Tamworthram Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 5 hours ago, ossieram said: So you'll be quite happy to let Boris and the Tories run the country unhindered now they have been democratically elected? I’m no Boris fan but isn’t that why we elect MPs? During which period in our history, or indeed in any country, have decision been made on a regular basis by referendum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted March 14, 2020 Share Posted March 14, 2020 20 hours ago, BaaLocks said: Nothing worse than being able to accept defeat? What about a zombie apocalypse, surely that has to be worse. I'm not actually putting forward any arguments, that race is run, what I am doing is responding to the initial point that suggested the referendum was a clear cut democratic decision made by the people. And my answer to that is clear - yeah, right..... And to suggest that it was clear in or out is about as deluded as it comes. Farage and Johnson don't agree and Corbyn couldn't even get himself to agree what it was he disagreed on. Don't matter where you sit, clear is the one thing it ain't. I don't agree entirely that the referendum was a bad idea - at the time the clamour to be heard was growing and I do think all sides deserved the right. It was the question we were asked that fudged us up for a generation. But we're there now so, as you say, now is not the time for moaning. I'm just sitting back and waiting for all the leavers to start whining that they haven't got what they voted for. It's as guaranteed as rain before Christmas. The question put to the people was a clear in or out and to suggest it could be have been done any differently is deluded , you couldn’t have a how long is a piece of string referendum , the simple truth is that nobody on the spectrum of avid leavers to avid remainers and everything in between can say with certainty how things would work out whether leaving or remaining , not trying to be rude but saying your sitting waiting for leavers to whine they haven’t got what they voted for is just plain patronising to those who perhaps weighed things as best they could and voted leave ,perhaps they knew it wasn’t clear cut with pros and cons ? I didn’t vote in it , not because I didn’t care or couldn’t be bothered but simply because I felt I really didn’t know enough to vote either way with decent certainty but slightly edged on remain and probably still do , still think that for many reasons not least the split it’s caused in the nation the referendum was a big mistake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted March 15, 2020 Share Posted March 15, 2020 Imagine if everyone had got as cross about people hoarding the world's wealth in tax havens as they are about people hoarding toilet roll? Instead we just said "oh it's human nature to be greedy". Now people are wondering if they'll ever be able to wipe their arses again I'm beginning to wonder if the biggest victim of coronavirus isn't going to be capitalism itself? We have a long way to go, but almost every nation on earth shutting down a huge chunk of it's economy is surely going to have profound effects And let's be honest, this isn't even the worst thing that could happen. A huge solar storm like the Carrington Event of 1859 could knock out electricity grids and the internet for months. Right now we're dealing with this by limiting social contact, but largely supply chains and manufacture will continue. How would we deal with having no electricity? I genuinely hope that I'm wrong, and that we get through this without too much life-changing shizzle happening, but one thing's for sure - we need to actually start planning for major disruptive events a lot better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted March 16, 2020 Share Posted March 16, 2020 What are folks getting worked up over a clever lad, it's just supply and demand, right? Or are we just capitalists when it suits us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted March 16, 2020 Share Posted March 16, 2020 37 minutes ago, ramit said: What are folks getting worked up over a clever lad, it's just supply and demand, right? Or are we just capitalists when it suits us? Do we ever get a real choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted March 16, 2020 Share Posted March 16, 2020 17 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Do we ever get a real choice? You mean in voting, getting the choice of which capitalistic party to vote for? Sure we do. None of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ram for All Seasons Posted March 16, 2020 Share Posted March 16, 2020 The British government has announced it would support up to £1bn of state-backed lending through the British Business Bank, as part of a wider £12bn package of support for households and firms. High street banks will also raise their lending by around £21bn. The French state will underwrite additional loans worth €300bn (£273.3bn), more than 300 times the level of UK support. Last week, Germany said it would expand lending at its KfW state-backed investment bank from €460bn to €550bn. It looks like the money tree has wilted again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted March 16, 2020 Share Posted March 16, 2020 11 minutes ago, A Ram for All Seasons said: The British government has announced it would support up to £1bn of state-backed lending through the British Business Bank, as part of a wider £12bn package of support for households and firms. High street banks will also raise their lending by around £21bn. The French state will underwrite additional loans worth €300bn (£273.3bn), more than 300 times the level of UK support. Last week, Germany said it would expand lending at its KfW state-backed investment bank from €460bn to €550bn. It looks like the money tree has wilted again. The money trees are flourishing. Pity they're in the Cayman Islands..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Ram Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 7 hours ago, A Ram for All Seasons said: The British government has announced it would support up to £1bn of state-backed lending through the British Business Bank, as part of a wider £12bn package of support for households and firms. High street banks will also raise their lending by around £21bn. The French state will underwrite additional loans worth €300bn (£273.3bn), more than 300 times the level of UK support. Last week, Germany said it would expand lending at its KfW state-backed investment bank from €460bn to €550bn. It looks like the money tree has wilted again. And you don’t think the UK will react in the same way as the situation develops? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 Just now, Angry Ram said: And you don’t think the UK will react in the same way as the situation develops? We'll need a 3 word slogan before our government moves. Get Covid Done for example? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 48 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said: We'll need a 3 word slogan before our government moves. Get Covid Done for example? ? Covid means Covid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ram for All Seasons Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 43 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Covid means Covid. Red, white and blue Covid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 One naughty word at the end. Too funny not to share though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EtoileSportiveDeDerby Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 1 hour ago, GboroRam said: Covid means Covid. The experts say stick a plaster on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 I was kind of hoping that the scale of the crisis may force the Tories to show some actual compassion Sadly not. She could have just ignored the tweet. But to reply "get a life" - wow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Ram for All Seasons Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 2 hours ago, Angry Ram said: And you don’t think the UK will react in the same way as the situation develops? The British government should certainly do the same, and even George Osborne has now demanded that it do so, but the question is whether it can afford it. Germany ended 2019 with a budget surplus of €13.5 billion and it has consistently achieved a budget surplus every year in recent times. The UK general government deficit was £41.5 billion in 2019, which is the best it has been for a long time. Austerity and public spending cuts have had the effect that Britain now has only 6.6 intensive care beds per 100,000 of population whereas Germany has 29.2. So Britain will have to borrow on the international money markets, and investors will have to decide whether they really want to invest their money there. This comes at a time when Britain is in the process of cutting itself off from its main export markets, which is basically what Brexit is, and its creditworthiness will suffer as a result. Coronavirus means that every country is out for itself and nobody will do Britain any favours in the Brexit negotiations They do not need us more than we need them. My life savings are mainly in German shares and bonds issued by German state-owned banks, because I know which side my bread is buttered, but even their value has fallen by about 19 % because of coronavirus. Thank God I don't need to sell anything yet, but I am absolutely bricking it and fearful of what the future might bring. This is, of course, my personal opinion and not a hard fact, before anybody tries to get their red, white and blue knickers in a twist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted March 17, 2020 Author Share Posted March 17, 2020 On 13/03/2020 at 10:59, ariotofmyown said: Why does the country need to be united to get a deal. We were told before the referendum that getting a deal would be the easiest thing ever. There was also no talk of leaving without a deal that could seriously damage the country. If I voted Leave I'd be rather fed up how the goalposts have moved so far since the referendum. Newsflash...I forgot we won the war. Let's stick it to the EU! 3 years on and you're still keeping this charade. Its laughable. It was discussed by the Prime Minister. If I show you a clip will you agree to stop repeating this tripe? On 13/03/2020 at 11:15, ariotofmyown said: Would you have voted Leave if you had actually been told how difficult getting a good deal would be and that we might well end up without a deal which could have severe economic impacts? The general tone from prominent leavers was the EU would do as we say because we are British god dammit. Maybe/maybe not. As it was, nobody could, or still has, provided anything credible to prove this theory of 'severe economic impacts'. On 13/03/2020 at 12:30, BaaLocks said: Let's see how joyous and united all those Leavers who knew what they exactly were voting for will be this time next year. Remember, you all know exactly what you voted for. Yes, I cant speak for other people, but I know exactly what I voted for. It was there on the ballot paper...'Leave the European Union'. Did I know all of the complexities? No. Do I think I did as much research as possible to come to an educated decision? Yes. Did any of that research include false facts or biased information? Probably. Do I think in light of any of that information I would change my vote now? No. On 13/03/2020 at 17:21, ariotofmyown said: It was also good for the Leavers to have the referendum during loads of terror attacks. Helped feed into the 'be wary of the other" narrative. Wow, you're really scraping the barrel with that one. How many of the terrorists involved in the attacks that you are alluding to came to the UK because of an open border policy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 More Tory compassion coming to light Quote In a conference call with over 60 businesses last night, Johnson and Michael Gove asked manufacturers to step up to help deal with the shortage. However, according to POLITICO, Johnson joked that the initiative to build more ventilators could be known as "Operation Last Gasp". One participant speaking with POLITICO journalist Charlie Cooper said “He couldn’t help but act the clown, even though he was a on call with serious CEOs from goodness knows how many companies.” FFS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworthram Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 1 hour ago, SchtivePesley said: I was kind of hoping that the scale of the crisis may force the Tories to show some actual compassion Sadly not. She could have just ignored the tweet. But to reply "get a life" - wow Don’t fall into the trap of taring all politicians with the same brush. Assuming this is genuine then it’s an appalling response but I very much doubt all tories would be so insensitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted March 17, 2020 Share Posted March 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, Tamworthram said: Don’t fall into the trap of taring all politicians with the same brush. Assuming this is genuine then it’s an appalling response but I very much doubt all tories would be so insensitive. Well that's kind of my point - I try and believe that deep down, people are good and it's not unreasonable of us to expect higher standards of those we democratically elect to public office. In the face of the current crisis I was rather hoping that we start to see Tory MPs showing their sensitive side. Obviously I'm not tarring them all on this basis. Just that this is close to home, she is the MP of my parents and my sister/family And it is genuine - she's not deleted it yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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