start. 

[Archied]

7 hours ago, sage said:

The decision was taken out of his hands. Maybe he would have taken the booking. We'll never know. 

When you truly believe in your principles the decision is never taken out of your hands , we all make our own choices, that includes Caine , Southgate and others 

I was talking about beckham long before lycett came along , it was me that started this thread on Neville taking the money only to find him defended by some who see him as a champion of the left and as such can not be shown to be the all fart and no poo hypocrite he turns out to be ,

@Norman is 100% correct , in my time posting in this area over a few topics I have found that if you are willing to disagree with a certain  section of posters you are subjected to insults direct and loosely implied accusations, far right , racist , homophobic , granny killer , insensitive and now obsessive, I will be honest , having never been involved in debate on internet platforms before and this still being the only place I take part ( it happens to be in my true obsession, derby county ) it troubled me at first , I thought am I what I’m accused of , do I come across as that but I have come to realise it’s all just a tactic to stop people pointing out what some don’t want pointing out , I’ve seen quite a few sensible posters just kind of give up bothering to post most of the time 

sadly for the usual suspects I won’t give in to the tactics and will carry on pointing out the holes in biased tunnel vision thinking and the double standards 

[GboroRam]

5 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

I understand and feel I'm a hypocrite for watching and wanting them to win. But we are talking about two 9/11s, except no one really is talking about it.

I don't really care about the rainbow armband as I see it as a sideshow and distraction from the deaths, but it's yet more moral cowardice not to wear it today if that's what you believe. The Iranian players didn't sing their anthem and their captain spoke out in support of the protest. Now his family might be imprisoned or dead. But Harry Kane didn't want to be booked. 

I want to see some moral courage from our players. Black armbands and a group silence before each game would be a start. 

Horrific as that is, it's not the full story. Many people were victims of modern slavery, forced to work by withholding their passports. Thousands died. 

This tournament is the modern day equivalent of building the pyramids. Shame on everyone involved. 

[Archied]

49 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

Horrific as that is, it's not the full story. Many people were victims of modern slavery, forced to work by withholding their passports. Thousands died. 

This tournament is the modern day equivalent of building the pyramids. Shame on everyone involved. 

Yep this is an event where individuals, separate football bodies , tv networks , pundits and high profile personalities and sponsors could and should have made a meaningful stand, but no we just see the hollow tokens , hear the hollow words which even those are backed down from when there may be a cost ,,, easy street hero’s, you wouldn’t want to find yourself in the trenches with todays equality warriors 

[sage]

1 hour ago, Archied said:

When you truly believe in your principles the decision is never taken out of your hands , we all make our own choices, that includes Caine , Southgate and others 

I was talking about beckham long before lycett came along , it was me that started this thread on Neville taking the money only to find him defended by some who see him as a champion of the left and as such can not be shown to be the all fart and no poo hypocrite he turns out to be ,

@Norman is 100% correct , in my time posting in this area over a few topics I have found that if you are willing to disagree with a certain  section of posters you are subjected to insults direct and loosely implied accusations, far right , racist , homophobic , granny killer , insensitive and now obsessive, I will be honest , having never been involved in debate on internet platforms before and this still being the only place I take part ( it happens to be in my true obsession, derby county ) it troubled me at first , I thought am I what I’m accused of , do I come across as that but I have come to realise it’s all just a tactic to stop people pointing out what some don’t want pointing out , I’ve seen quite a few sensible posters just kind of give up bothering to post most of the time 

sadly for the usual suspects I won’t give in to the tactics and will carry on pointing out the holes in biased tunnel vision thinking and the double standards 

I'm stating my opinion. I don't declare it to be 'the truth'. 

I do think it's a little rich to accuse others of tunnel vision when you seem to have pretty set views yourself 

Sadly we are all victims og the echo chamber that social media becomes. 

Keep posting. We all have opinions. 

[Ram-Alf]

10 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Six and half thousand people died to build the stadia for this tournament that will be torn down once it's over - once some balls have been kicked across some grass. I couldn't care less about beer being served at matches or wearing rainbow armbands or not, but 6,500 people are dead. Many more were exploited and lived in misery.

England should have boycotted the tournament. All the pundits should have refused to go. None of the pundits cares about raising awareness as much as they care about lining their pockets and raising their profiles at the expense of vast numbers of dead people. 

You would think the least the entirety of the football world could do would be to come together and mourn the lost, wear black armbands, remember them before every.single.match. But then they might draw attention to the beautiful game not being quite so lovely or so lucrative once people truly lifted the veneer.

I don't think you quite understand the metrics of THIS World cup ?, The "6500 deaths" were people from the 3rd World, People like you and me, Work for wages, Eat to survive and if possible send money to family.

If this was 6500 Western people then I can assure you the shyte would have hit the fan way way before it hit that figure, The FAs from around the world have very little interest about those that have died, A few words of comfort, A little money in compensation and they hope it goes away, Footballers are in a financial bubble in the main and may not see what we see or care ?‍♀️, Advisors telling them what, When and how to show support for minorities, The Worlds FAs are complicit as the mighty $ is king.

I agree with your comment, Every cat and dog should have boycotted this tournament, But that falls into the realms of fantasy doesn't it.

[Archied]

33 minutes ago, sage said:

I'm stating my opinion. I don't declare it to be 'the truth'. 

I do think it's a little rich to accuse others of tunnel vision when you seem to have pretty set views yourself 

Sadly we are all victims og the echo chamber that social media becomes. 

Keep posting. We all have opinions. 

Perhaps it’s the internet but I can assure you I’m very open to changing and adjusting my view on any subject, where my view starts on any subject is very rarely where it ends up if true debate happens but I’m sure if you are honest and look back over a few topics lately it’s been very much a tactic to say I could and should post less if I point out uncomfortable questions, now you did not start this but in fairness have joined in , even to the point of throwing out the insult , you precious little snowflake which I can assure you I would have been given a warning or ban for had I done that

that said , I don’t really mind it’s a bit sticks and stones playground stuff 

[Ram-Alf]

2 hours ago, Archied said:

 

@Norman is 100% correct , in my time posting in this area over a few topics I have found that if you are willing to disagree with a certain  section of posters you are subjected to insults direct and loosely implied accusations, far right , racist , homophobic , granny killer , insensitive and now obsessive.

You missed "old fat Gammon"

There's right, Left and Centrist who post on here, The left seem to hold some Mods ears, I can well debate or even argue with those that differ to my politics and Ideals, But then we go off tangent, Posts disappear or becomes a war zone.

 

[Stive Pesley]

13 hours ago, Norman said:

Someone makes fair points about a topic - next logical step is to accuse them of obsession. The weakest of arguments and the most pathetic of attempts to demean someone.

Someone posts a lot on a topic - next logical step is to accuse them of posting too much even though the accusers are the ones that post the most in this section and like to have their opinions heard the most.... then moan when someone counters their opinion.

Welcome to the echo chamber, then.

Tolerance is the new intolerant. Self-awareness replaced by ignorance.

Talking of ignorance - maybe you missed the post where moderators pointed out that ArchieD had written 4 times as many posts as the the next most prolific poster in a couple of the more contentious threads?

So as far as echo chambers go - isn't it the loudest voice that drowns out the rest?

 

 

[Archied]

13 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

Talking of ignorance - maybe you missed the post where moderators pointed out that ArchieD had written 4 times as many posts as the the next most prolific poster in a couple of the more contentious threads?

So as far as echo chambers go - isn't it the loudest voice that drowns out the rest?

 

 

Or one person replying to a pile on ,

thought you were the champion of minorities 

as I said the other day when I finally realised you could never find any middle ground , stick me on ignore , that would cut my post numbers drastically 

Edited November 22, 2022 by Archied

[Norman]

18 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

Talking of ignorance - maybe you missed the post where moderators pointed out that ArchieD had written 4 times as many posts as the the next most prolific poster in a couple of the more contentious threads?

 

 

To quote that moderator, "More than 1 in 4 posts are from you, more than double the next active poster".

That next poster would be you, by the way. Who happens to share the second highest post count with another poster who disagrees with @Archied. Not really outlandish that he has over double the posts of the next poster when that is taken into account.

Not like you to be right though, to be fair. 

[cstand]

Don’t forget all it’s not all happy in the LGBT community. Don’t think wearing a one love arm band is going to make any difference to this row.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-are-lesbians-no-longer-welcome-at-pride/

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by cstand

[sage]

4 hours ago, cstand said:

Don’t forget all it’s not all happy in the LGBT community. Don’t think wearing a one love arm band is going to make any difference to this row.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-are-lesbians-no-longer-welcome-at-pride/

 

This has been happening for a while. The headline is a little OTT but there are real battles between trans right v lesbians rights, trans rights v feniminsm, trans rights v women's rights. 

It's a real disaster area that I imagine most public figures are desperately trying to stay out off. 

 

[ariotofmyown]

I know everyone loves a Trans vs Lesbian debate, or even more a debate about each other, but back on topic, Guardian Football podcast were talking about Neville on BEIN sports opening match coverage the other day banging on about all the problems with Qatar and them hosting the World Cup, like he said he would. (Guardian podcast were also criticising him talking the money btw).

I know it's impossible to hold nuanced views on anything these days, but it seems a good thing that Neville is openly criticising Qatar on a Qatari TV network.

It seems that Neville is getting far more abuse for being a hypocrite (who is also highlighting issues to an audience that is perhaps new to them) than Beckham, who is happily taking 150 million to continue to be a vacuous twit.

 

[cstand]

8 hours ago, ariotofmyown said:

I know everyone loves a Trans vs Lesbian debate, or even more a debate about each other, but back on topic, Guardian Football podcast were talking about Neville on BEIN sports opening match coverage the other day banging on about all the problems with Qatar and them hosting the World Cup, like he said he would. (Guardian podcast were also criticising him talking the money btw).

I know it's impossible to hold nuanced views on anything these days, but it seems a good thing that Neville is openly criticising Qatar on a Qatari TV network.

It seems that Neville is getting far more abuse for being a hypocrite (who is also highlighting issues to an audience that is perhaps new to them) than Beckham, who is happily taking 150 million to continue to be a vacuous twit.

 

Neville and Beckham are like most other celebrities they are only interested in themselves to earn as much money/enhance their celebrity status by any means possible, so will support any cause even if they thought it was misguided just depends who pays the most.

I would not listen to either of them both just as bad in my opinion 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by cstand

[Archied]

Turns out lycett has done paid for shows in uae including Qatar ,

what a principled hero , no way was he just raising his own profile???

Edited December 21, 2022 by Archied

[Archied]

Meanwhile Gary Neville after giving his itv sermon on the government treatment of nurses and other strikers and how people should have decent wages ( whilst actually meant to be doing football punditry after one of the best World Cup finals ) is advertising for staff at his hotel/ restaurant on minimum wage ,

you really couldn’t make this poo up,

so , beckham, lycett, Neville stay firmly in the virtue signalling hypocrites box for me??‍♂️