S8TY

Morris is the reason we are where we are ! mismanagement starts and ends with him

Because of the manner of how we play for the first time in many years I'm thinking of not making the long trip up from Kent as It's really horrendous football.....I want warne to succeed i really do but I just can't see me ever saying .."wow we are controlling games and outplaying teams " I know we are a world away from Brighton and where they currently are ....but there lies a good example of how to do it ...get good coaches and keep the same playing style, If anyone watches how Brighton played at United yesterday the football, passing and moving is quality and light years ahead of our archaeic turgid football ....I just can't see it changing under Warne I'm afraid

The dream team for DCFC for me has always been Mac and Clough ( not saying its feasible ) but both like to play football one has a very good eye on spotting a player and the other has good tactical awareness 

Would never happen i know but those 2 would be worth a 4 year deal because they would have us playing some good football and Nigel knows how to work on a shoestring

realistically though Mark Warburton would be my choice as hes a good coach and tries to play football on the grass 

9 hours ago, Chris_Martin said:

just curious, after all that why are you still wanting warne in charge?

That was a month ago 

1 minute ago, uttoxram75 said:

We should have been 2-0 up before they even entered our half.

After that i thought it was a fairly even battle between two average teams. We looked like a team that has just been put together, with our first choice players out injured.

Pompey are the only unbeaten team in League One and they managed to snatch a 95th minute draw against us.

From what I’ve seen so far in L1 a half decent side would walk this division …Portsmouth aren’t great and so far no one has looked that great …including us!! This was Warnes big chance to shine this season and so far it’s been very poor 

For all of those who didn’t have the patience for Roseniors football in its learning stage let me say this 

the football if you can call it that which is being dished up at the mo is absolute utter garbage 

even if Pep were to take over he’d start by getting us to keep the ball and learn how and when to go forward….cue the moaners who’d be saying it was dull !!

but now for any manager who wants to come in and try to get us to play keep ball and open up teams you’ll be watching Rosenior football again until it’s mastered and the players are the right players …so…long road ahead !! 

5 hours ago, Magicman said:

We all entitled to an opinion. In mine he is a duff signing and like Keogh prone to errors under pressure. 

What? After a couple of games ? You know he’s duff?

19 hours ago, Magicman said:

Hoping Smith moves to RB and we can keep Neldson Cashin & Fozzy line up. Bradley is so poor he makes Albentosa look a star. 

Get off his back …he hasn’t started well with a couple of costly errors …but I’ve still seen some good things from him so try backing the fella ffs 

10 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

 If I were a Derby player in L1 I wouldn’t expect my manager to say “we are going to win this league”. What does he say if we fall short (maybe narrowly) and you then confront him as to why he was wrong? I would expect him to say “we have the best squad of players in this league. Our aim this season is to win the league and I can’t see any reason why we shouldn’t achieve that objective. We can’t be complacent and there are some decent teams out there but, you are better and we should win the league” or words to that effect.

It’s not complacency the way I look at it I would gain confidence from the  manager if he was saying we are  going to win this league …some managers I’ve played under have really inspired by being confident with the players and have seen players really lift there own game even in the difficult times because we thought we were the best and yes others have failed of course I get it 

I wouldn’t be saying that in the championship at the moment because it’s much more difficult and we are not in the right place at the moment in our re development ..but I would’ve with Maclarens Wembley team because we were the best side in that division towards end of the season and were a much better footballing team than qpr who we undeservedly lost to 

but this is L1 and I’d expect our manager to be confident after a summer of recruitment to be aiming to win this league 

we nearly made the play offs last season so after a summer where our manager had a chance to address any deficiencies in our team I’d expect to be winning it …

2 hours ago, Premier ram said:

Because it leads to high expectations and endless manager and player bashing that’s why

If I were a Derby player in L1 I’d be dissapointed if my manager didn’t say “ we are going to win this league “that is our aim you don’t have to publicly declare that of course but I would think we had the wrong manager if he wasn’t aiming to win it …

the original question was “ are our expectations too high” ? Not should our manager publicly declare it 

23 minutes ago, Premier ram said:

How many managers have you heard say they expect their team to win the league?

I expect any Derby County manager in  L1 to be saying that …why not?

1 hour ago, oodledoodle said:

I don't even really care about promotion. I'd love it, but nobody has a divine right to anything in football. Every team is exactly where they deserve to be, that's the beauty of it.

I just want us to play on the front foot, without fear, without acting like underdogs. It's the negative approach that many people on here have mentioned, and take issue with. But then we get told our expectations are too high, Warne hasn't been given long enough, the team need to gel, we don't have the budget etc etc etc.

Sorry, buy you don't need any of that to play with some balls. We were awful under Rooney, but that team turned up and at least went down swinging. There were no threads like there are now about Rooney. 

We are in League1 due to a massive points deduction …no beauty in that!! so we shouldn’t really be here and we all know who’s to blame for that no one has a divine right and you’re correct but to not think we should win the league is not what I’d want to hear from anyone in management 

we are the biggest club in L1 and with that comes expectations and rightfully so 

53 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

I think the recent comments about Warne setting us up as underdogs rings too true. He hasn’t given us the mentality needed to be ‘favourites’ it seems. He has said Top6 is the aim, giving plenty of scope for more excuses. We started with comments from players saying they expected to go up, is that being lowered? 

I honestly think we should always be aiming to win the league in L1 Roy 

if we fell short and ended up in play offs if I was DC I’d still look at how we’re playing and why we didn’t win it or make autos to see if we’re progressing but our expectations should never be lowered by the manager especially imo 

Look if we as fans can’t have high expectations of being top 6 or automatic promotion in League1 then I despair !!

I mean who in this league should Derby County be worried about ?? 
if we are starting to think the Oxfords, Cambridge and Peterborough and Portsmouths  etc are teams we should be behind id say …give yourself a shake !! 
I mean ffs this league is not great …and if we are now thinking that top6 or top2 is high and over our expectations as fans then be very careful because as my friend who’s a Charlton STH said if you stay down too long you become like a L1 club ….so let’s aim appropriately high and get the fudge out of this s**** division ….

3 hours ago, Archied said:

I know what it is and it’s very much my point that any system style of play takes time and  can look honking , with the greatest respect I’ve been watching derby over 50 years and seen us play all types of styles under many many managers , keep ball bores me senseless, it’s just posh time wasting, give me toe to toe open games all day long ,I don’t drive a 6 hour round trip to fall asleep watching one of those pre game warm up pass it round routines for 90 minutes 

So you think City are boring to watch ? 
Some do think that …I don’t as to me it’s total control football 

2 hours ago, Archied said:

The bit your not getting is the we bit , no offence but you see the we as everybody or even the majority, I didn’t see Liam in the same way as you and at the time most people I spoke to felt similar,

I felt totally frustrated watching us break to the halfway line then turn back , had kittens watching us faff around and lose it constantly in dangerous positions leaving us wide open and can honestly tell you my early thoughts were thank Christ the standard of finishing in league one was so poor or else we would be getting battered every week , either liam was poor at coaching the players to do what he wanted or they wernt up to it , I see plenty saying warne is trying to get players to play a system/ style they aren’t suited to ,

as someone has already stated there really is no point in all this liam v warne stuff , warne either gets the results in a results driven business or he s out 

This is all part of the learning process Archied yes it was frustrating but when you’re introducing a possession based football tactic keeping the ball and going back wards is part of the initial keep ball process …there’s no point in saying there’s not a ball on so just go long into the channels as that is opposite to what a coach is trying to implement but yes I agree in its infancy and when players don’t move and support it’s frustrating going backwards to keep it ..but that’s just part of the learning curve if allowed to carry on it would’ve got better and players would’ve been more comfortable in tight areas …if not then the players would’ve been moved on to ones that can do it ….but I’m not arguing your point but just re iterating that it doesn’t happen overnight mate 

2 hours ago, LeedsCityRam said:

I think it was Lincoln away that did for him & we were poor that night. Unfortunately for Liam, we hadnt converted dominance into goals in the previous 3 away league games (Charlton, Shrewsbury & Fleetwood) and so the narrative of us being impotent away from home was born. Richie Barker even made reference to it in an interview pre-Bolton...brass neck of him to come out with that & then deliver that garbage yesterday.

Rosenior leaving felt at the time & still does as a massive missed opportunity. I don't necessarily think we would've gone up last season but I think the foundations would be much stronger than they are now. Possession based football takes longer to implement (certainly more than the 8 games he got) but has a much higher chance of long term success. He also had connections higher up the pyramid (which he leveraged to bring in quality players) & an obvious affinity with the youth ranks. He was the man to help rebuild the club on the pitch.

Instead we brought in Captain Pinball, with all the fanfare about his 'promotion record' only to spend the last 12 months being finger-wagged that we shouldnt expect promotion & how he always needs another 6 months from the point at which he is questioned. We've gone backwards since Sep 2022 & that is a damning indictment on his appointment. 

Brilliant post and you're spot on with possession

1 hour ago, Yoxoram said:

I'm in the same camp as Archied. The slow turgid passing sideways and sideways and sideways again didn't entertain me either. I was surprised when Rosenior wasn't given the job full time but neither was I unhappy.

The slow keep it method though was part of the first phase of what Liam and Cocu were trying to instill, if its not on you keep the ball, recycle it , etc etc but when I've coached I've always been possesion biased and if its not on don't force it and go backwards if you have to and keep the ball, can  you come out the other side of the pitch if that way is blocked and yes in its infancy it can become turgid but that is mainly because others in the team are not creating overloads and space and its a learning process, Brighton do it very well 

You have to be brave on the ball and sometimes play in tight areas and players like Curtis struggled but eventually players start to move into space to help the player on the ball and it is a learning curve and can be slow and ponderous when first implemented but the emphasis is on keeping the ball and moving it forward when the openings were created and not forcing a ball that wasn't really on in the first place and I see youngsters running out of patience 

But the long term ethos is then embedded and players when and if comfortable are comfortable receiving the ball in tight areas of the pitch especially in the last third.

If we had gone with a manager/coach who likes to play possesion football i believe with some additions we'd have been top 2 this season because I just don't buy into the theory of giving up the ball by playing loose passes and then sitting back but managers and coaches do have different styles of course

PW showed some naivety this season when explaining that we should move the ball quicker from side to side because if its too slow or theres 1 pass too many good teams will block the pathway...but that comment said a lot because thats in most coaching modules for under 11s and 12s so he didn't need to say that because its not rocket science 

I like Warne but I cannot see him changing his football philosophy and its not his fault because he wasn't really right for us, I cannot see Warne using the 2 week break to work on possesion and controlling the game but those two things alone would help our performance and us fans might think we're not sitting back so much 

A good example of possesion based football is obviously Pep at City but in his first season he struggled and didn't pull up many trees so to speak but it didn't stop him continuing and instilling the belief in his players to be brave and keep the ball 

We aren't City i know but looking at the most succesful teams at the moment they do keep the ball much better than us and I don't think the Rowett style of football is the way forward, the big problem now is...if Warne was to be replaced we have players   that i believe would not be suited to that type of football 

I really hope Warne see this as an oppurtunity to get us playing decent stuff but his recent 3 promotions in L1 may well scupper any notion of change but we shall see i guess.........COYR

3 minutes ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Absurd to judge on this bonkers game.

Early injury to Rooney
Handball in their pen ignored
We put the ball in the net yet have to score via a penalty
Smith foul - was it outside the area?
Why didn't the lino flag for Wildsmith  handling outside the area and subsequent red card, yet the ref makes the decision after speaking to him
Foul on Bradley in their pen ignored
Bolton defender handling in their pen ignored

Not that Warne doesn't have questions to answer over some of his decisions, but the worst thing is having to wait 2 weeks to be able to start to put things right

I wasn't judging just on this game

Interesting to see that some Warne fans are slowly turning and I'm one of them 

Nice bloke I like Warne and this was his big chance, he could not turn down the oppurtunity to manage a much bigger club than Rotherham and I admire his honesty but it's seriously not going to change much IMO

What I mean is the football is dreadful and when Oxford were passing it around us at home I thought it was a bit embarrasing that we were chasing shadows , plenty of huff and puff but very little technique and tactics other than the usual get crosses into the box etc etc 

I cannot remember a manager who's so set on a specific anti football style then suddenly turning it around and playing great football .....it just doesnt happen , you have to see roots of growth and something that you think is encouraging but I'm not seeing it...

Cocu was an International footballer and had played for Barcelona but joined the club at bad time just before the season started and with all of Lampards loanees gone and with only a few weeks before the season started yet he was dismissed yet some want to give Mr Warne a few seasons with no credible signs of improvement after a year!

I like possesion football and have never liked a game plan where you let the opposition have the ball and If we had a manager who was trying to get us playing more coherently and keeping the ball then I'd say give them time because some of the better sides play this way Brighton for example play great stuff but the success is down to getting the right managers in Potter and De Zerbi , who had heard of either before Brighton employed them ??

Our choice of manager cannot be based on a track record of getting out of League 1 as for me that is too short sighted ...we need someone who's going to play and build a team that is sustainable in the championship if and when we get there ....

This is why I am now leaning towards the Warne out camp but only if he is replaced with someone who will play a good style of football not another PW type like Macarthy or Big Sam as these managers are now dinosaurs ...the game has moved on....

Because he's ex Forest this will be unpopular but Mark Warburton is looking for a managerial position after leaving West Ham and he would be my choice, plays good football and has a good eye for talent or maybe try and tempt Graham Potter to come back into a lower level with big bonuses for promotion and success , someone who will get us playing a brand of football we'd like to watch , may sound optimistic but why not ? we are Derby County and have a fantastic fan base and for the right manager this is a dream job where they could build something long term .....not a Darren Moore either ...I don't see PW turning what we are currently seeing into something we'd like to see each week....

1 hour ago, Jourdan said:

The squad McClaren inherited took 4-5 years to build. Rosenior built our squad in a matter of weeks having to get what he could, and with little to no thought to the future.

That’s the point.

McClaren was able to come in and raise levels so quickly, one because he is a very good coach but also largely because all of the hard work and laying of foundations had been done and the blood, sweat and tears had been wiped away.

We are still in the blood, sweat and (a lot of) tears stage. So maybe that’s the reason why Warne hasn’t had the same impact as McClaren - because the squad still requires a lot of work due to the restrictions in place, and perhaps he will have to build those foundations.

If you seriously think Warne is in the same class as Mac as a coach then please just stop right there !

Warne could be given the same players Mac had and you wouldn't see the same type of football we saw under Mac 

The POINT which is very valid is, regardless of the so called blood sweat and tears that you mention Clough did not get us playing how Mac did , so therefore Mac takes a lot of credit for being able to coach that and of course Clough should take credit for assembling the squad

The players we had when Rosenior was here were because Rosenior wanted us to play possesion type football so why bring in a manager who doesn't  want to continue or enhance that ....

I don't trust Warne to bring in the players to get us back to playing some decent entertaining stuff so lets just leave it there eh 

19 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

You can’t pine after a McClaren style team, but neglect the fact that that very team took four to five years to build and a lot of tweaking and some really tough patches to swallow beforehand.

We can all accept the football isn’t good to watch at the moment and there are issues to resolve. Maybe we need to take the pain before some joy follows.

No-one is enjoying our play at the moment, but with time, is it possible things will click? We didn’t start playing our best and most coherent football last season until November/December, but once we found our stride, we got results and played some lovely football. So let’s not pretend it’s not possible and let’s not pretend all of our good players will be bypassed.

We’re going through a tough patch at the moment but surely we should see what this team looks like when we have a settled eleven with a clear and well-informed approach?

Warne is still obviously on a fact finding mission, much like he was in his first 6-10 games in charge last autumn when people said the same things you are saying now.

We need to ride it out and see how things settle down and whether it bears any fruit in the months to come.

It didn't take Mac 4 to 5 years to get us playing nice stuff ?

He took over a side that was predominantly possesion type players the same Warne did , the difference is Mac tweaked it and got us scoring more and playing better.

Warne has come in and not got us playing better, this is my point, why appoint a manager who doesn't play similarly to what we had in our squad, nothing wrong with getting us fitter but I still think a good manager/coach who likes to play football on the grass would've got this team firing and what i mean by that is...playing more cohesively and controlling games more.

We are no more in control of a game whether playing Bolton a top side in this division or a Fleetwood who aren't 

53 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

Let’s see where we are after 20-25 games.

It has been an unconvincing start to the season, but there’s no need to hit the panic button. Warne has two weeks now to take stock and hopefully pinpoint and work on issues. We are four points off the top, not fourteen. We have forty games to course correct, not four. Let’s not overreact.

The concerns over the performances and the style of play are valid, but equally the side isn’t settled in any way and evidently that makes performing fluently more difficult.

Injuries, suspensions, players new and old struggling to blend, some players desperately struggling for fitness and form, and of course game changing lapses by officials and experienced players - there are a multitude of issues that are hitting us hard all at once.

What can we truly read into six league games? One week, everything goes for us, the next nothing does. We need a bigger sample size and we need a more settled XI and more coherent and consistent set up before we can judge. Could this side look different with a back four and Fornah, Embleton and Thompson in midfield, for instance?

People want to press the eject button before a squad with 11 new signings and a manager 12 months into the job and still working things out genuinely finds true synergy.

Comparing us to Bolton, where Evatt has been in charge for three years and has been able to tweak and improve the team year on year, is pointless. The circumstances are completely different.

We need to give it time.

Agree to some extent but this is why I'm a bit concerned 

I think if you gave PW say 3-4 gifted players who could make a difference it won't matter as we don't go out to control a game 

With good players you want them to make a difference and without the ball how does this happen ?

The best players in the world would be in-effective if everytime we got the ball we looked to play percentage football 

I know this is old hat but when Mac got Clough's players playing some great attacking , non percentage football I always thought we were in the game even if we went 1-0 down.

A good example of this was Brighton away in the first leg of the playoff

Brighton went 1-0 up yet we didn't panic played our game and got back into it and deservedly won 

My big fear is good, decent players are being nullified to an extent because we are not looking to play football through the thirds and today most succesful sides do try and play football even in division 3

I get a bit embarrased at times witnessing how we play when we have some good players and would like to see us overloading areas of the pitch and opening teams up with good quick passing and moving 

I am now very 50/50 on PW a bloke I like and want him to succeed but when some rightly say we now have 2 weeks to work on things ...what exactly are we going to work on ?

Not keeping the ball and a bit of possesion and dragging teams out of shape ? as I don't see much evidence that is Warne's style

I just wish DC had got a manager who likes to play the game in a nicer fashion .....I still think most teams who have more of the ball tend to have more chance of winning 

From what I’m hearing though we didn’t play any football though and that won’t do regardless of result referee or whatever!