Are we still a draw for players?

[ram59]

5 hours ago, jimtastic56 said:

I was thinking more about Mels , “State of the Art “ assessment. West park has plenty of pitches . Did you look at LCFC ? I think that could be called “State of the Art”. Liverpool have just bought back the Melwood training ground for their womens team. But we know the Premiership is awash with money.

Mel's 'state of the art' assessment was made a number of years ago after he had invested millions into the training facilities, which made them comparable to many teams in the Premier. Financial problems have prevented continuous improvement in the facilities since then, whilst premier teams have had the finances to move forward, especially champions league teams including LCFC. So to compare our current facilities with LCFC is a bit unfair and to use an old quote from Mel is also misleading.

I don't know where or what West Park is, but are those pitches maintained to the same level as Moor Farm?

[jimtastic56]

3 hours ago, ram59 said:

Mel's 'state of the art' assessment was made a number of years ago after he had invested millions into the training facilities, which made them comparable to many teams in the Premier. Financial problems have prevented continuous improvement in the facilities since then, whilst premier teams have had the finances to move forward, especially champions league teams including LCFC. So to compare our current facilities with LCFC is a bit unfair and to use an old quote from Mel is also misleading.

I don't know where or what West Park is, but are those pitches maintained to the same level as Moor Farm?

I drive past Moor farm every week and West park is in Long Eaton ( It has some decent pitches). The question is - will Moor farm attract players? We will find out shortly.

[SK47]

6 hours ago, Foreveram said:

When did you last visit Aston gate, I’d hardly say our ground is 10 times better. A capacity of 27,000 with two recently built new stands, one roughly the same age as our ground and one refurbished.

Clearly did not know that!? 27,000 is about 10,000 more than I asumed it would have tbh 🤣

[Van der MoodHoover]

10 hours ago, SK47 said:

Clearly did not know that!? 27,000 is about 10,000 more than I asumed it would have tbh 🤣

Had a lot of concourse development too. I went to a rugby match there last year (it's also the home ground for the Bristol Bears) and was sat in the 3tier Lansdown Stand which had a big indoor mall type thing under it.

I think their chairman, Stephen Lansdown, has invested heavily in the area. Used to be a right dump.

[LeedsCityRam]

23 hours ago, Warren Blufitt said:

I’m not sure why you’re even having this conversation, of course Derby are a big club and even massive at this level. As has been said, there are lots of reasons players sign for certain clubs but I’d say ambition is one of them and playing at the highest level possible is too. Players can achieve both with Derby but if players are short sighted enough to only consider money the main criteria, unless it’s so much it would be crazy to turn down, you’d join a Derby before you’d join anyone else in this league and half the one above and that’s from a Bolton fan!! 😉

As the other stand out big club at this level, what's the mood amongst Bolton fans at present? I'm guessing like ourselves you'll be aiming for a top 2 push...do you believe your squad needs a lot of new recruits or just tweaking in a couple of key areas?

Also, am I right in thinking there's been no confirmed signings at the Unibol yet?

[ram59]

We've discussed about whether we're a draw for young premier loans, maybe Hourihane's second job teaching Villa's u16s could give us a foot in the door there?

[maydrakin]

Someone like Omari Kellyman, maybe?

[Steve Buckley’s Dog]

On 09/06/2023 at 12:58, Foreveram said:

When did you last visit Aston gate, I’d hardly say our ground is 10 times better. A capacity of 27,000 with two recently built new stands, one roughly the same age as our ground and one refurbished.

I didn’t realise their capacity was that high. One can only presume that they close one of the stands on match days then. 

[Foreveram]

18 minutes ago, Steve Buckley’s Dog said:

I didn’t realise their capacity was that high. One can only presume that they close one of the stands on match days then. 

Why would they, their average attendance last season was over 20,000 so about the same number of empty seats that we had.

[Steve Buckley’s Dog]

3 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

Why would they, their average attendance last season was over 20,000 so about the same number of empty seats that we had.

Well, it was meant to be a joke but never mind. However, a quick google check shows a top league crowd of 24k so I think we can assume that a stand or tier, as  Leeds Utd did, could comfortably be closed, and our average attendance was closer to capacity than theirs which it really shouldn’t be. 

[Leveller]

On 09/06/2023 at 12:42, SK47 said:

Exactly how I'm looking at it. Roberts was loved by the fans, our ground Is 10 times better, I'd like to think our long term goal surpasses anything that Bristol can get close to, our facilities.. but something made him choose them over us. Was it really JUST championship football? If so, fair enough but I'm not sure.

I fear that we may lose players that PW planned/thought would stay and in return, doesn't have the resources to replace them in the capacity needed to be successful in the long run rather than just for getting out of this league.

I know it's a process that needs time to be criticised fairly, but sometimes if you look outside and you think it might rain, you take a coat... and I guess in this scenario, I've got my coat on 😅

We - Bristol City - also have a 2 year old £20M training centre. Probably on a par with yours. It’s best not to judge clubs on your vague memories from years ago. And our long term goals are no doubt just the same as yours. You may, or may not, get there first.

[Ambitious]

8 minutes ago, Leveller said:

We - Bristol City - also have a 2 year old £20M training centre. Probably on a par with yours. It’s best not to judge clubs on your vague memories from years ago. And our long term goals are no doubt just the same as yours. You may, or may not, get there first.

Bristol's training ground is nice. I would say I don't know how influential it would be to a player's decision but Derby's training ground is much bigger in comparison - I believe it's one of the very few in the country with an indoor training facility too and the facilities are one of the reasons why we were one of the first clubs to be given the category one status. I haven't been in for a while, must be 5-6 years now, but I'm fairly sure it is still rated as one of the top training centres in the country. 

As for how much of a draw we are for players, without knowing what's going on behind the scenes, it's impossible to know. We've lost out on two players we know we had an interest in for sure, possibly three in Rodrigues but we have no idea. I guess we will see on who we bring in to the club on where we are in the football pyramid. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that things aren't moving as Warne will have hoped but plenty of time yet. 

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Ambitious said:

Bristol's training ground is nice. I would say I don't know how influential it would be to a player's decision but Derby's training ground is much bigger in comparison - I believe it's one of the very few in the country with an indoor training facility too and the facilities are one of the reasons why we were one of the first clubs to be given the category one status. I haven't been in for a while, must be 5-6 years now, but I'm fairly sure it is still rated as one of the top training centres in the country. 

As for how much of a draw we are for players, without knowing what's going on behind the scenes, it's impossible to know. We've lost out on two players we know we had an interest in for sure, possibly three in Rodrigues but we have no idea. I guess we will see on who we bring in to the club on where we are in the football pyramid. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that things aren't moving as Warne will have hoped but plenty of time yet. 

All Cat 1s and most Cat 2s have an indoor facility so that’s close to half the clubs in the country. 5 years ago Moor Farm was one of the best now in the region that is Leicester (by a long way) but Stoke, F*rest, Villa, WBA are all at least as good.

IMO does a training ground really influence a decision over league, manager, playing time and of course wages? I think not. 
 

Maybe a stadium but not a training ground. 

[ram59]

3 hours ago, ExiledinDerby said:

All Cat 1s and most Cat 2s have an indoor facility so that’s close to half the clubs in the country. 5 years ago Moor Farm was one of the best now in the region that is Leicester (by a long way) but Stoke, F*rest, Villa, WBA are all at least as good.

IMO does a training ground really influence a decision over league, manager, playing time and of course wages? I think not. 
 

Maybe a stadium but not a training ground. 

I tend to disagree, most of a player's working life takes place at the training ground, so I would imagine that it would be quite an important consideration.

As you say, our training facilities are matched or bettered by quite a number of clubs now, but the quality that we offer for training means that, on it's own, our training facilities will not be a deal breaker, as no club that we're likely to be competing against for a signature, will have much better facilities.

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, ram59 said:

I tend to disagree, most of a player's working life takes place at the training ground, so I would imagine that it would be quite an important consideration.

As you say, our training facilities are matched or bettered by quite a number of clubs now, but the quality that we offer for training means that, on it's own, our training facilities will not be a deal breaker, as no club that we're likely to be competing against for a signature, will have much better facilities.

Maybe so but it depends on who you are trying to attract. If it’s players who can stay and be competitive in the championship then others like Bristol will be involved. If it’s players from national league or league 1/2 maybe it would help but I respectfully disagree and say in this order 

1. wages / bonus

2. length of contract 

3. Manager

4. Playing time 

5. Reputation 

6. Stadium / Fans

The first team use 2 pitches to train at Moor Farm and indoors during bad weather. The Gym, pool, cafe, changing room and offices are pretty generic these days. 

[Leeds Ram]

At this level, we're the biggest club in the division right now so we're a big draw. However, if we compete against championship clubs for signings, it will always be an uphill battle because we can offer less money and a poorer level of football. That leaves us with selling players on the long-term project and the potential of the club. If we were to make it back into the championship, then again, we'd be a significant draw for players at that level with high attendances, a state-of-the-art training facility and for once a bit of stability. 

There is no need to panic. If we start losing out on targets to Bolton, Portsmouth, Oxford regularly then questions can be asked. For now, we need to stay calm and enjoy the sun

[Jourdan]

I don’t think Warne, Thomas and the recruitment team can really win at the moment.

If we get the players in quickly and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club didn’t do their homework.

If we leave it late and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club weren’t proactive enough or made many panic buys.

If we sign proven players and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club should have unearthed some gems.

If we sign unproven players and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club should have shown more ambition and signed players with pedigree.

Let’s show some patience and give Warne some time to actually realise his plans and deal with the task at hand.

Are we still a draw? Of course we are. Our very own manager left a stable club in a higher division because of our standing and potential.

[Guest]

Oh I agree there is absolutely no need Ito be panicking at all. Pre season is 2 weeks away, players won’t be back off holidays for another week and offers will be flying everywhere and anywhere. I think we may see 2 or 3 serious rumours next week with the bulk of the announcements in the 2 weeks after that. I don’t think we get to the end of the first week of July without a squad in place. PW is methodical and Organised and won’t want players too far behind the others in terms of preseason fitness..

[Van der MoodHoover]

21 hours ago, Leveller said:

We - Bristol City - also have a 2 year old £20M training centre. Probably on a par with yours. It’s best not to judge clubs on your vague memories from years ago. And our long term goals are no doubt just the same as yours. You may, or may not, get there first.

I went to your ground late last year to see the Bears.

It's a decent ground thats clearly had quite a bit of investment.

And ours is 25.years old, so something in what you say.

[CBX1985]

21 hours ago, Jourdan said:

I don’t think Warne, Thomas and the recruitment team can really win at the moment.

If we get the players in quickly and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club didn’t do their homework.

If we leave it late and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club weren’t proactive enough or made many panic buys.

If we sign proven players and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club should have unearthed some gems.

If we sign unproven players and then when some don’t work out, we’ll be told the club should have shown more ambition and signed players with pedigree.

Let’s show some patience and give Warne some time to actually realise his plans and deal with the task at hand.

Are we still a draw? Of course we are. Our very own manager left a stable club in a higher division because of our standing and potential.

The power and allure of hindsight.

Those who proudly proclaim we are behind the mark and not doing enough will gladly disappear into a sea of cheers should things work out forgetting their hitherto pessimism; should we falter - proof positive their assessment was spot on.