How long?

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

6 minutes ago, Archied said:

Not really a workable suggestion to people who have watched Derby for the best part of 50 years and more ,

 

im not for sacking him but if there’s to be improvement he has to be backed financially but my gut feeling is we will soon see Rooney as player manager as in today’s crazy football world it’s the commercial choice

We have to give him this season and at least 1 transfer window. 
 

The guy has had a lot to deal with and I do t think many managers would have coped with losing their captain in the circumstances that occurred. 
 

Lots of players need to go and when this happens, we will hopefully have a good 3-4 academy players getting experience and new players who want to be at Derby and good enough to go on a good winning run. We also have Rooney coming in which can only be a good thing IMO. 

[Archied]

7 minutes ago, CHCDerby said:

We have to give him this season and at least 1 transfer window. 
 

The guy has had a lot to deal with and I do t think many managers would have coped with losing their captain in the circumstances that occurred. 
 

Lots of players need to go and when this happens, we will hopefully have a good 3-4 academy players getting experience and new players who want to be at Derby and good enough to go on a good winning run. We also have Rooney coming in which can only be a good thing IMO. 

I agree ,, my post / position wasn’t a sack cocu call but a serious question as to whether it could well happen soon

[Tamworthram]

46 minutes ago, therealhantsram said:

This is such nonsense.

I'll make 2 points.

1. All the problems you're seeing here tonight existed last season. Almost every single match we failed to turn up in the first half.  "Too slow out of the blocks" everyone said. It took a half-time rollocking to get into gear. These are not new problems that Cocu has created.  They are existing problems Cocu has been learning about. Frank couldn't fix them. Cocu hasn't had a window yet in which to attempt to fix them. And as posted elsewhere, for the period Mount was out injured last season, Frank's record was worse than Cocus.

2. We currently have a patched up third rate midfield.  Bielik, Shinnie and Huddlestone would all walk into this midfield. Instead we are making do with Holmes, Knight and Evans.  It's no wonder we look poor. And not only that, Cocu has had rotten luck with long-term injuries... Shinnie, Huddlestone, Keogh, Bogle, Clarke all missing for months at a time, and all 5 would be first  team starters when available.  You can't take 5 players out of a team for months and expect great results.

So calms yourselves down. This is the time for patience. Cocu is going nowhere.  Wait and see what happens in January.

 

I think there is a bit of difference between being slow out the blocks and being truly awful. I don't remember many games as bad as that last season except Villa away. 

[CornwallRam]

Cocu was meant to be a continuity of the Lampard way of playing. The idea was that we would build without too much disruption. That's the whole reason behind the 'Derby Way' strategy. Yet now we're supposed to be happy with an impending relegation battle because the whole team needs rebuilding? Our owners are supposed to trust Cocu with their cash in January to continue with his masterplan?

Is Cocu building or just flailing around in desperation? 

If it was your money, would you trust Cocu with it?

How bad would it have to get to replace him?

I can understand why people want o give Cocu time. I thought he was a great appointment. But the last time I saw such a muddled Derby County team, Peter Taylor was our manager and we were too good to go down.

[DCFC27]

1 hour ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

Neil Warnock will be Rams manager before the end of the season, I can just see it now.

Say what you like about him, there no one better equipped to take a team up. I’d just sack him the day after promotion.

[uttoxram75]

Im going to start moaning if we are half way through Phil's four year contract and not looking like a coherent unit. 

If, after four years, we're not in the Premier League, I may be very irate and begin to wonder if we need to change manager.

[Ellafella]

30 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

Cocu was meant to be a continuity of the Lampard way of playing. The idea was that we would build without too much disruption. That's the whole reason behind the 'Derby Way' strategy. Yet now we're supposed to be happy with an impending relegation battle because the whole team needs rebuilding? Our owners are supposed to trust Cocu with their cash in January to continue with his masterplan?

Is Cocu building or just flailing around in desperation? 

If it was your money, would you trust Cocu with it?

How bad would it have to get to replace him?

I can understand why people want o give Cocu time. I thought he was a great appointment. But the last time I saw such a muddled Derby County team, Peter Taylor was our manager and we were too good to go down.

Watch the Derby players and staff arrive at PP. They arrive after the away team, and scurry off the bus into the entrance with heads down and a stiff gait...their body language says it all. They are not cohesive and they don’t believe in themselves. As a collective they look devoid of any leadership. 

[GrimsbyRam]

5 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

Watch the Derby players and staff arrive at PP. They arrive after the away team, and scurry off the bus into the entrance with heads down and a stiff gait...their body language says it all. They are not cohesive and they don’t believe in themselves. As a collective they look devoid of any leadership. 

Martin’s interview was telling after the game. It seems the players are trying to sort out this mess more than the management.

[RamNut]

The next 5 games couldn’t be easier fixtures.

if we mess them up then I think it will be GAME OVER

 

[MackworthRamIsGod]

17 minutes ago, RamNut said:

The next 5 games couldn’t be easier fixtures.

if we mess them up then I think it will be GAME OVER

 

The crazy thing about this division, win 3 or 4 of those on the trot and you find yourselves bang up near the playoffs.

[TimRam]

See how we are with Beilek, Shinny and Rooney in the team.

[Ghost of Clough]

10 hours ago, Archied said:

Until Rooney is player manager?

Never. Cocu will still be his manager by the time Rooney either leaves the club, or hangs up his boots

[AdamRam]

8 hours ago, CornwallRam said:

Cocu was meant to be a continuity of the Lampard way of playing. The idea was that we would build without too much disruption. That's the whole reason behind the 'Derby Way' strategy. Yet now we're supposed to be happy with an impending relegation battle because the whole team needs rebuilding? Our owners are supposed to trust Cocu with their cash in January to continue with his masterplan?

Is Cocu building or just flailing around in desperation? 

If it was your money, would you trust Cocu with it?

How bad would it have to get to replace him?

I can understand why people want o give Cocu time. I thought he was a great appointment. But the last time I saw such a muddled Derby County team, Peter Taylor was our manager and we were too good to go down.

Is it Cocu spending the money though or our recruitment team ? I wouldn’t have trusted him with the kitty in the summer due to his lack of knowledge of the league, wasn’t that why others were brought in to help with that part ?

Lampards way of playing was built on the foundation’s of an England midfielder and defender on loan along with a lot of goals from another loanee thrown in.
 

Cocu lost these, Johnson, Bryson, Carson and keough from last season, how was he ever going to continue from where Lampard left off ?

[King Kevin]

24 minutes ago, RamNut said:

The next 5 games couldn’t be easier fixtures.

if we mess them up then I think it will be GAME OVER

 

There are no easy fixtures in the Championship unfortunately .We are quite capable of losing to any of them.

[Brammie Steve]

7 minutes ago, TimRam said:

See how we are with Beilek, Shinny and Rooney in the team.

Will that ever happen, given our history of injuries and recent team building jaunts?

[RamNut]

9 hours ago, therealhantsram said:

Bielik, Shinnie and Huddlestone would all walk into this midfield.

Bielik and huddlestone play the same position. If both were playing it really would be Rowett-ball. 

Anyway Huddz is part of the problem. Too slow. Too deep. Too old. 

[Rammy03]

Just now, TimRam said:

See how we are with Beilek, Shinny and Rooney in the team

This is the only positive, we cannot get any worse as without those two our midfield is extremely weak. Add a real creative midfielder to them and we could look quite good

[BondJovi]

4 minutes ago, RamNut said:

Bielik and huddlestone play the same position. If both were playing it really would be Rowett-ball. 

Anyway Huddz is part of the problem. Too slow. Too deep. Too old. 

Be better than Evans. 

[CornwallRam]

8 minutes ago, AdamRam said:

Is it Cocu spending the money though or our recruitment team ? I wouldn’t have trusted him with the kitty in the summer due to his lack of knowledge of the league, wasn’t that why others were brought in to help with that part ?

Lampards way of playing was built on the foundation’s of an England midfielder and defender on loan along with a lot of goals from another loanee thrown in.
 

Cocu lost these, Johnson, Bryson, Carson and keough from last season, how was he ever going to continue from where Lampard left off ?

By using a similar system and rely on the evidence of what worked and what didn't last season. 

No point in going for continuity if there is none. The idea was to build. Even if it wasn't linear progression, the players from the U14s up would get used to the Derby way of playing. That means choosing a system and sticking to it. In that system you are bound to have a couple of players in the side who aren't in their favoured role, but they either adapt or get replaced in the next window. The theory then is, over a number of windows, we only bring in players to fit the system, so build a team and a squad. 

If the manager leaves, it's no big problem. We just recruit another one who will play the same system. That's the theory.

Yet Cocu hasn't continued. Cocu hasn't got a system. How can we build?

The alternative is a pragmatic manager who will adapt the system to suit the players. That's a short term solution and not a way to build. If we're going down that route  we're better off with Warnock.

And that's OK with me. Quick promotion and build a team in the PL. The continuity building approach is also fine with me. The problem is that Cocu is neither of these things. We are in danger of going down.

[BondJovi]

7 hours ago, GrimsbyRam said:

Martin’s interview was telling after the game. It seems the players are trying to sort out this mess more than the management.

Is this all fallout from the Keogh sacking? Shouldn't matter who the manager is, effort and fight is a minimum requirement.