ramit Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 59 minutes ago, deanoakaram4life said: You can keep building and playing youngsters for the next 10 years but you can’t magic them into world beaters. Jamie Hanson is a prime example. He had all the characteristics of a first teamer according to Wassall. The reality is that a lot of senior players have been replaced with youngsters this year forcing them to sink or swim. It’s not fair on them at all! Cocu may have all the tools to develop young talent in the Dutch league, where the football is more structured, but the sheer physicality and grind of the championship is a different ball game all together. Actually, you can. Jamie Hanson is one example of the opposite. This academy is producing talent like never before, because of hefty investment in it's facilities and scouting. If we were to ask the young players currently with the first team and those on the verge if they felt it was unfair on them to have a go at first team football, i am thinking the answer would be a resounding hearty laugh in the face. If we can survive this season, the young players will get better and that's what we need, better players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Nice to see Remain winning this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 16 minutes ago, sage said: Nice to see Remain winning this time. Thank God it didn't in the real world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 1 hour ago, deanoakaram4life said: You can keep building and playing youngsters for the next 10 years but you can’t magic them into world beaters. Jamie Hanson is a prime example. He had all the characteristics of a first teamer according to Wassall. The reality is that a lot of senior players have been replaced with youngsters this year forcing them to sink or swim. It’s not fair on them at all! The strange thing is - the youngsters have generally been the better players - especially knight and Buchanan. bird is a bit more of mixed bag, now slicing his shots and miss-kicking free kicks and corners. But its the senior players who have disappointed the most - rooney, Holmes, te wierik Etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brammie Steve Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Clap your hands and shout with glee We are in the bottom three Still we know beyond a doubt That we don't want Cocu out! Things could hardly get much worse (Rather like this doggerel verse!) Yet the facts remain the same.. Is the manager to blame? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 21 hours ago, Curtains said: But didn’t we play ok first half last night and weren’t we the better team ! What happened in that half time team talk to produce that second half display I wonder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cool As Custard Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 8 hours ago, deanoakaram4life said: Can’t keep trying to scrape from transfer window to transfer window, we’ve only just come out of one. Thats exactly what we have to do - we don’t have any money & thus any other choice right now! Only way out of it is to persist with developing youth & the best man to do that IMO is PC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EtoileSportiveDeDerby Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 9 hours ago, deanoakaram4life said: You can keep building and playing youngsters for the next 10 years but you can’t magic them into world beaters. Jamie Hanson is a prime example. He had all the characteristics of a first teamer according to Wassall. The reality is that a lot of senior players have been replaced with youngsters this year forcing them to sink or swim. It’s not fair on them at all! Cocu may have all the tools to develop young talent in the Dutch league, where the football is more structured, but the sheer physicality and grind of the championship is a different ball game all together. Wenger was on TV at the w/e and said in terms of player developments there are critical stages in players development carreers, the research and statistics back this up. At the top level, 19/20 Who is going to be a first team player, 23 who is going to be a world class player, 26/27 who is going to sustain it, hunger to stay there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Spanish said: What happened in that half time team talk to produce that second half display I wonder Isn't it more what happened in the other dressing room? Corberan said he made a tweak that allowed them to play through the press and the first time they did it, they scored. He then shored up the defence by bringing on his captain and job done. We probably said to carry on doing more of the same and the goal will come. When it went to the opposition heads dropped and the defeat felt inevitable. The resilience of the players is low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 9 hours ago, ramit said: If we can survive this season, the young players will get better and that's what we need, better players By what reasoning can you guarantee that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FindernRam Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 11 hours ago, BramcoteRam84 said: A key remit was bringing through the academy players and you can’t deny he’s done well there. I'm not sure that is down to Cocu, with injuries and transfers the squad is so thin it is a neccessity, irrespective of whether the lads are ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelBlimp Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 I voted in but every loss makes an out vote closer, obviously. I do think he's had a bum deal though so at the absolute minimum he should get until January, ideally the whole season and re-assess. We are transitioning and this will take time and we have had a lot of setbacks along this bumpy road. But, the road is long, with many a winding turn and as long as the "Who knows where" is not League1 we should stick with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, angieram said: Isn't it more what happened in the other dressing room? Corberan said he made a tweak that allowed them to play through the press and the first time they did it, they scored. He then shored up the defence by bringing on his captain and job done. We probably said to carry on doing more of the same and the goal will come. When it went to the opposition heads dropped and the defeat felt inevitable. The resilience of the players is low. obviously you are partly correct but for me it shows up that they had a better manager than we do at least in those crucial 15 mins. we have Sergeant Wilson in charge I fear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said: By what reasoning can you guarantee that? Young players exposed to first team football must raise their game, need demands and by playing with the first team they get practice, hardly complicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, FindernRam said: I'm not sure that is down to Cocu, with injuries and transfers the squad is so thin it is a neccessity, irrespective of whether the lads are ready. Yes this was my observation too. How much of this has been because he needed bodies on the pitch and how much was a calculated design to start bringing these players through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cool As Custard Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, RoyMac5 said: By what reasoning can you guarantee that? By what reasoning will changing the manager guarantee an improvement in person? There are no guarantees in anything. You have to make your choices & stick with them - the only sure thing is that constant change will not be helpful in improving performance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marriot Ram99 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 1 minute ago, Cool As Custard said: By what reasoning will changing the manager guarantee an improvement in person? There are no guarantees in anything. You have to make your choices & stick with them - the only sure thing is that constant change will not be helpful in improving performance Making bad decisions and sticking with them is pig headed and stupid and only leads to further failure more often than not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Just now, Cool As Custard said: There are no guarantees in anything. You have to make your choices & stick with them - the only sure thing is that constant change will not be helpful in improving performance You don't though - that's the huge flaw in your argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cool As Custard Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Just now, Marriott Ram99 said: Makking bad decisions and sticking with them is pig headed and stupid and only leads to further failure more often than not. How do you define a bad decision.....? Change guarantees nothing but neither does sticking with current. You have to base your decision on what is most likely to deliver long term sustainable success. Constant change is not conducive to long term sustainable success - stability is the key Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marriot Ram99 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 3 minutes ago, Cool As Custard said: How do you define a bad decision.....? Change guarantees nothing but neither does sticking with current. You have to base your decision on what is most likely to deliver long term sustainable success. Constant change is not conducive to long term sustainable success - stability is the key Completey disagree because short term is always most important, you don't get to stick around for long term if the short and medium terms are a disaster. 10 defeats in 12 now, if we loose tommorow he has to go for me. Been against Cocu since pretty early days tbh, piss poor recruitment hasn't helped but the style of football is shocking and not pragmatic with the players at his disposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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