v Blackburn (A) Match Thread

[Barney1991]

59 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

I think unless we’re well adrift like the Wendies were Clowes will give him the whole season. 

It should be noted Warne’s record at this level was heavily influenced by having far and away the lowest budget, and that he got promoted 3 times from League one without even having a top 6 budget. He came to Derby to test himself to make the step up. He should be keeping us in this league as a minimum and if at any point it seriously looks like that won’t happen then Clowes should make the call, whether he will or not is another matter. 

Personally I would give Warne 18-20 games and if it isn’t working getting someone else in ahead of the Jan window. 

What about Luton’s budget, plymouths budget, probably Coventry’s budget when they went up? Can’t just always blame budgets for a manager getting a team relegated 3 times in a row. 
 

warne is a master at league 1 football no doubt his tactics work where teams do not play fast on the deck football bar maybe 4 teams. We need to alternate our play as if we are going to rely  on set pieces all season it’s going to be a long season. Yes we had a really good 20 minute soell but I don’t remember us testing the goalkeeper from open play. 
 

as you say it’s the first game and my hope is not only the players learn but warne learns on the job as well. 

Edited August 10 by Barney1991

[David Graham Brown]

I’m sure that that Warne’s tactical nous will soon kick in. I’ve read that he judges players in part by their caricature, could I suggest Michael Palin? I know he’s in his 80s but he looks more mobile than our defence looked last night, and by all accounts is an all round good egg.

[Sparkle]

12 hours ago, valakari said:

Warne said afterwards how outstanding Callum Elder and Kane Wilson were.

I think that is absolute crap, 3 of the goals were down to these two full backs being out of position!

Malcolm Christie said he thought they were both average.

Well Wilson’s man scored twice whilst being completely on his own and Elder allowed the ball to come in far to often but did look better offensively but can’t actually pass to a team mate when under any kind of pressure, Wilson I like but not at full back right wing right midfield maybe but we have half a dozen of those not playing. If Warne thinks they were outstanding then we have a problem because nobody was outstanding and some barely average 

[Sparkle]

12 hours ago, valakari said:

Nyambe & Forsyth for me at full back in a 4!...which is what i said all last year!

Yes defenders need to know how to defend and let them concentrate on that 

[FKANorwichExile]

The more I reflect, the less painful this defeat feels. Once we got the first 15 minutes out of the way, we were fairly even and I don't think we deserved to lose so heavily.

Kenzo and Osbourn looked creative and pinged some lovely passes about. Elder attacked well and got some good crosses in which would have been turned in if we'd have had a striker on the pitch. Ozoh was strong and powerful when we were in control and had Rovers pinned in their own half. NML looked like he will be capable of causing problems and our set pieces are gonna be a real threat.

Defensively we were abysmal though, and what bothers me is that it was clearly tactical. Both fullbacks being pushed up at the same time was suicidal *last* lesson, and we're already paying for it. You just can't do that, especially not with a back 4. It's naive for us to assume we can all-out press with 8 players and nobody covering the CB's. I don't even blame Cashin because he was trying to do the job of three players.

If we're playing a back 4 you have to play Nyambe. In possession he can sit back with Nelson and Cash while Elder pushes on, as a pseudo CB. Although I still think I we'll shift to a 5-3-2/5-2-3 eventually.

[Tamworthram]

1 hour ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

I think unless we’re well adrift like the Wendies were Clowes will give him the whole season. 

It should be noted Warne’s record at this level was heavily influenced by having far and away the lowest budget, and that he got promoted 3 times from League one without even having a top 6 budget. He came to Derby to test himself to make the step up. He should be keeping us in this league as a minimum and if at any point it seriously looks like that won’t happen then Clowes should make the call, whether he will or not is another matter. 

Personally I would give Warne 18-20 games and if it isn’t working getting someone else in ahead of the Jan window. 

Not saying I disagree but what would “working” look like for you? 

[Foreveram]

3 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

Not saying I disagree but what would “working” look like for you? 

They admitted they didn’t watch the game 🤷🏻‍♂️

[ariotofmyown]

29 minutes ago, LeedsCityRam said:

Going forward, I would be looking to change shape to 3-5-2 or 3-4-3 - our tendency to attack out wide particularly from deep is going to leave Cash & Nelson constantly exposed so need a Nyambe or Forsyth in there also.

I was just thinking the same. I thought the back 3 was starting to look very solid towards the end of last season. And we have Bradley, Nyambe or Forsyth to play to join Cash and Nelson. 

Adams is then back in front of the back 3 where he belongs, along with Ozoh and Kenzo in the middle (or Osbourn)

We then have multiple options for the wider players then, depending on formation and how defensive or attacking we want to be. Forsyth/Elder lwb, Osbourn left md, or CBT lw. Nyambe/Ward/Wilson rwb, Barks rm, Jackson rw.

Then NML up front with hopefully a new CF or loan guy/Jackson.

[Tamworthram]

6 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

They admitted they didn’t watch the game 🤷🏻‍♂️

Yes but they might mean not “working” as evidenced by our results and league position rather than actual performances. So the age old debate, how bad does our league position need to be, and after how many games, before he is released?

[Leicester Ram]

Think there’s not much to say other than the Championship is a big step up for a squad that’s still gelling.

Also felt there were a few moments last night where we sorely missed a striker nipping in at the front post or arriving at the right time. Might be a different game if Yates or insert new striker is playing.

[Sparkle]

Someone on here made a good point about the lack of time wasting on show last night which was good to see but then again the opposition looked like they could cut us open when they felt like it apart from about 20 minutes in the second half.

[Sparkle]

3 minutes ago, Leicester Ram said:

Think there’s not much to say other than the Championship is a big step up for a squad that’s still gelling.

Also felt there were a few moments last night where we sorely missed a striker nipping in at the front post or arriving at the right time. Might be a different game if Yates or insert new striker is playing.

I think Yates needs to be playing off a proper centre forward - in fact a 40 year old Chris Martin would have made us look half  decent last night 

[CBX1985]

1 hour ago, Gladys_was_the_Greatest said:

I appreciate your point about the red herring, what I was thinking is that we probably won’t get reinforcements until the end of August. We therefore have potentially three more weeks of a team that is not what Paul Warne envisioned. He then would have seven to nine games for the whole team to bed in and bond. I guess I am going on what happened to Rosenior; although he only had seven games but he did have his whole team assembled. I do wonder if Liam was ever in the frame for the job, but it’s not worth going back as it doesn’t help. So that was my reasoning, you may well be right, if the cracks are still there after all that time then it’s not working, so why wait. I think there are positives from last night , at 1-1 we looked good, but we through the game away in a few minutes of poor defending.
My main point is, give it time hopefully we will learn from these mistakes and the additions to the team will fill the gaps. 

Good points all.  I can't see Clowes sacking Warne unless it is a break-glass moment.  We would need to be sure who we were getting was better and the thing with Warne is he builds togetherness and team spirit.  This takes time and he has to get people to run through walls for him.  If we can survive this season, I actually think PW (with an establishing team) has it in him to push on.

[Ramtastic ones]

Some encouraging stuff at times. Like many others who have posted I like Wilson but he's not the best when defending. Elder struggled. Ozoh lost his man for the first goal, but was otherwise solid. Kenzo was promising, but I'm not overly impressed by Osborne - early days yet - would prefer Adams in there. Cashin not at his best - rash in coming out of position - but it will come. Ditto Nelson. Bark was dog rough. NML did well. Jackson did ok, better suited out wide, where Bark was. Until Yates can start perhaps could of started with Brown - he can't prove he can do it whilst sat on the bench, not will he get better sitting there.

No need to panic.

Edited August 10 by Ramtastic ones
Typo

[Carl Sagan]

Not all doom and gloom, but it felt like a missed opportunity. Last season we were occasionally forced to play wingers instead of central strikers and it never worked. In preseason we experimented playing wingers instead of central strikers and it didn't work. So we line up with two central strikers in Collins and Brown on the bench, and playing wingers in their stead. Baffling. Very surprised to see Barks in the starting lineup when he was rarely good enough for the first team last season while Collins scored 19 goals.

Elder obviously has Warne's nudes, so when he's fit he's always the first name on the teamsheet. But I suppose it won't be long before he's injured and Fozzy will come in. 

At some times during the game we played decent stuff, but the defending (as a team, not just the defence) was atrocious and naive - a follow-on from preseason where this was not addressed. We need to wise up very quickly. Look forward to finally getting our goalie. It seems as if the other incomings will likely now be loans, when I was hoping for another permanent as an investment, but we need them to be good loans.

Very much hope Brown starts up top on Tuesday, finally given his chance. Sadly, I expect my hopes to be dashed.

[Jimbo Ram]

10 minutes ago, Ramtastic ones said:

Some encouraging stuff at times. Like many others who have posted I like Wilson but he's not the best when defending. Elder struggled. Ozoh lost his man for the first goal, but was otherwise solid. Kenzo was promising, but I'm not overly impressed by Osborne - early days yet - would prefer Adams in there. Cashin not at his best - rash in coming out of position - but it will come. Ditto Nelson. Bark was dog rough. NML did well. Jackson did ok, better suited out wide, where Bark was. Until Yates can start perhaps could of started with Brown - he can't prove he can do it whilst sat on the bench, not will he get better sitting there.

No need to panic.

Thought Elder and Wilson were two bright spots last night. Cashin looks out of sorts and still question whether Osborne is any better than Sibbo. We need a the new GK, big defender with pace, attacking midfielder and a goal scoring striker……then we will be ok. Easier said than done 😊

[i-Ram]

6 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Thought Elder and Wilson were two bright spots last night. Cashin looks out of sorts and still question whether Osborne is any better than Sibbo. We need a the new GK, big defender with pace, attacking midfielder and a goal scoring striker……then we will be ok. Easier said than done 😊

They might have been bright sparks last night if we were playing a 352 formation, but they effectively played as wing backs in a 442 - hence why we were horribly exposed many times by our back two being faced by a blue and white cavalry. Cashin was dog poor last night, but as someone else observed he might have been overcommitting out of desperation to cover the defensive gaps.

It was clearly a tactical decision to play that way too, as Warne did nothing to address the situation. I lost count of the number of times Kenzo and Osborn were trying to play in RB/LB areas when those two were up the field. Whilst Elder and Wilson were reasonably effective in the final third, last night we should have been keeping it tight and compact in defence, and having Kenzo and Osborn further forward to provide the deliveries.

I would like to see one of those graphs/charts which shows the average position of our players last night. On average I wonder if Kenzo and Wilson, and Elder and Osborn were playing in the same position.

[May Contain Nuts]

1 hour ago, vonwright said:

I'm sure Cashin will come good but it's maybe relevant that last time he played at this level (and played well) he had Davies next to him to do the organising. Nelson's a decent enough player but he's no Curtis. 

[HorsforthRam]

Commentator at the Dirties game said we looked like we were going to go and and win after we’d equalised. Same feeling I had at the game. Our over eagerness for 5 mins after we scored undid us. 

[angieram]

27 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

Not all doom and gloom, but it felt like a missed opportunity. Last season we were occasionally forced to play wingers instead of central strikers and it never worked. In preseason we experimented playing wingers instead of central strikers and it didn't work. So we line up with two central strikers in Collins and Brown on the bench, and playing wingers in their stead. Baffling. Very surprised to see Barks in the starting lineup when he was rarely good enough for the first team last season while Collins scored 19 goals.

Elder obviously has Warne's nudes, so when he's fit he's always the first name on the teamsheet. But I suppose it won't be long before he's injured and Fozzy will come in. 

At some times during the game we played decent stuff, but the defending (as a team, not just the defence) was atrocious and naive - a follow-on from preseason where this was not addressed. We need to wise up very quickly. Look forward to finally getting our goalie. It seems as if the other incomings will likely now be loans, when I was hoping for another permanent as an investment, but we need them to be good loans.

Very much hope Brown starts up top on Tuesday, finally given his chance. Sadly, I expect my hopes to be dashed.

Put Nyambe (not fit) and Yates (suspended) in that starting lineup, then it immediately looks stronger. We could maybe then get away with playing Elder instead of Forsyth. I still prefer Fozzy, but Warne doesn't. 

This then gives scope to bring on Wilson further up against tired legs, he's at least as good as any reserve wingers we have. 

Would I play Adams over Ozoh for now, if fully fit, to give a shield to the defence? Probably, away from home. But I recall what people thought of Tomori in his first couple of games. Lampard kept faith with him - and look how that turned out. 

Whilst Yates is out, we must give Brown an opportunity In the week. He could well have got on the end of some of those errant crosses first half.