Alan Nixon Breaks Silence on American Billionaire Bid

[i-Ram]

1 minute ago, PistoldPete said:

MSD I think have some control over it. They have legal charges.   

Oh yes, they have some control over it, but who owns the stadium? I am looking forward to @kevinhectoringupdating me with his knowledge and facts.

[Simmo’s left foot]

A company owned by Mel Morris owns the stadium, with a charge against it by MSD as security for a loan. As long as Mel's company services the loan, then he still owns it. I assume the rent charged to DCFC covers the finance for the original sale and leaseback. This is actually common asset management in many other industries, such as aviation. 

[PistoldPete]

9 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Oh yes, they have some control over it, but who owns the stadium? I am looking forward to @kevinhectoringupdating me with his knowledge and facts.

I did have look at the legal charge documents at one stage, they have control over bank accounts which isn't that unusual with commercial properties I think as they will want the rent to go straight out to make the loan payments. CK says we didn't pay the rent though, not sure what the implications of that are if true.. it might affect the rights under the lease maybe  but why should it mean Morris doesn't own PPS? CK does seem full of poo.      

[Steve How Hard?]

On 27/12/2021 at 11:21, RadioactiveWaste said:

All these fish puns as we sild down the leagues

I wonder why nobody else has fathomed this out. 

[Ram-Alf]

5 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

I did have look at the legal charge documents at one stage, they have control over bank accounts which isn't that unusual with commercial properties I think as they will want the rent to go straight out to make the loan payments. CK says we didn't pay the rent though, not sure what the implications of that are if true.. it might affect the rights under the lease maybe  but why should it mean Morris doesn't own PPS? CK does seem full of poo.      

Admin said that some of the things CK said on social media were untrue concerning CKs purchase of DCFC...or words to that effect.

[kevinhectoring]

16 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Just reverting on this as I have had my feet up over Christmas, but keeping my eye on a few things. You have asserted, as you do, a few times in recent weeks that Mel Morris does not own or have control of Pride Park Stadium. Other than Chris K apparently keeping you in the loop, what actual evidence do you have to support your assertion, and if not Morris who does own and/or control PPS?

‘A few times in recent weeks’???! How about a hundred times over the past year! You can’t imagine how dispiriting it is ? 

anyway, this is how I see it:

the stadium is owned by a company, not a human bean

that company has transferred its ownership in the stadium to MSD under a fixed and floating charge. Read the charge, the company can do nothing with the stadium except operate it in the ordinary course. 
 

What’s more, the charge is enforceable. There is no doubt that the company is in default of the MSD loan deal: there will be numerous defaults triggered by club administration, EFl proceedings, failure to pay tax, payment default etc etc. There is no doubt that if the company is in default under the loan agreement that the charge becomes enforceable. 
 

so MSD has total and utter control over the stadium. If it is sold, where does the money go? No, not to MM. It goes to MSD and after that (I think this is right) it has to be used by the company to satisfy creditors, namely the club. 
 

so not only does MM have no control over it, if it is sold, he doesn’t get any of the cash. And if as a shareholder in the company it he tried to do something with it, against the wishes of the admins/MSD, you can bet that MSD would exercise its rights under the charge. 

[Ram-Alf]

1 minute ago, Steve How Hard? said:

I wonder why nobody else has fathomed this out. 

Wait till we go down the Leagues

[i-Ram]

11 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

I did have look at the legal charge documents at one stage, they have control over bank accounts which isn't that unusual with commercial properties I think as they will want the rent to go straight out to make the loan payments. CK says we didn't pay the rent though, not sure what the implications of that are if true.. it might affect the rights under the lease maybe  but why should it mean Morris doesn't own PPS? CK does seem full of poo.      

MSD will have no control over the Club’s bank accounts ? The club is in administration and presently the 3 appointed Administrators will have full control of the accounts. MSD have not enforced their security, indeed they have as I understand it been prepared to lend the Club a little more cash in recent months. They have however registered a further fixed and floating charge on the Stadium - created 29/10 and registered at Companies House on 4/11/21.

The rent due payable by the Club on the lease of the Stadium will go to the stadium owner, and not to repay MSD loans.

[PistoldPete]

4 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

MSD will have no control over the Club’s bank accounts ? The club is in administration and presently the 3 appointed Administrators will have full control of the accounts. MSD have not enforced their security, indeed they have as I understand it been prepared to lend the Club a little more cash in recent months. They have however registered a further fixed and floating charge on the Stadium - created 29/10 and registered at Companies House on 4/11/21.

The rent due payable by the Club on the lease of the Stadium will go to the stadium owner, and not to repay MSD loans.

Sorry Iram I meant MSD has control over the Gellaw Company's bank account, the Morris vehicle that owns PPS. That Company is not in administration. 

[Wignall12]

18 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Admin said that some of the things CK said on social media were untrue concerning CKs purchase of DCFC...or words to that effect.

Eel have to answer for that then, bet that makes him Crabby 

[Comrade 86]

18 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

the stadium is owned by a company, not a human bean

Thank god for that...

[Ram-Alf]

3 minutes ago, Wignall12 said:

Eel have to answer for that then, bet that makes him Crabby 

I'll sidestep that answer and slither away thankyou

[Eddie]

23 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Wait till we go down the Leagues

20,000 of them?

[Ram-Alf]

Just now, Eddie said:

20,000 of them?

Yep, All under the Sea

[Crewton]

2 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Yep, All under the Sea

Our finances are 'under water' already, so we should cope with that.

[i-Ram]

6 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

‘A few times in recent weeks’???! How about a hundred times over the past year! You can’t imagine how dispiriting it is ? 

anyway, this is how I see it:

the stadium is owned by a company, not a human bean

that company has transferred its ownership in the stadium to MSD under a fixed and floating charge. Read the charge, the company can do nothing with the stadium except operate it in the ordinary course. 
 

What’s more, the charge is enforceable. There is no doubt that the company is in default of the MSD loan deal: there will be numerous defaults triggered by club administration, EFl proceedings, failure to pay tax, payment default etc etc. There is no doubt that if the company is in default under the loan agreement that the charge becomes enforceable. 
 

so MSD has total and utter control over the stadium. If it is sold, where does the money go? No, not to MM. It goes to MSD and after that (I think this is right) it has to be used by the company to satisfy creditors, namely the club. 
 

so not only does MM have no control over it, if it is sold, he doesn’t get any of the cash. And if as a shareholder in the company it he tried to do something with it, against the wishes of the admins/MSD, you can bet that MSD would exercise its rights under the charge. 

How you see it is incorrect on a great many levels. I will work through it in order for you, so you stop posting misleading information as fact.

The stadium is owned by a company Gellaw Newco 202 Ltd. Gellaw Newco 202 Ltd has one director (guess who?) but that company is actually owned by Gellaw Newco 204 Ltd.  Gellaw Newco 204 Ltd has one director (guess who?) and the shares of the company are in control of one shareholder (l won’t ask you to guess, because I think you will know by now where it is going).

Both Gellaw Newco 202 Ltd and Gellaw Newco 204 Ltd have entered in to security arrangements with MSD on a third party basis. But it is the Football Club in Administration who owes MSD the debt that needs to be repaid (or refinanced or renegotiated at some stage). The Football Club is who has the loan and has also given a charge over its assets to MSD, independent of the security given to MSD by the two Gellaw Companies.

Neither of the Gellaw companies has transferred its ownership in the stadium to MSD under a fixed and floating charge. Yes MSD has an enforceable charge, but they haven’t enforced it. Indeed my understanding is that MSD have been prepared to advance a further sum to the Football Club in Administration in recent months, so I doubt very much that the advance is in current default. The stadium remains in the ownership of Gellaw Newco 202 Ltd, which in turn is ultimately in control of Mel Morris. I have checked these facts against Companies House and District Land Registry records today.

You say: so MSD has total and utter control over the stadium. If it is sold, where does the money go? No, not to MM. It goes to MSD and after that (I think this is right) it has to be used by the company to satisfy creditors, namely the club.  None of this statement is correct. Until MSD enforces it’s security Morris has some control albeit limited. He could however do a few things of importance. Gellaw Newco 202 Ltd could sell the stadium to another unconnected individual or company or to Morris or another company vehicle of Morris’s and MSD would surely agree if the outstanding loan was cleared as part of the sale. Why wouldn’t they? Such a transaction might see Gellaw Newco 202 Ltd sell the stadium at a premium (sale price less costs less MSD repayment). But none of that premium is available to the Football Club creditors. They are a completely different entity. They are not entitled to any of Gellaw’s assets - that is why those companies are not subject to the Administration process. Morris was clever to keep the Gellaw companies stadium owning operations disconnected from the Football Club’s trading operations.

Just one other thing which might be important to know. In Law the MSD debt should in the first place be repaid from any asset realisations of the Football Club. Only if there is a shortfall after that can they exercise a claim against the Gellaw Companies for any shortfall. Morris could waive those third party security rights if he wanted.

So in summary, Morris still ultimately owns the stadium, he still has an element of control and influence over the current administrative proceedings, and he could still own the stadium post administration (or dare I say liquidation). The bloke is a messer, indeed some say a proper duck job, but as matters stand whilst he has lost a load of cash with his gambles to date, he currently has some decent cards in his hands he could play if he wanted to recover at least some of his monies. How he plays his hand in the future we will see.
 

[Ram-Alf]

29 minutes ago, Crewton said:

Our finances are 'under water' already, so we should cope with that.

Soon to be on dry land...

We Hope ?

[Shadowplay]

32 minutes ago, Crewton said:

Our finances are 'under water' already, so we should cope with that.

I note Bristol City have also announced their finances are underwater………hhmmmm.

[Crewton]

6 minutes ago, Shadowplay said:

I note Bristol City have also announced their finances are underwater………hhmmmm.

They'll just have to sell a few more slaves, I mean players.

[WystonRam]

7 minutes ago, Shadowplay said:

I note Bristol City have also announced their finances are underwater………hhmmmm.

I've just started a thread in the Football Forum bit... 38M loss in 2020-21, staggering.