Gee SCREAMER !! Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, CornwallRam said: George Burley pretty instantly improved results and stabilised us in the division. He used the following season to rebuild, but you could always see what he was trying to do. Things never looked chaotic. The players never looked bemused. George Burley also ultimately failed. By your logic we need to give Cocu time to fail. The existence of our club is currently in jeopardy. We are likely to go into administration if we are relegated. Mel also wants to secure investment. Are we financially secure without that investment? Does a relegation battle make investment more or less likely? How much influence do 32Red have? I believe that replacing Cocu is both the right thing to do and Mel's only option. It wouldn't surprise if we have just seen Cocu's last game. You can't build on sand. All this is generally correct. However as I remember it Burley didn't fail. He walked after creating a very good attacking team from some magic beans. He had considerable differences with the three amigos and there sheriff. When they cashed in on the best two players we had on transfer deadline day he'd had enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 When he arrived I passed little comment but wished him well as it was obvious it was going to be a tricky season and he has had a tremendous amount go against him in terms of injuries or being told some of our players are better than they are - he gives all the players a chance to prove themselves and he has given youth a chance as well - my only criticism is that we don’t seemingly play our best players in our perceived best formation but within that we don’t know the true fitness of players we have available he needs time and patience and some decent luck and we will do well and most sensible supporters will acknowledge that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 5 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: This is the Championship the players he gets might not be up to his standard. ? What was the excuse under Rowett? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Share Posted December 26, 2019 Just now, Mafiabob said: What was the excuse under Rowett? He walked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CornwallRam Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said: All this is generally correct. However as I remember it Burley didn't fail. He walked after creating a very good attacking team from some magic beans. He had considerable differences with the three amigos and there sheriff. When they cashed in on the best two players we had on transfer deadline day he'd had enough. True. But he didn't get us promoted. Things change quickly in football, which is why long term building strategies rarely work, even with managers who show promise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 13 minutes ago, CornwallRam said: George Burley pretty instantly improved results and stabilised us in the division. He used the following season to rebuild, but you could always see what he was trying to do. Things never looked chaotic. The players never looked bemused. George Burley also ultimately failed. By your logic we need to give Cocu time to fail. The existence of our club is currently in jeopardy. We are likely to go into administration if we are relegated. Mel also wants to secure investment. Are we financially secure without that investment? Does a relegation battle make investment more or less likely? How much influence do 32Red have? I believe that replacing Cocu is both the right thing to do and Mel's only option. It wouldn't surprise if we have just seen Cocu's last game. You can't build on sand. You’ve named the problem in this post..... and I hope by sticking with Cocu he’s going to solve it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said: He walked. Hahahahaha, hypocrite..... I’m sure you didn’t like his football, but got a lot of decent results..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmu Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 I wasn't sure should I start thread about Cocu in/out or Merry Christmas... so maybe I'll start one about Chris Martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Share Posted December 26, 2019 1 minute ago, Mafiabob said: Hahahahaha, hypocrite..... I’m sure you didn’t like his football, but got a lot of decent results..... I didn't like his football, but I'm no hypocrite. I always said that if he took us up then you couldn't say anything. But he didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Share Posted December 26, 2019 Just now, Dimmu said: I wasn't sure should I start thread about Cocu in/out or Merry Christmas... so maybe I'll start one about Chris Martin. Do so. Cocu looked like he knew how to play him and Lawrence, and/or him and Marriott but now he doesn't. Martin and all the front players are suffering from the awful set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 13 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: None of our strikers could make a silk purse out of the creative midfield/wide players Cocu sets up. All looked poor. Marriott today - played out wide ffs. Lawrence isn't a winger/wideman. Holmes is barely a footballer yet he stays on over Sibley. Sibley who gets dropped for Whittaker, who isn't ready but takes Knights place who needs experience. Nope sorry we are NOT as bad as Cocu has us looking, not by a long chalk. I fully agree with your first point, our strikers look poor because the chances created for them are usually not quality. In fairness Waghorns goal is the first time a striker has found space in the box to get a proper strike on goal for a long time. Ive not watched the game yet, and Radio Derby don’t exactly go into great details on what’s happening formation wise. Presumably though I guess the plan would be for Marriott to play on the shoulder against the full back which I guess he was doing? I’m not sure what Lawrence is doing at the minute, two games out may be the best thing for him now. Holmes tried but has looked every bit a league 1 player. I guess once Bird has to come on then the likeliness of a Bird, Sibley and Knight midfield may have been a risk too far A reactive manager might make us look better but how long would it last? Lots of managers have tried now and we’ve only got to a play off final and lost twice. That project has failed, we need to ride this out now, have a half decent transfer window and get through to the end of the season. Next summer will be massive and we have to get it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 Think it’ll come as a surprise to absolutely no one that I’m still Cocu out. He lost my faith when he went all defensive against QPR, and he’s shown nothing since to win it back. In fact, what we’ve seen since has just further justified my view that he’s the wrong man for the job. He’s been dealt a tough hand, don’t get me wrong, and I do feel for him. He seems like a nice enough bloke, and he’s been given a poor squad, compounded by poor recruitment and the joiners affair. It’s left him with a difficult job, and I’ve certainly toned down my pre season expectations of making progress towards the top 2 (natural progression from top 6 last season) accordingly. I can accept that it’ll take a year, maybe even two, before we’re at a standard to do so now. But I still expect to see some progress being made towards a clearly defined attacking style of play, ultimately ending in a mid table finish this season, clear of any relegation danger, with clear showings of promise within the team so that we can see that with better players, we can challenge for the top 6 again next season. At the moment, I’m seeing none of that. From what I’ve seen, Cocu is an overly cautious defensive manager, which is in line with what PSV and Fenerbache fans have said, and makes him entirely the wrong man for the job continuing on from Lampard. I’ve seen no defined style of play so far that gives me hope that we’ll see proper attacking football any time soon. In fact, it barely looks like there’s a plan at all, and if there is one, it’s certainly defence first. That’s not the philosophy we work towards as a club across all age levels - he’s the wrong man for the job, so he has to go. There’s no point keeping him on for continuities sake, he’s the wrong man, so we’ve got to get shot before he causes lasting damage. That’s before we even consider that we’re being dragged closer and closer towards a relegation battle that we should be nowhere near. Inconsistency I can accept, but this? This is just consistent poo. Relegation would set us years back and totally destroy our long term plans. It would be disaster, and the threat of that is reason enough to change the manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 Our best game under Cocu was the first of the season , and we have gone backwards ever since. His main fault is his caution - he is not a risk taker. Our couple of good performances frightened him so much he has retreated to the sterile negative displays of the last two months. There is no solution with him, his caution is inbuilt. Doubtless he can claim to have been unlucky with events but not all his frequent team changes have been forced by the events. The players have clearly lost confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TramRam Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 Cocu and staff are on 4 year contracts, He's had a very short time to get in what players he could, The play off final squad has been sent back, Paid off, Moved on or sacked, He's brought in a coach who knows more than most about this division, Yet we're looking pretty awfull at the mo. Sack Cocu and co will cost a small fortune(unless his contract says "if you're results are rubbish DCFC can sack you without compensasion"), So MM sacks Cocu, A new Manager will have to assess the squad, Look where players are needed, Get a new coaching team in, Teach those here how to play for the new Manager/system and hope he hits the floor running. I'd keep. Marriott Martin Waghorn Bogle(if not sold) Wisdom Rooney Lowe Holmes Bielik Shinnie Clarke(on loan) All those under 23 players. The rest either to old, Not good enough or who don't see a future here for themselves. So a tall order for any new Manager imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralRam Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 In, but I wouldn’t shed any tears if he went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sexydadbod Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Sasha said: Cocu needs an opportunity, 2 transfer windows, enough changing managers. If you were Mel, would you trust him with your money? I certainly wouldn’t, there’s a possibility that he’d be another Clement with his signings and set us back further years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 7 minutes ago, GeneralRam said: In, but I wouldn’t shed any tears if he went. So out then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 This thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atherstoneram Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said: No, it's to see how opinions stand now. What do you want the result to be? No.you are hoping it changes to what you want it to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i-Ram Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 I haven’t bothered voting today. Pretty sure there will be another vote next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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