ariotofmyown Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 17 minutes ago, maxjam said: I'd agree with that - ideally we can all learn from each other to help limit future pandemics. Amongst other things our threat assessment and containment strategies were borderline useless, which resulted in a rush to get vaccinated - whereas Australia's quick and decisive actions now seem to be backfiring as the public don't perceive the threat to be as great. Backfiring is a strong word to describe it. A "downside" of under 1k deaths is that the public don't see Covid as a major threat. I wouldn't say that preventing 1000s of excess deaths has backfired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, Anag Ram said: Because her sister is at risk due to a congenital condition. Every injection we have comes with risk. She wants the vaccination herself so she doesn't unwittingly pass it on to someone more vulnerable. Thats fair enough then and if she's not being pressured into it then great ? My Mum and Dad (both in their 70s) ask whether my lad (18) has had his jab every single time either I or he goes around ? He doesn't want it and as far as I'm concerned no one in our family is at much risk, especially now anyone that wants it has been jabbed - its his body, his choice. TBH I've said earlier in the thread that he's at an age that the risk of waiting 10 years for the long term data come in is probably no different to the risk of him suffering a bad case of covid in the meantime. Anag Ram and uttoxram75 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ariotofmyown Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 1 hour ago, maxjam said: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-56825920 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-57181038 In short there seems to be several problems; - supply shortages - logistical problems - vaccine hesitancy - low covid infection rate leading to no rush to get jabbed - fears over the AstraZenica vaccine Oh yeah, I'm aware of all that. The point of my post was to say it would not have been some fantastical situation if both their track & trace, and their vaccination programme, had both been successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 57 minutes ago, Boycie said: Apparently there’s a big out break in Cleethorpes? Is it worse than that time there was an outbreak of crabs in Cleethorpes? https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/grimsby-news/hundreds-starfish-crabs-wash-up-1295408 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said: Backfiring is a strong word to describe it. A "downside" of under 1k deaths is that the public don't see Covid as a major threat. I wouldn't say that preventing 1000s of excess deaths has backfired. I posted this earlier this morning - the cost of their extreme lockdowns don't come cost free; Well now we're back to the long term damage of lockdowns and whether the cost of them is greater than the benefits. Scientists will no doubt be debating that question for years... https://www.theaustralian.com.au/commentary/what-if-lockdowns-dont-save-lives/news-story/5a7b69881d3323d5edd51698270e2422 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 1 minute ago, ariotofmyown said: Oh yeah, I'm aware of all that. The point of my post was to say it would not have been some fantastical situation if both their track & trace, and their vaccination programme, had both been successful. In an ideal world maybe. However, seeing as pretty much every country has fallen short with at least one major aspect of their covid response strategies, getting everything right was probably more fantasy than reality ? Will lessons be learnt for the future? Maybe I'm being naive to think they will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 1 hour ago, jimmyp said: Interesting survey. Quite surprised by the results. It's a tough one. Miss Wolfie is 8, so is extremely unlikely to have any problem with Covid. She also seems to have a very good immune system - the only thing she's ever really had is relatively mild chicken pox at 18 months old. She never even seems to get more than a bit of a night-time sniffle every few months, never mind a proper cold. It boils down to the balance of risks between Covid/long Covid and having the vaccine of course. I suppose my gut feeling is I'd rather she caught Covid eventually and let her deal with it "naturally", but then there's always the what-if isn't there?. Then I ask myself: For all the other vaccinations she's already had over the years, how much research did I do at the time into possible side effects and how well tested they were? - Answer: Zero. I was told she should have the jab, so she had it. I should probably trust those who would tell us to vaccinate her, shouldn't I?. Like I said, a tough one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Ram Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 3 hours ago, angieram said: It must have been easier for Australia to cut itself off from the rest of the world due to its geographical location. Their economy is not so heavily reliant on international commerce and they are not a major travel hub. Also citizens are less likely to be clamouring for travel when they already have a fantastic lifestyle at home! But sooner or later they had to open up so they should have been just as keen on getting everyone vaccinated as the rest of the world. That they are so far behind others is quite sad and just demonstrates that it is necessity that fuels action. Britain has been so good at vaccination because it was our only practical route out of the pandemic, so we got on with it. Oh Angie, where were you when we had Bush Tucker Man on here everyday telling us that Australia was a global hub for everything and that they had lockdowns nailed down. In fact where is he at all now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 3 hours ago, ariotofmyown said: That is the sort of response when someone tries to say Derby would have won the league if we had beaten a,b,c and x,y,z. The post you replied to was simply saying if Aus had done their vaccination programme as well as their track and trace system, they would have done a brilliant overall job throughout the pandemic. Under 1k deaths shows they have successfully manage to keep deaths low, of which their tracking system was clearly a important component. Why do you think it's ludicrous to suggest they could have had a successful vaccination programme too? After dealing with tracking and tracing so well, I'd have thought a successful vaccination programme was more likely than not. Well for a first thing vaccine take up among people not in the slightest afraid of the virus is an issue, as stated , 125 k deaths even if you believe the from any cause within 28 days from a positive test out of 70 million takes a massive fear campaign and coercive measures to get to where WE are , now the campaign is Sterling to be waged to vaccinate children who don’t need it?♂️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 27 minutes ago, Angry Ram said: Oh Angie, where were you when we had Bush Tucker Man on here everyday telling us that Australia was a global hub for everything and that they had lockdowns nailed down. In fact where is he at all now? Avoiding this thread! ? Gaspode and Angry Ram 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 52 minutes ago, Wolfie said: Then I ask myself: For all the other vaccinations she's already had over the years, how much research did I do at the time into possible side effects and how well tested they were? - Answer: Zero. The key issue I have is that we are now using RNA vaccines instead of traditional vaccines; https://www.breakthroughs.com/advancing-medical-research/what-makes-rna-vaccine-different-conventional-vaccine Now, there may be nothing at all wrong with these new vaccines. They may indeed be the wonder vaccine of the future that can be adapted to protect us against many, many things - as many hope they will be ? However, when one of the guys that helped to develop the technology warns against its widespread use - especially in the younger generations who are at minimal risk from covid (see video I posted earlier in the thread) because we simply don't have 3, 5, 10 years worth of data re. any potential long term effects, its probably worth taking time to weigh up your risk of succumbing to covid vs any long term effects the vaccine may end up causing. I personally feel that shifting the original goalposts from vaccinating the elderly and vulnerable to everyone now over 12 is bordering on reckless; https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57358446 uttoxram75 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 4 minutes ago, maxjam said: The key issue I have is that we are now using RNA vaccines instead of traditional vaccines; https://www.breakthroughs.com/advancing-medical-research/what-makes-rna-vaccine-different-conventional-vaccine Now, there may be nothing at all wrong with these new vaccines. They may indeed be the wonder vaccine of the future that can be adapted to protect us against many, many things - as many hope they will be ? However, when one of the guys that helped to develop the technology warns against its widespread use - especially in the younger generations who are at minimal risk from covid (see video I posted earlier in the thread) because we simply don't have 3, 5, 10 years worth of data re. any potential long term effects, its probably worth taking time to weigh up your risk of succumbing to covid vs any long term effects the vaccine may end up causing. I personally feel that shifting the original goalposts from vaccinating the elderly and vulnerable to everyone now over 12 is bordering on reckless; https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57358446 Totally agree and the way they go about these things is the worry , we are now seeing massive testing in kids ( anyone remember kids not a threat or at threat) and an approach/ policy that is at present keeping 350 k kids off school and worsening , shock horror the answer to this disruption to children’s lives and education plus parents work disruption is we desperately need to vaccinate all children ??♂️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 5 minutes ago, Archied said: the answer to this disruption to children’s lives and education plus parents work disruption is we desperately need to vaccinate all children do you not think that's just because it's the bluntest instrument we have towards returning life to normal? I know it has risks, but what's the alternative approach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 11 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said: do you not think that's just because it's the bluntest instrument we have towards returning life to normal? I know it has risks, but what's the alternative approach? Well Vaccinating the elderly and at risk ??♂️, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 5 hours ago, maxjam said: Seeing as we're talking about Australia, this is trending on twitter right now; They are not exactly encouraging vaccine take up over there are they! To be fair however, imo once you've vaccinated everyone over 50 and the vulnerable the risk to everyone else is minimal enough to open back up anyway. The alternative is to keep locking down forever in the vain hope of preventing future variants and achieving covid zero. It’s because they know the vaccine is a stealth birth control aimed at preventing population growth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 6 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: It’s because they know the vaccine is a stealth birth control aimed at preventing population growth. Ramathorn, Ghost of Clough, Ambitious and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 14 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: It’s because they know the vaccine is a stealth birth control aimed at preventing population growth. You know you're allowed to go fishing outside now, don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 I see that we are now dipping in to the dumbass part of the Internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 If the vaccine makes you sterile, will the future gene pool be entirely made of anti vaxxers? God help us. DarkFruitsRam7, Comrade 86, angieram and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 12 minutes ago, GboroRam said: If the vaccine makes you sterile, will the future gene pool be entirely made of anti vaxxers? God help us. Of course it won’t ,, they will all be dead from covid after not taking the vaccine ??♂️ Norman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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