LeedsCityRam

30 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

Of course he would consider it a failure, of course he admitted he failed. What do you expect him to feel or say? 
 

However, my points are 1) assuming we don’t go up this year then the nature of our “failure” needs to be considered (which chairman in their right mind would sack the manager for finishing 3rd for example?) and 2) I suspect his remit is to get us promoted but not specifically within the first two years (which manager in their right minds, given a four year contract, would resign after two years if they narrowly missed out?).

”Failure” is a powerful word. If we don’t get promoted then PW will have “failed” against his personal hopes and expectations, so he’d obviously be disappointed, but he may not have “failed” against his chairman’s medium term expectations or the expectations laid out to him upon appointment.

You are solely looking at the results angle & everything about Paul Warne is pure short term focus leaving little else to justify his tenure here. What you're overlooking is his long term unsuitability & that also has to be factored into conversations about whether he stays or not. The quality of football is poor & a sizeable section of the fanbase do not enjoy watching it (with potential knock on effect for future PP crowd numbers), he doesn't particularly improve players, there is a misalignment with Academy pathway (refusing to even use EFL Trophy matches to give youngsters game time) & preferred transfer strategy in order for the club to achieve sustainability. Warne wants the likes of Sonny Bradley & Conor Washington to secure his promotion (and Michael Smith given half a chance)...the club will struggle to be sustainable with these types of signings. We brought in Mark Thomas last year to identify cheap, develop & sell high...Warne is not suited to this model.

Clowes appointed Warne to get us a quick promotion & that was the expectation of everyone when he was appointed (and why Rosenior was let go). To take your most extreme hypothetical scenario, as the pure remit for Warne being here is a short term focus of promotion, then defeat at Wembley would still be complete failure with no guarantee of promotion the next year & need to continue down the highly paid experienced pro with no resale value route that Warne prefers. I suspect Clowes will be considering how much longer he can tolerate that misalignment with the long term DCFC strategy come May should we faill to go up.

Not entirely sure why but Stephen Pearce was outside the away stand today as we all left at full time. Was talking to couple of folk but fair to say, the days of public enemy number 1 seem long gone. I suspect like a lot, if David Clowes deems him fit to stay at the club I'm content to trust that judgement.

Just now, Ramarena said:

It was poor and a big opportunity missed against a team who worked hard but didn’t offer a huge amount in the final third. 

I think the thing that is most annoying is a mixture of the players not turning up, tactics being behind the curve and them clearly being a team we can beat.

There’s still plenty to play for, but this was disappointing and concerning.

Exactly this. They were poor but we switched off at 2 key moments despiite being marginally better but below our best. Love Max Bird but his passing was very shaky today & delivery from wide wasn't consistent enough (Wilson at one point beating 3 men & then shanking it into touch!?!) Their fans who I spoke to after match were surprised we sat back after scoring...becoming a very Derby trait this. All about not wanting to control of the game...week in, week out. At least Bolton got beat badly, big 2 weeks ahead (4 games) which will tell us a lot about our true chances of top 2.

Just now, Oldben said:

Only one question, if we face Barnsley in the playoffs can we beat them

No.

1 hour ago, NottsRam77 said:

51k …. Halving in 60 days

prize for the first person that can tell me the price of bitcoin when i started this thread 😉😘🚀

Around $35k but of course it got to around $65k back end of 2021. I do think that was based on retail money rather than the institutional interest it now seems to be attracting

Still can't make my mind up if the ETF is a good thing or not & how it will ultimately reflect on the Bitcoin bull run - certainly the gold ETF seems to be used by 'actors' to artificially suppress the price with 'paper gold' & my concern is the same thing might happen with BTC, Will also be interesting to see the effect of the halving, seeing some wild price predictions out there based on previous price hikes but I think the asset is intrinsically different now to 2020, 2016 etc, Anyroad, HODL to the moon 👍

Kes 2 Derby 0

FGS Bobby Madley

My preferred line up for Saturday below - I would start Gayle irrespective of lack of match time at Stoke. If we go with the final third options from last Saturday, Barnsley will box us in & eventually overwhelm us - we need that out ball & someone for Barkhuizen & Mendez-Laing to play off. I don't expect Gayle to be able to give more than 60 mins but at that point, there should be more space for us to exploit.

I would also revert to a flat back 4 in anticipation of a tough first 45 mins with Bradley dropping out & Nyambe coming in at RB (if fit). Energy on Saturday is going to be crucial also & hence I would look to start Liam Thompson to rat for the ball higher up the park & make runs in support of that front 3. 

2 hours ago, Warren Blufitt said:

I’d be more than happy with a draw in this one. 🙂

So wouid I.....so long as you get beat at Blackpool 😉

So relieved we've got Gayle signed up - Saturday was all the evidence needed to prove this side will struggle without a conventional forward option. Irrespective of lack of match sharpness, he has to start at Barnsley to stretch the pitch or we're going to struggle to get out of our half - if he can give us 60 mins, they will likely have tired enough by then for us to be able to escape the press.

Am not particularly concerned about his spell at Stoke - that club is a graveyard for decent managers & players and given the sheer squad size they have, must be difficult to get consistency in selection & therefore performance. Looking at the highlights reel from last few months he still has plenty of attributes that I believe will make him a success here - quick feet, great decision making, vision/awareness of other players in the final 3rd and a decent finish. Being a stocky type with a low centre of gravity, I'd also like to think he could hold the ball up reasonably well & am looking forward to seeing how he links up with Mendez-Laing & Barkhuizen. Warne will no doubt want him pressing like Collins but that might be a couple of games down the track once he is up to match fitness.

36 minutes ago, ram59 said:

I think that we need 2 new topics on this forum, a happy clappers' one whereby only positive opinions are allowed and a moaning minnies one where only critical opinions are allowed.

This would reduce the vitriol aimed at fellow Rams and those of not interested in the others' opinions need not read them.

That'll just lead to the kind of echo chambers we see in wider social media - people just agreeing with like minded people & progressively getting more extreme in their opinions & more intolerant of opposite views. We're a football club, a mass of people with one shared ambition.

Reality is there are less than 5 posters I can think of across both sides who look to troll - best to block them if they're upsetting you so much. To close your mind off to well argued contrarian opinion is always a mistake IMO. I am adamant that Warne isn't the right long term manager for Derby but I'll be damned if I can't express my short term joy at results with fellow Rams (some of whom are very supportive of him) & discuss differences of opinion in terms of his long term suitability. It may be there are points that I haven't considered that other posters are using to justify their faith in Warne - recently read some comparing to Klopp & his record in German football which was interesting to read (even if I don't particularly agree)

You've never going to avoid opinions you don't like at the game itself either so don't see the value in restricting it here.

2 hours ago, Archied said:

Just woke up the morning after our fantastic and vital 3 points and still ducking buzzing , at 63 years old it’s great that derby county can still make me feel like a kid at Christmas 😀😀😀😀😀😀😀

Yeah me too, was buzzing last night & woke up in a right good mood 🐏

Re other points about atmosphere yesterday, that second half was the best PP has been since start of last season - the crowd realised we were struggling without a recognised forward but were determined to get behind them. The true measure of a fanbase is how it rallies when things go against them & Derby have few equals in this country. 

Accept the comparison won't be that popular but Steve Evans compared it to Elland Road in his post match presser & it did feel like the rabid 'lets get this lot over the line' togetherness you see from them - of course, the main difference is Derby stand by their team in numbers no matter what division whereas Leeds' crowd numbers plummeted when they were in League One, just like Forest.

Massive 3 points that, felt a bit pivotal dare i say.

Had resigned myself to a goalless draw & it was a hard watch for most of it...the team line up just didnt work with too many defenders on the park & lack of a forward out ball. We desperately need a forward option from the free agent ranks if Collins is out for the foreseeable, we just didnt look a threat at all during large swathes of the game.

Credit to the team for digging that result out though & shout out also to South Stand second half who woke up & changed the feel of the place. Intensity of our play definitely improved with crowd behind us & joyous scenes at the end. Another massive test next week, onto Barnsley...COYR 💪

1 hour ago, Malty said:

Can someone help me. I would like to know the last time DCFC were “top of the league”. I mean one of the EFL leagues, not the Johnson’s paint trophy qualifying league or anything like that. 

I guess I’m thinking it’s about time we actually finally got there. But perhaps - like I suppose lots of football fans - I’m forgetting a recent time when we were top (possibly only for a few weeks??). 

It’s about time our fans can sing about being top. Don’t you all think?

I am also be interested in how many times we’ve been too of the league since, say our first premier league season (was that 1996/7???)

thanks for you help. No other reason than I’m just curious.

I reckon Paul Clement was the last one who got us there around Christmas 2015 - remember us playing at Leeds just after Christmas & we were top then. So just over 8 years since we could last sing that

Don't believe Rowett ever had us top but sure McClaren did in 14/15 before the collapse. Previous to that, Billy Davies had us top for a period in 06/07 before Sunderland & Small Heath overtook us late on. Jim Smith also had us top for a lot of 95/96 before Sunderland again pipped us

56 minutes ago, Returning ram said:

Bris turned me down, so yes a little friendly wager is good by me. More than happy for the caveat that he stays a full season, also you can add in any point deductions should they occur.

Reminds me of old days when you would settle an argument with a bet in pub over a pint, rather than continue to go around in circles debating it 😊 

Sounds good to me, got ourselves a bet 🍻

I'll PM you to agree the amount 👍

15 hours ago, Returning ram said:

How about a little wager on it 😊

I'm confident to say that if we get promoted this season we stay up next 😏

Fair play, I do like folk who have the courage of their convictions 👍

Assume this wager would be dependant on Warne staying the full season in the Championship if we went up (given that's the constant discussion point on here)? If so, I'm happy to have a friendly wager with you if it extends beyond Bris 🤝

p.s. I sincerely hope I lose. I don't like sacking managers & I never want Derby to play in the 3rd tier ever again. If Warne secures us as a midtable finisher in the division above, that would qualify as mission accomplished with regard to his tenure IMO

Derby 1 Steve Evans' Blonde Highlights 2

FRGS Mendez-Laing

1 hour ago, On the Ram Page said:

I was inaccurate when I said he managed Hartlepool "not very well" but nor was he running away with the League. He was actually recommended to Derby's Chairman by Len Shackleton, which was the main reason, I believe, why he came to Derby. But , the main thrust of my post was that he was relatively unknown before he came hear with no history of success (winning anything) as a manager. 

My case was to give Warne a chance to prove he can cope with the job he is required to do.

I'd argue given how poor Hartlepools had historically been, his record there was actually very good. Yes Shackleton recommended him to Longson but without that managerial record*(and the footballing world knowing how bad Hartlepools usually were), he wouldn't have got the job at Derby. Accept he wouldn't have been well known as a manager at that point but the signs were promising.

Not sure how that translates to Warne though, as his record is very well known at this level & the division above. The club made quite a fuss of his League One promotions when appointed so even the casual observer knew what he was capable of (as well as the downside of his Championship record)

50 minutes ago, Returning ram said:

The post was that he didn't improve Derby the first season ? I believe, only from Wiki that he finished one place lower than the previous season.

Was there anything in BCs previous career that suggested he would go onto the success he achieved ?
 

I think that was the point of the post, not sure it was inaccurate?

No it wasn't, read the quote I replied to again. He was suggesting Clough wasn't doing a good job at Hartlepools but that we appointed him nevertheless - the stats I've provided are pretty conclusive in proving he was doing a good job & showing signs of the managerial talent he would demonstrate with us.

With regard to Clough's first season at Derby, we all know we finished one place below the season previous but I gather season tickets actually increased going into 68/69 as fans could see the young talented team that was emerging.

1 hour ago, On the Ram Page said:

Not comparing him to Brian Clough at all but Brian was managing Hartlepool (not very well) when we appointed him. We didn’t improve the first season he was here but got promotion the following year. No one knew at the time how good he would be, he didn’t show it in the first year here.

Let’s give him the opportunity to succeed.

That's inaccurate. Clough improved Hartlepools significantly in his near 2 seasons there. He was appointed October 1965 with them having only won 3 games from their opening 13 - they improved to finish 18th and the following season, they finished 8th under his management. Derby then offered him the job that summer & the tangible improvement will have been a big factor in that; To put into context, Hartlepools had finished bottom 2 of the old Division Four 5 of the preceding 6 seasons

By contrast, Warne's career to date could best be described as 'mixed' & whilst he has success at League One level, there is nothing in the 3 seasons/129 games he managed in the Championship that indicates he is capable of securing the Championship midtable consolidation we would need should we go up. I imagine the club will do some serious thinking in May about how credible it would be for him to continue should we go up, particularly as we will be small fry in terms of budget at that level - something Warne struggled with when at Rotherham. After all, we wouldn't baulk at some of the current playing squad being moved on should we go up, why wouldn't it extend to the manager if it was deemed he also wasn't capable of stepping up?

15 minutes ago, Shipley Ram said:

Just in time for work?

Fortunately not today!

Only got back into Leeds at 8.30am this morning after a nightmare with a connecting coach but here are a stream of thoughts from my sleep deprived mind.

Absolutely clinical display from Derby - felt like the game was pretty even first half until Max's goal. Thereafter, their need to attack opened up acres of space that Mendez-Laing & Barkhuizen thrived on - both should have had another goal. Exeter obviously had a lot of ball in the second half as we looked to break on them & had a couple of real opportunities but we did look reasonably assured. The possession stats showing 30% for us would likely have been higher if the game was more even but it does reveal a lot about how this team finds success.

Ebou Adams is the missing ingredient this team has needed for months - perpetual energy, real hunger to protect that back line & plays it simple. Successful midfields are all about blend, not just your best players & his skills perfectly compliment Bird and/or Hourihane.

Lovely to see Max on the scoresheet again - he seems to be really enjoying his football & I hope he realises the majority of Derby fans appreciate what a bloody good player he is & that he's staying with us until the summer to take us up. He deserves a good reception every time he returns to PP as an opposition player.

Away support was fantastic but would agree with others that the truncated nature of the away end made for pockets of fans singing rather than a group effort. That said, had a great time - very loud around us (right behind goal) & enjoyed the celebrations immensely.

Massive game on Saturday against the type of team we tend to struggle with - physical, niggly, clinical & hard pressing. Real test of our promotion credentials as these are the games (both auto promotion challenge & potential playoff games) that we need to win. Would be a real shame not to follow up yesterday's great result with a home win.

51 minutes ago, Ram-Alf said:

This division is of a shocking standard when it comes to football...imo, I'm not a visitor to PP but I've seen enough on the TV and an avid reader of this forum...but...27,204 were there, Are fans still going in the hope our standard will improve or is it because it was only STFC and a guaranteed 3points 😉

PW was asked a few weeks ago pre game "have Derby a 5th gear to go to" PWs comment "perhaps this is our 5th gear" Fans including myself see a squad of talented players that are playing in a system and style shaped by PW, There seems to me looking from afar that there's a couple of missing pieces to the jigsaw, Those pieces are still in the box and a little rough around the edges, CBT and EB if these 2 could add that bit of steel and pace to our squad and getting Forsyth and a fit Nyambe with the return of EC things should become a lot more clearer 🤷‍♂️

I'm not going to hold my breath as this is DCFC and we know what comes with the territory, Plenty of points to play for as have the other teams, We just need that little bit of  je ne sais quoi ☺️

I think the crowds are high as there is a possibility of promotion & the club has been starved of any success for so many years. Its a novelty factor more than anything.

Where I sit in East Stand Upper, there are two sets of young lads either side of me & they've been gradually losing interest all season - going for a beer on 35 mins, returning on 55 mins & leaving on 85 mins. On Saturday, all were engaged throughout & stayed to the end as the matches now are taking on real importance but there's still no great affection for Paul Warne or the football that's being served up. Their belief seems to be we're in 2nd in spite of Warne, not because of Warne.

I don't think many are under any illusion that the football is going to get better or that we have an extra gear to go (and it seems Warne is of the same opinion). It feels very like Billy Davies' promotion season in 06/07 where style & performances take a back seat to results and if that's the price we have to pay to get out of this awful division, then so be it. Hence the apathy in the midst of a promotion run & the absolute fury when results are not as expected, as there's little else to be enthused by.

3 minutes ago, angieram said:

See you there?

Hope so, glad you're feeling better & are able to travel! 😀

6 hours ago, Rampant said:

                          Wildsmith

Nyambe     Nelson        Cashin         Elder

                            Adams

                Thompson        Bird

    NML                 Collins                CBT

(Vickers, Ward, Bradley, Sibley, Hourihane, Wilson, Barkhuizen)

                  

Exactly what I'd go with. Solid back 5, plenty of energy in midfield & menace up top. Exeter are in good nick & will come onto us, we need to match their workrate therefore.

560 mile round trip for me, please justify my midweek madness Derby 🙏

Grecians 1 Derby 0

Very frustrating, particularly given Bolton & Peterborough dropped points.

As others have mentioned, conceding late goals at home is becoming a recurring theme with this team. There seems to be a real reluctance to a) hold onto possession & b) slow the game down. We drop deeper when protecting leads at home & on the break, seem desperate to make the killer pass to score a deciding goal. Problem however is that the ball is often lost from the flick on/speculative ball/run into a load of their defenders...they then recycle the ball & come back at us with our defensive shape pulled out of position.

We can point to weak defending for the goal but we shouldn't be conceding the ball so easily in the first place. Get the ball on halfway line? Hold the bloody thing up & play it simple to move the team up the park. This is basic stuff we're not doing & it's going to cost us.

Derby 2 Practically Welsh 1

FRGS Collins