Gareth Southgate

[Mr Tibbs]

I don't really get all the Captain Hindsight stuff. When you're leading 1-0 in a Euro Championship Final, very comfortably may I add, I can totally understand why a game-managing, cautious coach didn't go on the front foot and make wholesale changes. I think Chiesa created one decent chance for them all game and they grab a scrappy, 4th ricochet off a corner equaliser to get back into it - poo happens. 

Literally a couple of penalties being scored away from being knighted. Carry on Gareth, you're doing a brilliant job. 

[Gone]

4 minutes ago, Mr Tibbs said:

I don't really get all the Captain Hindsight stuff. When you're leading 1-0 in a Euro Championship Final, very comfortably may I add, I can totally understand why a game-managing, cautious coach didn't go on the front foot and make wholesale changes. I think Chiesa created one decent chance for them all game and they grab a scrappy, 4th ricochet off a corner equaliser to get back into it - poo happens. 

Literally a couple of penalties being scored away from being knighted. Carry on Gareth, you're doing a brilliant job. 

Maybe we were watching a different game, after 30 mins we where far from comfortable and couldn’t get near the ball. Their goal could be seen coming from just before half time, no hindsight there it was blatantly obviously we needed to change things. However you’re right in the end we were 3 penalties away from achieving something amazing, and he’s doing a good job. I didn’t think I’d ever see us in a final in my life time, and I’ll forever be grateful to him and the team for that. Just a shame that maybe just maybe we could of actually done it and won the thing without even going to penos. 

[AndyinLiverpool]

1 hour ago, TexasRam said:

I think you can be part of the togetherness and uplift but also be critical if that’s your opinion. With the attacking talent we had at our disposal, in your own back yard and with the Fans behind you, that final was ours for the taking. That’s not entitlement “or whatever the new label is” is reality, Southgate was to slow to change it, we all saw it coming. He needed to change it earlier be more offensive and take the game to them instead of protecting a 1-0 lead. Italy were great however so hats of to them, we though should of made the most of our great start and that’s down to the manager. He should take us to the World Cup and hope he learns from yesterday and I really hope he makes use of the resources he has better next time. 

It's not the criticism. It's the 'I told you so' when it turns out that only one team wins a tournament.

[MuespachRam]

2 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

But until we develop greater control of the ball we will be less likely to. 

We were shot last night. Towards extra time Italy could just walk up the pitch patting the ball side to side to each other and we just hung back unable to press, tackle or intercept. 

In Qatar it'll be hotter so I expect we will be shot sooner. The knockout rounds come every 3-4 days. That's more often than the pl. We'll probably be down to last night's energy levels by the quarter finals at a guess. 

Need to be able to rotate the centre mids more. I'd prefer to see us move to a single pivot but we can't just have 1 and expect them to play every minute of every game. 

Shot last night? We were the only team doing any sort of attacking in extra time, I thought we were getting stronger and stronger as the game went on. 
And you do know that the World Cup is in the winter don’t you…? Where temperatures in Qatar are lower than the summer in England…? 

[MuespachRam]

22 minutes ago, Mr Tibbs said:

I don't really get all the Captain Hindsight stuff. When you're leading 1-0 in a Euro Championship Final, very comfortably may I add, I can totally understand why a game-managing, cautious coach didn't go on the front foot and make wholesale changes. I think Chiesa created one decent chance for them all game and they grab a scrappy, 4th ricochet off a corner equaliser to get back into it - poo happens. 

Literally a couple of penalties being scored away from being knighted. Carry on Gareth, you're doing a brilliant job. 

Perfectly put. 

[RoyMac5]

6 minutes ago, MuespachRam said:

Perfectly put. 

Where's the trophy then?

[Van der MoodHoover]

33 minutes ago, MuespachRam said:

Shot last night? We were the only team doing any sort of attacking in extra time, I thought we were getting stronger and stronger as the game went on. 
And you do know that the World Cup is in the winter don’t you…? Where temperatures in Qatar are lower than the summer in England…? 

Average about 21c yes. About 5c warmer than either our semi or final. 

[MuespachRam]

50 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Where's the trophy then?

And?

[MuespachRam]

24 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Average about 21c yes. About 5c warmer than either our semi or final. 

The temperature in England yesterday was 21 degrees according to the met office….so, let’s not go round saying “it’s going to be so hot that we won’t be able to cope in Qatar” when It is blatantly not true. 

[Mr Tibbs]

1 hour ago, TexasRam said:

Maybe we were watching a different game, after 30 mins we where far from comfortable and couldn’t get near the ball. Their goal could be seen coming from just before half time, no hindsight there it was blatantly obviously we needed to change things. However you’re right in the end we were 3 penalties away from achieving something amazing, and he’s doing a good job. I didn’t think I’d ever see us in a final in my life time, and I’ll forever be grateful to him and the team for that. Just a shame that maybe just maybe we could of actually done it and won the thing without even going to penos. 

Same game just completely different perspectives, which is what this is all about.
 

I saw the pressure and possession they were building but I also saw zero threatening moments bar the Chiesa chance which Pickford had well covered. No nail biting required until the penalties - in a Euro final! 
 

I think it’s in our mentality to expect more from English international teams but 2018 opened up a different view for me and I enjoyed that and this tournament so much more than previous ones. Probably the greatest, most enjoyable rides football has given me and I’ll be ever grateful to Southgate for that. 

[Van der MoodHoover]

1 minute ago, MuespachRam said:

The temperature in England yesterday was 21 degrees according to the met office….so, let’s not go round saying “it’s going to be so hot that we won’t be able to cope in Qatar” when It is blatantly not true. 

We didn't play during the day. 

Qatar Dec average is slightly higher than UK July. 

There is similar range. So the chances are we'll be playing in temperatures a bit warmer than a UK summer in December. 

Players don't really like it above 19 ish. Not my words. This was said to me by John Barnes at a dinner in 2006 and playing tournaments in warm summer temperatures was a reason he believed England would struggle to win a tournament. 

We've had pretty cool rainy conditions in the UK for the great majority of the euros tournament, with the exception of the first game. 

I think it will be a factor in increasing fatigue levels across a whole tournament, assuming the team play quite a few games. It won't be so bad that individual games will be a struggle. 

[MuespachRam]

2 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

We didn't play during the day. 

Qatar Dec average is slightly higher than UK July. 

There is similar range. So the chances are we'll be playing in temperatures a bit warmer than a UK summer in December. 

Players don't really like it above 19 ish. Not my words. This was said to me by John Barnes at a dinner in 2006 and playing tournaments in warm summer temperatures was a reason he believed England would struggle to win a tournament. 

We've had pretty cool rainy conditions in the UK for the great majority of the euros tournament, with the exception of the first game. 

I think it will be a factor in increasing fatigue levels across a whole tournament, assuming the team play quite a few games. It won't be so bad that individual games will be a struggle. 

Oh It must be right then if John Barnes once told you…..

[Carl Sagan]

3 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Because football is played on a pitch, not a computer is probably the most realistic answer to this question.

I don't think it is, because the point of coaching penalties is to take the nerves and occasion out of the equation and go through a routine instead. It has seemed to me in recent years that Derby have actually done this well in shootouts. The quality of our pens in the shootouts against Man Utd and Southampton was extraordinary.

Edit: I should add that Southgate has done extraordinarily well in the last two tournaments and exceeded expectations, and England must be among the strong favourites for the World Cup. But I worry we're not maximizing our chances. At least the conditions will dictate he has to use all his subs in Qatar, so he needs to plan better for that from now on. The Eddie Jones mantra of "starters" and "finishers" should be brought into the squad.

Edited July 12, 2021 by Carl Sagan

[Van der MoodHoover]

6 minutes ago, MuespachRam said:

Oh It must be right then if John Barnes once told you…..

Well he has at least played in summer tournaments which I have not. And nor, I suspect, have you. 

[MuespachRam]

30 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Well he has at least played in summer tournaments which I have not. And nor, I suspect, have you. 

Not true, I have played in numerous summer tournaments In Florida, France, Germany, Switzerland and England. Rode my bike all over Europe in boiling hot conditions too. 

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

5 hours ago, DCFClks said:

I can't accept Croatia are still a top team, if they are then Czech Republic are as well who they drew to. They're both just good teams.

Thats not how football works. So because a team draws with another, neither are top? Or the better team can't be a top team? I guess France are in the shadow of the Swiss then.

[DCFC Kicks]

9 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

Thats not how football works. So because a team draws with another, neither are top? Or the better team can't be a top team? I guess France are in the shadow of the Swiss then.

Czechs vs Croatia was a very even game and both deserved a draw. France vs Swiss was a one off game that France threw. Come on your being flippant. 

But by your logic it doesn't matter what teams you play, just how far you go. So the Czechs are better than Croatia because they got further? Ukraine as well.

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

8 minutes ago, DCFClks said:

Czechs vs Croatia was a very even game and both deserved a draw. France vs Swiss was a one off game that France threw. Come on your being flippant. 

But by your logic it doesn't matter what teams you play, just how far you go. So the Czechs are better than Croatia because they got further? Ukraine as well.

Thats not my logic, it sounds like your logic! Im making the point that you can't call one off matches like that. 

In terms of whats better and who is better, it counts in terms of tournament football. It's a knockout competition with one off matches. The best team won't always win but if you beat the teams in front of you constantly, you deserve to win the tournament

Edited July 12, 2021 by TheresOnlyWanChope

[Rev]

1 hour ago, MuespachRam said:

The temperature in England yesterday was 21 degrees according to the met office….so, let’s not go round saying “it’s going to be so hot that we won’t be able to cope in Qatar” when It is blatantly not true. 

Adding to your point, we won't be playing after a full season of flogging our players to death. 

Midseason tournament, when all teams will be equally fresh, 15 months more experience into our pups, and in all likelihood an even stronger squad to select from.

It's coming home, it's just been delayed while we wait for the big prize.

[DarkFruitsRam7]

6 hours ago, nottingram said:

Another thing is that international sides generally do not play like club sides do. It’s easy to say we should give it to someone like Graham Potter but he will be working day in day out with his players and coaching them in his image. International managers do not get that luxury and so it is a completely different skill set. 

Southgate has assembled a largely very good unit from a bunch of squads who play different styles. Not many international teams are going to be playing really cohesive football unless they all come from the same club team, like the great Spain team largely did. 

As others have said I think we are a controlling midfielder away from being a really really good team. Who that is or where they are coming from I don’t know, until we have it we will struggle in games like yesterday against Italy who have a Jorginho, who is there purely to control. Rice and Phillips had good tournaments but are ball winners, not tempo setters. Even then we only conceded from a set piece where there were about 3 unlucky ricochets. Ideally we would manage the whole game better but people seem to forget there are two teams trying to win a game playing cat and mouse with each other.

Honestly utter stupidity that there are discussions about replacing a manager who has achieved more than ALL of his predecessors bar one, and was a couple of penalties away from leading us to a tournament win. 

Absolutely bang on.