BondJovi

1 minute ago, Ramewe said:

 

How a team does post punishment is irrelevant. Were we meant to roll over and go away? Bullying.

Duck em. Duck the lot of them.

30 minutes ago, Red_Dawn said:

I know and given your unfortunate situation I don't think you wouldn't get 8-10m. But banter aside there is talent that could be sold to make up the 7m (was it?) that the EFL demand to see.

I just don't see what your admins are doing bar dithering and delaying the inevitable? Even Ed Dawes was alluding to the same the other day.

We might make that amount, but we are easy pickings. With the number  of players out of contract in the summer  their value is significantly less. Do other teams in this league really have the funds to be generous?

We already only have 11 players over the age of 21. A few sales and injuries and what can we field?

All that then does is make a mockery of the competition. Will Stoke be impressed that we did the double over them but their play off rivals might get much easier games. Would that claim be any less valid than those of Middlesbrough and Wycombe?

I think the efl and sky are missing a trick. This has the potential to be one of the all time greatest escapes in football, all led by an England legend in Rooney. This should be a fairytale, the ultimate feel good story. 

When the lead football story is Arsenal wimping out of another game, true professionalism, true desire and passion is going by under the radar.

There is nothing but misery in the news, politicians treating the public like clowns, you would think for the positive reaction, the potential for selling how exciting this league can be they should not be putting up obstacles.

Our punishment has been served. The man responsible for all that is long gone. Let Rooney, the staff and the players keep up the fight for the impossible.

5 minutes ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

I didn't want him as manager, I thought the media campaign against Cocu was engineered and I wasn't comfortable with the appointment of Wayne.

But, I have voted excellent. This is the lowest point for me as a Derby fan, but I feel nothing but pride when I think of what Wayne is doing and how the players are fighting.

The only way I could be any happier with him is if he comes out today after the game and tears the EFL a new one.

Same here. At this point in time, there is nothing to lose by being outspoken. He has led with a classy calm,but I think a Fergie style complaint/rant today would see him in legend status or further enhance it. 

19 hours ago, sage said:

Yes..,in Cocu's first season. He started the second season poorly under Cocu and hasn't improved since. 

He did, but was injured after 4/5 games. Never really had a fair crack since.

1 hour ago, Carl Sagan said:

Exactly this! Brilliant off the field but needs to be braver and more forward thinking on it.

Mark O'Brien was interesting in the post-match on Radio Derby, saying we need to change our set up to be more forward thinking, get the ball forward much more quickly and press high. But to do that I think Rooney can't keep filling the team with so many defensively minded players.

Seems he is in the Nigel Clough management school so far. Which I honestly believe is exactly what we need, though given our points deducted, that cautious nature won't get us out, or even close.

My real gripe with Rooney remains the same, a failure to get the best out of Sibley and Jozwiak. He could do better here. 

2 hours ago, Ken Tram said:

This is exactly my point!

Don't make changes at the end to nick 3 points! The chance if turning 1 point into 0 is too high.

Keep on playing the way that we have been.

Weneed to get the extra goals from improving aspects of our current game, rather than changing formation to try to nick wins.

I think ...

The plan needs to be win the game when we are on top. Sadly it is something we have struggled to do since the start of last season. Too many times our good spells in games either see us 1-0 up or still 0-0 and this tends be in the first half. Momentum then changes in the second half and we struggle to turn it around., for whatever reason. 

We do need to win matches, so we have to take more gambles. But if we are to try and win the game, changes have to be made sooner.

There aren't many times, if any, in a career as a professional footballer when you can play matches with zero pressure. In a league when any team can beat any, we are a dangerous team to face. Whilst we haven’t been a particular goal threat, we have largely remained tough to beat. We started the season the same way, no one expected anything of us, written off.

My fear though is when staying up becomes a realistic chance. If the pressure comes back...the other issue is if players start thinking about their future if we are down early.

Just enjoy this ride as a fan, you never know.

1 hour ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

There's only one person to blame for all of this, one..

He's lied to us, conned us and left us high and dry.

The EFL are applying rules that are in place for every single club. 

We've lost more than we should. 

Morris tried to flount the rules, failed and left us.

Putting us in administration was the final nail.

But if you wanna sing F the EFL for applying punishments to us for breaking rules that we knew were there and knew what the punishment would be then go ahead.

I agree mostly. However, we have been under some form of embargo for 2 seasons and will continue to be under some form for possibly another 2. I don't think that is remotely fair, there has definitely been a willingness on the EFL to ensure we get overly shafted through a long drawn out saga.

Mel, Pearce, the EFL, they have all been inadequate ( to say the least) during this process.

16 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

Back in the day, I'd've agreed with that philosophy. But, nowadays, teams including ours "rest" players, playing youngsters "for experience", in cup competitions and the like.

Given that a 21 point deduction would effectively condemn us to relegation (with this squad, no goalscorer etc), my suggestion would only be an extension of the play-youngsters-in-the-cup idea. 

And, unlike those cup sides, as I said before, I'd balance the number of youngsters with more experienced heads who could mentor them on the pitch.

As for questioning tactics if we did follow my suggestion, I'd say look at the other threads....a lot of folks are proposing the very same thing.

If the points deduction are as suggested, it might well take the fight from some players. We have to balance preparing for next season whilst still remaining competitive. I can't see what we as a club would gain from continuing a Davies and Jagielka partnership each week. A mix of youth and experience, but give each youth a few games run before swapping out.

Allowing the youngsters a less pressured environment to get use to the pace and physicality is an ideal opportunity.

Far rather see them learn(hopefully) than see Lawrence make the usual wrong choice!

25 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

Find it hard to criticise Rooney too much this season. Last season felt different. Derby have fewer options this season, even less competition for places than before, no possibility of buying players and the deduction. 
Apart from a few games recently, Derby have been a tougher team to beat and had a solid defence. Just still the same attacking problems which isn’t down to coaching or management- it’s lack of options - injuries Depth/ lack of quality. 
Can’t believe he’s still here to be honest. He doesn’t need the money. He’s fighting and his conduct has been great. If Derby had a goal scorer and a few more players to add depth, the table would be looking different. 

I actually believe we have a stronger best 11 this season, yes weaker depth, so maybe it cancels out. Certainly we started the season with a stronger team than the one that started last season.

I do though believe we could be getting more out of Sibley and Jozwiak. So I disagree slightly on the attacking front, which I do believe is something Rooney and staff could find a better solution on. Otherwise, great job this season.

There seems to be a lot of hope based on being able to do business in January. There is an awful lot that still needs to happen in less than 10 weeks or so. We could equally end up weaker in January.

Also, a lot of hope being pushed on Bielik. He is that good but I fear the danger of rushing him back, 2 major knee injuries in successive seasons, injuries previous, the way he plays. 

10 games until into January. Leaves us 20 to go. I would imagine we have to ensure that 7 point gap to 4th bottom gets no bigger as an absolute minimum. Anything more and I fear it is done. 

We have two players I believe are capable of being match winners. Lawrence and Sibley.

Rooney has tried to get more out of Lawrence by making him captain and giving him greater responsibility. So far,business as usual. 

I am not certain Rooney really knows how to get the best from Sibley. Or even a willingness to give it a reasonable go. Sibley himself needs to do better aswell. 

I also believe we can get more from Jozwiak. The way we play just doesn't suit him or Sibley. In a side that needs goals, I feel we should be finding a way to get the best from them.

Any talk of sacking Rooney is madness,but I think this is an area he needs to step up.

11 hours ago, PistoldPete said:

It is probably true we made smaller  loss in the last 18 months than in the previous 18 months. I suspect Lampard’s season was the last roll of the dice. Even that year we shaved about £4million off the Wage bill and made a transfer profit. 
 

but it’s the trend that matters . We shaved a lot more off (non sponsored) wage bill in summer 2019. No mount Wilson or tomori.

No nugent Johnson or butterfield either. Still anya and co to get rid of but we were moving in the right direction.

We were probably in line to do even more cutting had Rowett stayed. Letting Lampard roll the dice again was a gamble too far and just made the next season a more serious cutback.

13 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

I had a friend named Cliff, Never really liked him, Always going over the top.

Always liked Cliff, bit of a ledge.

The defender only tries to get the ball because of the striker. He can't know if it is offside or not. As soon as the striker moves towards the ball he is interfering with play. Any touch is minimal. You don't award a goal to the player who deflects a shot that is on target anyway when going in. That pass barely changed direction or speed.

Rules are rubbish.

50 minutes ago, rustylee said:

No because it was a deliberate attempt to play the ball ( clear it) not a deliberate attempt to pass it back to the keeper.

17 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

No

Then doesn't that mean it had to be offside? The striker had gained an advantage regardless of that touch.

13 minutes ago, WoollyJumper said:

Who is to say the appeal may not be being funded by one of the potential buyers?

For Derby to stay in the Championship would be high on a list of priorities for any potential buyer.

It is a gamble...again. And gambling is part of why we are in this mess. Sure, we could get our deduction reduced, but if that result doesn't happen until after January, the fire sale will have happened.

I can't see anyone willing to take over the club until they know our points deduction. If we are allowing a potential buyer to fund this appeal and it fails, if they then back out...back to square one and more time and potentially jobs have been lost. 

1 hour ago, Wazztie16 said:

If he's offside from the first kick by the attacking player, and it goes through without a deliberate play by the defending player, then its offside. If the defending player deliberately plays the ball, the offside resets and there's no offside offence. 

So as per the laws of the game, its onside. Just one of those things. If you want to blame anyone, blame IFAB. 

Say that touch rolls through to the keeper, would it have counted as a back pass?

11 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

EFL didn't slowly screw over Bury did they?  They gave them  a few days to finalise a sale and then when that didnt work at first they  vaporised them with a death ray. Not just screwing them first  but murdering them and boiling the body parts in sulphuric acid to leave not a trace of a 130 year old club. Should we allow EFL to do that to Derby too,  without a defence or fight?

 

 

They have us in a corner. Any appeal costs two things, time and money, which just happen to be two luxuries we don't have. I don't believe it helps us one bit to still be bickering with the efl come January. 

Anyone else beyond tired and bored of this? The best interests are to accept whatever points deduction we get and move on. We will finally know where we stand and we can think about trying to move forward. Appeal this, appeal that, just allows the efl to keep slowly screwing us over. 

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

Might do better with some more experienced heads up front with him.

Maybe so. But it is an area of his game that has stayed the same since we signed him. Jerome, Nugent, Martin, CKR, Rooney, none of them seemed to change his approach.

He is of the age where he needs to be that experienced head in this young team.

Keogh and Mel are made for each other. They were thick as thieves back in the day. Sums up the whole rotten nature of the club. Zero responsibility. 

What a big massive clown.

1 hour ago, i-Ram said:

My personal favourite deal during the Mel era was sending Chris Martin off to Fulham for 12 months, with a likelihood of sale, giving him an extended and enhanced contract 6 months into that deal as Mac wanted him back, sacking Mac 2 months later, and then loaning out Martin for a couple of seasons. Genius.

And finally when we do decide to use him again and a manager wants him, we can't/ won't afford his new deal. Once again shafting ourselves.

10 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Mostly, over the last few seasons Derby have competed at the top of the Championship consistently, which is an incredibly tough thing to do. We have been in the playoffs more than any other team. But for a few sliding doors moments, we would have been in the Premier League. 

Mel has also created a Premier League class academy. We should have won the FA Youth Cup but we did win the English youth league and made impressive progress in the Champions League equivalent.

Football is broken and the rules are written so that you're not allowed to spend money to buy success nowadays, but fans want success so on the whole they're OK with an owner who tries to find a way around the rules to reach the promised land of the Premier League. Almost every Championship club that gets there has had to break the rules to do so, but because they have escaped EFL jurisdiction in the process, they can get away with it. 

Something went wrong. Maybe it's simply funding too many campaigns to reaching the playoffs, but not getting over the line, and the EFL then catches up with you? Or maybe it's Mel's health and he has been forced to prioritize that and his family above the club? Or maybe it's something else again? It's very hard to understand from the outside looking in, and I think we're currently in the middle of the storm, but I won't judge Mel until the situation has become clearer, which might not be for quite a long time yet. 

 

I agree with a lot of that but have a few issues.

One of my long standing issues under the reign of Mel has been a lack of responsibility running through the club. Managers have taken the fall but the players barely seemed to be held accountable for their performances. An air of arrogance ran through the club. Joiners gate exposed it all. By the time Mel learnt, he had already started to pull the plug. His recent interview just highlights this issue. This ethos had to run from top to bottom, never did. Someone I know who had his sources, frequently told me it was a doddle working at Derby.