Ikechi Anya......

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, Ambitious said:

If you had looked at his history, how he struggled for form or to even hold down a place at a club level then it should've been a huge red flag. It's not like we picked up a talented footballer with the world at his feet who failed to make the grade. We picked up a try-hard footballer with a list of failures and didn't bat an eyelid. 

This is quite simply a signing that shouldn't have been made and its not a surprise that it ended badly. 

cf Blackman?

[Ambitious]

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

cf Blackman?

Exactly. The same situation - teams in our position, well our position at the time, who had a bit of money should really looked at the market much smarter with a bit of money to spend. 

A) players who have shown ability and who are now lacking form or confidence or B) young players with a progressive outlook and potential.

If you're not going to travel the lengths of the earth and stick to buying in England then it has to be done that way. 

[Van der MoodHoover]

6 minutes ago, Ambitious said:

Exactly. The same situation - teams in our position, well our position at the time, who had a bit of money should really looked at the market much smarter with a bit of money to spend. 

A) players who have shown ability and who are now lacking form or confidence or B) young players with a progressive outlook and potential.

If you're not going to travel the lengths of the earth and stick to buying in England then it has to be done that way. 

If you look at transfermarkt it is that season of Clement that really stands out. Spend of 32m, recouped 0.

Big fees on Bradley,  butters, blackman each of which recouped us 0. Weimann we apparently lost a couple of £m on as well.

I realise that it may not be 100% accurate but it is at least indicative.  

Anya just the latest. Shocking profligacy. 

[Roboram]

Wasn’t Anya a Pearson signing?

[SaffyRam]

6 minutes ago, Roboram said:

Wasn’t Anya a Pearson signing?

Yes, didn’t he arrive with Vydra?

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

37 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

If you look at transfermarkt it is that season of Clement that really stands out. Spend of 32m, recouped 0.

Big fees on Bradley,  butters, blackman each of which recouped us 0. Weimann we apparently lost a couple of £m on as well.

I realise that it may not be 100% accurate but it is at least indicative.  

Anya just the latest. Shocking profligacy. 

Tom Ince was a PC signing and was sold for £10+m

[rammieib]

14 hours ago, Mucker1884 said:

Maybe, any such potential loans just didn't suit him?  Style of play/commuting/dislike of that manager?  Could be numerous reasons why a certain player doesn't want to go to a certain club or clubs.  I'm surmising, of course.  I've no idea what has gone on.

But someone at the club must have agreed all the terms of the contract, and it's the club... or at least some of the clubs supporters... that appear to have a problem with how things have turned out, or how much we (the club) have paid out for the "privilege".  I'd look no further than the club... or individuals therein... when it comes to blame.

We see it differently, but I don't see that as a problem.  Difference of opinion is healthy, and neither will change the situation.   ?

We don’t see it that differently - club awarded him a contract and he’s entitled to that money.

I think I’m more angry at his lack of personal pride in wanting to play football that annoys me. This was a guy where religion was so incredibly important to him (although if rumours are true and expensive cars seem to slightly contradict his chosen life styles) but nonetheless given his upbringing and so on, just thought he would have gone elsewhere for some playing time.

Certainly don’t begrudge a player for signing a healthy contract. Ironic thing is, I actually thought we’d bought a decent player at the time.

[Mucker1884]

35 minutes ago, rammieib said:

We don’t see it that differently - club awarded him a contract and he’s entitled to that money.

I think I’m more angry at his lack of personal pride in wanting to play football that annoys me. This was a guy where religion was so incredibly important to him (although if rumours are true and expensive cars seem to slightly contradict his chosen life styles) but nonetheless given his upbringing and so on, just thought he would have gone elsewhere for some playing time.

Certainly don’t begrudge a player for signing a healthy contract. Ironic thing is, I actually thought we’d bought a decent player at the time.

I cannot deny, I know precisely zero, with regards to the man, the rumours, his religion, his choice of car, or his upbringing, or his desire to play.  I can make wild guesses for some, particularly the desire to play bit, but it would be no more than that!  ?

[Crazy]

3 hours ago, QuitYourJibbaJivin said:

Tom Ince was a PC signing and was sold for £10+m

Was he? He came on loan under Mac, so I'd guess the permanent signing was on the cards before PC arrived. 

[jimbobram]

3 hours ago, QuitYourJibbaJivin said:

Tom Ince was a PC signing and was sold for £10+m

Doesn’t fit the narrative though so can’t include ince

[MaltRam]

Turned up with a big fee and big hair, set off all enthusiastic buzzing around, lifted everyone's hopes with a step over, tried it again, failed, promptly disappeared up his own arse-crack and never seen since.

Thanks Nigel. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

30 minutes ago, Crazy said:

Was he? He came on loan under Mac, so I'd guess the permanent signing was on the cards before PC arrived. 

Yeah, I was under the impression the loan to permanent was all in the bag irrelevant of Clement. Let's face it, if it wasn't, Hull would've tried harder after his successful loan.

[Ghost of Clough]

11 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

If you look at transfermarkt it is that season of Clement that really stands out. Spend of 32m, recouped 0.

Big fees on Bradley,  butters, blackman each of which recouped us 0. Weimann we apparently lost a couple of £m on as well.

I realise that it may not be 100% accurate but it is at least indicative.  

Anya just the latest. Shocking profligacy. 

We certainly wasted a lot of money over those couple of years... Butterfield (£5m), Anya (£4m), Shackell (£3.5m), Blackman (£3m), Camara (£1.5m). Even Olsson for £600k was a waste when we already had Fozzy and Lowe coming through. Johnson cost a lot but at least he played 142 games for us.

There's still time for Lampard's signings to prove their worth (Waghorn, Marriott, Jozefzoon and Malone)

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

8 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Yeah, I was under the impression the loan to permanent was all in the bag irrelevant of Clement. Let's face it, if it wasn't, Hull would've tried harder after his successful loan.

From what I remember when he signed on loan there wasn’t any talk of loan to perm. It was only in the summer there was talk of Derby having a £4.75m option to buy and Steve Bruce was fuming. Here’s another one to go against the narrative @jimbobram cracking bit of business by Sam Rush ?

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

53 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

We certainly wasted a lot of money over those couple of years... Butterfield (£5m), Anya (£4m), Shackell (£3.5m), Blackman (£3m), Camara (£1.5m). Even Olsson for £600k was a waste when we already had Fozzy and Lowe coming through. Johnson cost a lot but at least he played 142 games for us.

There's still time for Lampard's signings to prove their worth (Waghorn, Marriott, Jozefzoon and Malone)

Think Waghorn will fall into the same category as BJ in that it’s highly unlikely we’ll recoup any money on him but he’s been a decent player during his time. 

[Rab a dab doo]

It's not always about the 'sell on' value of the player that totally determines whether he is a success or failure he it what does/bring to a club.

This is not always depend upon how long they stay.

A player can have one magical season and single-handedly get a side promoted and then disappear /lose form. 

We may not always see or appreciate what he contributes, in terms of endeavour,effort, skill, commitment but we always tend to focus on his end product. 

Remember the 'worth' of anything just like beauty is the eye of the beholder. 

 

[cheron85]

20 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Big fees on Bradley,  butters, blackman each of which recouped us 0. Weimann we apparently lost a couple of £m on as well.

I've firmly decided to look at Bradders the other way around

£6m and we got 140ish appearances and what 14 goals out of him?

Rob Earnshaw - £3.5m paid, £2.65m received - 22 appearances and 1 goal

So we got better value out of Johnson than Earnshaw yet we recouped money for Earnshaw

With Bradders we made the playoffs 3 our of 4 seasons - We Earnshaw we got the worst points in premier league history

?‍♂️

[RadioactiveWaste]

2 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

I've firmly decided to look at Bradders the other way around

£6m and we got 140ish appearances and what 14 goals out of him?

Rob Earnshaw - £3.5m paid, £2.65m received - 22 appearances and 1 goal

So we got better value out of Johnson than Earnshaw yet we recouped money for Earnshaw

With Bradders we made the playoffs 3 our of 4 seasons - We Earnshaw we got the worst points in premier league history

?‍♂️

Well, there was also that earnshaw decided very early he didn't want to be here and didn't give a toss about trying the whole time, where as Bradders, whatever his limitations, was at the very least wholehearted.

[Steve How Hard?]

14 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Well, there was also that earnshaw decided very early he didn't want to be here and didn't give a toss about trying the whole time, where as Bradders, whatever his limitations, was at the very least wholehearted.

Agreed. Not quite sure why he's been dragged into this debate. Despite the fact that the deal brokered for him  wasn't ideal for either party, the lad tried his hardest to make it work and never hid in games. I think once he was brought off the naughty step by FL he was pivotal in getting us over the line and into the play offs.  I haven't got a bad word to say about the bloke tbh.

[whiteroseram]

53 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

I've firmly decided to look at Bradders the other way around

£6m and we got 140ish appearances and what 14 goals out of him?

Rob Earnshaw - £3.5m paid, £2.65m received - 22 appearances and 1 goal

So we got better value out of Johnson than Earnshaw yet we recouped money for Earnshaw

With Bradders we made the playoffs 3 our of 4 seasons - We Earnshaw we got the worst points in premier league history

?‍♂️

I was thinking this, there seem to be a few weird example atm of people focusing on the fees. Paper said the other day that Everton were set for a "blow" as they'll sell Morgan Schneiderlin for less that what they paid for him...they've got 73 games at a decent level out of him and probably amortised most of that transfer fee in their accounts, don't think them making a loss on the fee they paid 3 years ago worries them too much.

 

The thing that did us over with how Johnson is remembered is partly our own accounting meaning we basically had to write off all £6million in one go in our accounts when we released him. Hopefully that's not the case with Anya.

 

For what its worth, that season Anya was an U23s regular with rumours around additional payments (thanks Rush) he worked harder than most seniors do when they're in the U23, but I do feel that season finished him off here. As for loans, who knows. If he lives in Derby with family or whatever here and the loans like Blackpool, SPL London or whatever I wouldn't blame him for turning it down, especially if he plans on retiring now.