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Yorkshire cricket racism

Gaspode

By Gaspode
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TigerTedd

TigerTedd

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, maxjam said:

 

This annoys me so much. 

Not the fact that sent these messages, although I certainly don’t condone it, but that fact that I’ve heard people today saying ‘well it’s double standards isn’t it.’

Why does it matter? Why does it undermine the racial abuse he’s suffered? It doesn’t suddenly make that okay? Just cos everyone is racist, doesn’t suddenly make racism okay?

The whole idea of historically racist tweets and messages pisses me off too. Surely their must be some sort of statute of limitations. What one person writes when they’re 19 is not at all the same as what they think when they’re 30. And not at all the same as decades long institutional racism at all levels. At that point surely a heartfelt apology and genuine contrition is all that’s needed to draw a line under it. 

that anyone would go to the effort of digging this out, at this time, with clearly the sole purpose of undermining what he’s saying, is deplorable. And for what purpose? To derail any investigation into racism?

Racism begets racism, just as bullies beget bullies. If you’re being picked on, if you’re in that environment where your basically being taught that it’s okay to pick on others who are weaker or in a minority, then you’re going to mimic that. If anything, these messages just prove what he was saying, that the cricketing environment he grew up in was endemically racist. 

Im probably thinking about it too much though, it’s probably just a stupid message from a stupid kid trying to look cool in front of his stupid mates. Either way, certainly not something to crucify him over, and certainly not something that should detract from the key issue.

I’m just glad that social media didn’t exist when I was a 19 year old, who knows what stupid poo I would’ve posted back then. 

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TigerTedd
TigerTedd

This annoys me so much.  Not the fact that sent these messages, although I certainly don’t condone it, but that fact that I’ve heard people today saying ‘well it’s double standards isn’t it.’

Gaspode
Gaspode

The one small element of positivity in the whole sorry affair is that Rafiq stated in his evidence to the committee that he'd been welcomed at Derbyshire, made to feel part of the team and didn't have

maxjam
maxjam
maxjam

maxjam

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, TigerTedd said:

Why does it matter? Why does it undermine the racial abuse he’s suffered? It doesn’t suddenly make that okay? Just cos everyone is racist, doesn’t suddenly make racism okay?

The whole idea of historically racist tweets and messages pisses me off too. Surely their must be some sort of statute of limitations. What one person writes when they’re 19 is not at all the same as what they think when they’re 30. And not at all the same as decades long institutional racism at all levels. At that point surely a heartfelt apology and genuine contrition is all that’s needed to draw a line under it.

that anyone would go to the effort of digging this out, at this time, with clearly the sole purpose of undermining what he’s saying, is deplorable. And for what purpose? To derail any investigation into racism?

Why does it have to undermine anything he is saying?

Didn't some young white England cricketer (don't follow cricket so forgot his name) recently get banned for a shortwhile for a couple of childish tweets he made as a teenager?  It doesn't matter what colour you are or what race/religion/sexuality/etc you are talking about surely the whole point of the anti-racism movement is to call out racism wherever it appears - and just because you are the victim one week doesn't mean you can't be the bully the next.

I don't really want to get into the whole racism thing, its not really for this forum.  My personal opinion however is the world has moved very fast over the past few years and whilst we need to tackle these problems wherever is occurs we also have to be careful not to become overzealous in our approach.

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nottingram

nottingram

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Why does it have to undermine anything he is saying?

Didn't some young white England cricketer (don't follow cricket so forgot his name) recently get banned for a shortwhile for a couple of childish tweets he made as a teenager?  It doesn't matter what colour you are or what race/religion/sexuality/etc you are talking about surely the whole point of the anti-racism movement is to call out racism wherever it appears - and just because you are the victim one week doesn't mean you can't be the bully the next.

I don't really want to get into the whole racism thing, its not really for this forum.  My personal opinion however is the world has moved very fast over the past few years and whilst we need to tackle these problems wherever is occurs we also have to be careful not to become overzealous in our approach.

It undermines the message because instead of the headlines being about lost generations of Asian cricketers due to a deep rooted culture of racism and bullying, it is “Rafiq apologises for anti Semitic messages”

Both are serious and both need calling out but I think it is quite naive to think this will not now be used to detract from the overall message that Rafiq has been addressing over the last few months. He has apologised - his whole stance throughout has been that this is not about individuals but instead is about a systemic culture, and he has accepted apologies from those who have reached out to him. I’m sure the ECB would punish him for his historical tweets if they could but I’m not sure of the benefit given he was bullied out of the sport and now runs a chippy.

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TigerTedd

TigerTedd

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Why does it have to undermine anything he is saying?

Didn't some young white England cricketer (don't follow cricket so forgot his name) recently get banned for a shortwhile for a couple of childish tweets he made as a teenager?  It doesn't matter what colour you are or what race/religion/sexuality/etc you are talking about surely the whole point of the anti-racism movement is to call out racism wherever it appears - and just because you are the victim one week doesn't mean you can't be the bully the next.

I don't really want to get into the whole racism thing, its not really for this forum.  My personal opinion however is the world has moved very fast over the past few years and whilst we need to tackle these problems wherever is occurs we also have to be careful not to become overzealous in our approach.

It shouldn’t. That’s the point. But the fact that it’s even news is based on the fact that overnight he’s become the poster boy for anti racism in cricket, and now he’s been outed as fallible, and certain people will look at that and see that his credibility has nose dived. It shouldn’t be that way, but that’s the way the media are framing the story, and it’s taking the spotlight off the ECB.

yes, that young cricketer was what I was thinking of. I thought that was over zealous. You shouldn’t be able to be crucified for stupid, offensive, hurtful things you said as a kid. As long as there’s never been a history of consistent racism into adulthood, people should be given the benefit of the doubt that they’ve matured since then. 

it amazes and saddens me that there are people out there who seem to only exist to drag others down. These trolls that are spending hours mining through celebrity Twitter accounts to find incriminating evidence from 2006. It should be like in a play ground, where the one who did the wrong doing gets in trouble, but the one that tells the tales also gets in trouble. Cos at that point it is just telling tales. 

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Anon

Anon

Posted
Posted

You don't think Rafiq's messages are relevant given that many of the people he has accused have defended themselves by admitting that what they said was wrong, but was part of a locker room culture that Rafiq himself indulged in? You don't think it's relevant that Rafiq can argue that, whilst the content is bad, he is a different person now to the one who posted that message a decade ago all whilst making historic racism allegations against people that stretch back over a decade?

It doesn't invalidate his allegations, but it does provide some context.

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cstand

cstand

Posted
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

How?

No longer trustworthy where there is a blame there is a claim. Six figure sum on this occasion.

The YCCC should have taken his allegations seriously on that they are in default.

 

Edited by cstand
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TigerTedd

TigerTedd

Posted
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On 19/11/2021 at 15:20, sage said:

He's apologised which seems fair enough. 

I’ve never quite understood this. If you’re dressing up in cosplay as an iconically black character, like, for example, a Mr. T, does it just mean that white people simply aren’t allowed to do that, or that you’ve got to try to make the costume work without the iconic blackness. Or is there inherently something racist about wanting to dress up as Mr. T at all?

like if I was dressing up as the Incredible Hulk, I’d paint myself green. You wouldn’t even consider doing the Incredible Hulk without the green facepaint.

I know greenface obviously doesn’t have the same racist history and connotations, but if you’re dressing up as a character or person in good faith, is there no circumstance in which it can ever rise above that history and be okay?

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Mucker1884

Mucker1884

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, TigerTedd said:

I’ve never quite understood this. If you’re dressing up in cosplay as an iconically black character, like, for example, a Mr. T, does it just mean that white people simply aren’t allowed to do that, or that you’ve got to try to make the costume work without the iconic blackness. Or is there inherently something racist about wanting to dress up as Mr. T at all?

like if I was dressing up as the Incredible Hulk, I’d paint myself green. You wouldn’t even consider doing the Incredible Hulk without the green facepaint.

I know greenface obviously doesn’t have the same racist history and connotations, but if you’re dressing up as a character or person in good faith, is there no circumstance in which it can ever rise above that history and be okay?

If it was me, I'd probably play it safe, and just go as "Faceman", but then I'm rather handsome.  I often used to think I could pull him off.

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sage

sage

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Eddie said:

People can change, given changes in circumstances, and certainly given time and the opportunity to reflect. 50 years ago, I did and said things for which I am now thoroughly ashamed. I knew they were wrong at the time, but to be 'in' or accepted, I did them.

 

Never knew you used to support Forest @Eddie

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