Playing out from the Back

[TommyPowell]

58 minutes ago, Carnero said:

All we need is some common sense, play out from the back where possible, if nothing is on then go long, preferably to one of the wings.

It's not rocket science.

I'm looking at you Kelle Roos.

If it was as easy as we fans think at times then clubs would pat managers/coaches as much as they do

[Anag Ram]

18 minutes ago, deanoakaram4life said:

The continuous hipocricy of the fans baffles me. When Rowett is lumping long balls up field we moan, and now when we are trying to play proper football we moan. 

It happens with most teams who are trying to do it, Norwich last year and Huddersfield under Wagner all took a season to get their feet under the carpet. Cocu has barley had a pre season, and needs this year to lay down the philosophy.

 The big worry for me is the recruitment team. Chris Evans was terrible and Joe Maclaren needs sacking. Stuart Webbers work at Norwich and Huddersfield has to be commended, and a recruitment strategy like those teams needs to be looked at.

It just seems we recruit via google. Who’s available and cheap?

When you recruit for any position the key thing is to identify what type of person who are dealing with.

Do they have fire in their belly? Will they work hard for the team?

And a key area, do they have a good footballing brain?

Will they make the good split second decisions that make the difference?

 I agree that we need to change our recruitment team ASAP or we will waste another window.

 

[Tyler Durden]

3 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

Do they have fire in their belly? Will they work hard for the team?

And a key area, do they have a good footballing brain?

Will they make the good split second decisions that make the difference?

Gaviscon is good for that in my experience.

Other brands are available 

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

34 minutes ago, deanoakaram4life said:

 

 The big worry for me is the recruitment team. Chris Evans was terrible and Joe Maclaren needs sacking. Stuart Webbers work at Norwich and Huddersfield has to be commended, and a recruitment strategy like those teams needs to be looked at.

Couldn’t agree more with this, I know it’s early days as well but it looks like the £10m(?) spent on Bielik could have been spent more wisely in other areas, I thought he was going to be this strong, dominant, ball playing CDM instead, he gets shoved out the way far too easily, misses headers, steps over the ball until he confuses himself and loses it. 

Time and time again we go big on transfers and it comes back to bite us in the arse, I hate bringing up this old chestnut but we haven’t signed good players on the cheap since the days of Nigel Clough and he was ridiculed because apparently his paper shop brother did the scouting. I wonder if his brother fancies a job? 

[Sith Happens]

4 minutes ago, QuitYourJibbaJivin said:

Couldn’t agree more with this, I know it’s early days as well but it looks like the £10(?) spent on Bielik could have been spent more wisely in other areas, I thought he was going to be this strong, dominant, ball playing CDM instead, he gets shoved out the way far too easily, misses headers, steps over the ball until he confuses himself and loses it. 

Time and time again we go big on transfers and it comes back to bite us in the arse, I hate bringing up this old chestnut but we haven’t signed good players on the cheap since the days of Nigel Clough and he was ridiculed because apparently his paper shop brother did the scouting. I wonder if his brother fancies a job? 

Seems like a bargain to me.

Agree on Clough. I know its been discussed to death and yeah he had failures (even Ferguson did), but some of the players he bought in, prompted from the academy. He really did do a fantastic Job.

Instead of sacking him Sam Rush would maybe have been better bringing McClaren in as his first team coach (although i doubt he would have taken it, but then again he was doing the same at QPR at the time)

[Carnero]

8 minutes ago, TommyPowel said:

If it was as easy as we fans think at times then clubs would pat managers/coaches as much as they do

[S8TY]

41 minutes ago, irobinson said:

Not  opposed to it - but need a keeper and personnel to do it 

Spot on ....we don’t have the players for it and I think it’s probably dissapointed Cocu how easily we give the ball away...I’ve  played in Holland several times on football tours and the most obvious thing that struck me straight away was how technical they were and comfortable on the ball ...this is why I’m surprised we haven’t got a few foreign players in ....our scouting system is crap 

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

2 minutes ago, Paul71 said:

Seems like a bargain to me.

?

[Sith Happens]

3 minutes ago, Carnero said:

I'd got a mental image of Mel as blofeld and Cocu curled up on his lap like his white cat.

[ivo_knoflicek]

26 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

Maybe we should be looking at getting David Wheater in?

I’ve never heard oat like it

[BramcoteRam84]

When we do it right as we have done in a lot of games this season, it works and it looks good. Definitely continue with it but we need to mix it up. Strikers not making the right runs to give the defence and midfield alternative options to get up the pitch. Regardless of it being Leeds, that first 45 was nowhere near good enough yesterday!

[Steve How Hard?]

27 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

Maybe we should be looking at getting David Wheater in?

Rye would you even say that?

[RamNut]

Dear all

Playing out from the back seems to mean passing it around for no real purpose until we're about to get into real trouble, then hoof it under pressure and lose possession.

its an interesting tactic. Eventually some good must come of it. Probably after you've lost about ten goals trying it.

Personally i don't understand why you would want your least able, most technically deficient players to twit about on the ball.

your humble servant

T Pulis. 

 

[AndyinLiverpool]

There is a loud voice inside me that screams, 'How hard can it be?'

I seem to remember the general principle was that when your team had the ball, you made yourself available to receive it. You don't stand around waiting for the thing to somehow find its way to you. Granted, I haven't played in a while but the game has not changed that much. 

[GrimsbyRam]

49 minutes ago, QuitYourJibbaJivin said:

Couldn’t agree more with this, I know it’s early days as well but it looks like the £10m(?) spent on Bielik could have been spent more wisely in other areas, I thought he was going to be this strong, dominant, ball playing CDM instead, he gets shoved out the way far too easily, misses headers, steps over the ball until he confuses himself and loses it. 

Time and time again we go big on transfers and it comes back to bite us in the arse, I hate bringing up this old chestnut but we haven’t signed good players on the cheap since the days of Nigel Clough and he was ridiculed because apparently his paper shop brother did the scouting. I wonder if his brother fancies a job? 

I really think Bielek is restricted by having no midfielders or wide players to support.  

Two holding midfielders would only work if you had someone mobile with him. Bielek would have worked perfectly with our midfield last year. He is always looking to go on the front foot. Unfortunately there was no outlet and movement in front of him which meant that he had to turn and try to take somebody on. 

With the wingers we have at our disposal, I’d scrap playing them, encourage Malone/Lowe and Bogle to push forward from wide and have players with an engine either side of Bielek (ie Holmes, Knight, Sibley, Shinnie and even possibly Paterson) or a diamond and then play two up front.

Like to see:-

                      Who knows (GK)

 

Bogle         Keogh          Clarke           Lowe

                             Bielek    

           Knight                      Holmes

                   Lawrence/Paterson

             Waghorn/Martin     Marriott 

For me Davies cannot come in at the back as he is so uncomfortable on the ball. 

[Ellafella]

2 hours ago, Mucker1884 said:

Not sure today is the best time to assess our attributes for this. 
We've just played by far the best pressing team in the division.  They are exceedingly good at it, despite what the result shows. 
I doubt we'll struggle so much against anyone else, and particularly at home, so gotta be worth persevering with for a while longer, at least. 

Correct Sir! Yet their home results are starting to show a flaw in Bielsa’s gruelling demands...they’re forked after 65 minutes so if you’re still in the game at that point you can pick them off in the final 25 mins. Credit to Cocu...he got it tactically right. He just needs to find the right starting combination and we’ll start to see more points on the board. 

I’d be tempted to get Sibley in the squad. I think he’s got real potential. 

[Marriot Ram99]

I am not a fan of Cardiff style football , but yesterday and all season apart from Huddersfield the football has been slow , turgid and completely ineffective. Keogh and Clarke are not good enough on the ball to play this way IMO, Keogh passed the ball back to Roos every ducking time , who then just hoofed it randomly back to them, you may as well just hoof straight from your centre back or play a slide ball down the channels for Marriott to chase than doing that.  Its not completely the defenders fault as the midfield movement was poor, but I just think the Clarke and Keogh are slow in their decision making and can't see a pass well,  if we had someone with a lot of quality on the ball we could use our centre backs to build up, but as it is I would rather we get the ball quickly into the midfield and then build up from there or direct to Martin or Marriott.

[Shipley Ram]

The same question is being asked of other clubs

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2019/sep/21/arsenal-sokratis-papastathopoulos-playing-out-from-back-risk

[desirelines]

2 hours ago, deanoakaram4life said:

The continuous hipocricy of the fans baffles me. When Rowett is lumping long balls up field we moan, and now when we are trying to play proper football we moan. 

Agree with this. I'm sure we've all sat near that bloke at PP to shouts "CLEAR IT CLEAR IT CLEAR IT" when we're playing around the back, then immediately throws his arms in the air and lets out an almighty howl of incredulity once the ball is cleared and Marriott doesn't win the arial battle with their 6ft4 centre-back. 

[Marriot Ram99]

1 minute ago, desirelines said:

Agree with this. I'm sure we've all sat near that bloke at PP to shouts "CLEAR IT CLEAR IT CLEAR IT" when we're playing around the back, then immediately throws his arms in the air and lets out an almighty howl of incredulity once the ball is cleared and Marriott doesn't win the arial battle with their 6ft4 centre-back. 

That wouldn't be a problem if we won second balls,  our midfield were made to look amateurish by Leeds yesterday as they didn't seem to win a single second ball. When Knight ,Martin and Paterson came on we looked better, I would like to see them all start vs Brum.