Aden Flint

[tomsdubs]

2 hours ago, nottingram said:

I couldn't care less if my centre back had a 1:2 goal a game ratio if he couldn't defend properly.

I assume we'd be signing this player to help us with our weakness defending crosses. His Bristol City side that drew 3-3 at Pride Park this season conceded two of those three from crosses. One of which was a header scored by Tom Ince ffs 

Yeah and Flint was punching the ground in frustration at his team mates. He was shouting at his back line pointingt at his head like a mad man. I judge players on individual basis, he's in a poor team but his own personal performance is more important. Chris Martin was **** when we bought him, on loan at Swindon being below par in L1. That's why scouts are paid to watch a player's actual performance and not make judgement on some team facts.

[Leicester Ram]

24 minutes ago, RamsPolls said:

@Leicester Ram - Agree with everything you said! I'm not saying that i'm writing us off as a destination for him. But I just think that he will be wanted by almost every championship club if Swansea stay up. It'll turn into a bidding war and I think a club in a different position to us can pay a little more for him to be able to get him there.

I'd love him here. Don't get me wrong, but with the season he's had for Leeds... A lot of clubs will be willing to pay big money for him.

Thanks, Polls, I agree with everything I've said too.

Really, all it comes down to is that I think if we paid 5 million for Flint it would be a massive rip off. You can't make the argument we shouldn't bid for Bartley because his price might inflate then offer Flint as a sensible alternative. Flint's price is inflated too, because of his new contract!

Even if Bartley's fee went anywhere near that high (I don't think it will) I still think we'd still be getting our money's worth.

I genuinely think Bartley will go for less than 5 million, maybe 5 million as a top end estimate. Do you think Swansea would reject a bid of 4 million for a player they're not sure will cut it in their team who only has a year left on his contract?

I'd rather "overpay" for someone who'll improve our defence than overpay for someone who won't improve our defence. Only positive I see from Flint is that he gives the fans a different scapegoat to Pearce, Shackell and Keogh, because we're bored of them. 

[jimbobram]

14 hours ago, Wolfie20 said:

I've no problem with Keogh being replaced as captain but he's far away our best defender and the fact that he's been here for a few seasons is completely irrelevant. Will Hughes has played longer for Derby so is it time for him to go as well?

 

14 hours ago, kingsy1884 said:

out of the few CBs we can get rid of I think he is the last one. More likely to see Pearce and Shackell go than Keogh.

The fact that he is our best defender says it all. We need to move on. We need to progress. He might be the best we have, but he isn't good enough if we want to be serious challengers. I've not seen a player (especially a captain) blame other people so much for his mistakes. I love the way he makes last ditch tackles and shows passion when we score and win, but most of the time he's making last ditch tackles because he has allowed that to happen.

 

And wolfie, Hughes has much more chance of progressing to become a better player with age on his side, Keogh at 30 doesn't.

[DCFC1388]

2 hours ago, Papahet said:

We need height in the side. We've struggled all season at defending set pieces;  5'10 Johnny Russell offers nothing when marking a defender 6 foot plus - just look at the Forest equalizer 

Flint, Wistom, Roberts, Bartley...

I'd take any one of them 

Add Manga to that list as well

[Gaspode]

2 hours ago, Ramarena said:

Is this guy a significant upgrade on Shackell?

If he stays fit for most of the season and looks like he gives a toss, then yes.....

[rynny]

1 hour ago, jimbobram said:

 

The fact that he is our best defender says it all. We need to move on. We need to progress. He might be the best we have, but he isn't good enough if we want to be serious challengers. I've not seen a player (especially a captain) blame other people so much for his mistakes. I love the way he makes last ditch tackles and shows passion when we score and win, but most of the time he's making last ditch tackles because he has allowed that to happen.

 

And wolfie, Hughes has much more chance of progressing to become a better player with age on his side, Keogh at 30 doesn't.

I would have thought that we would need to replace the players that aren't the best in their position before replacing our better players?

[Kernow]

2 hours ago, Ramarena said:

Is this guy a significant upgrade on Shackell?

This point is why I think the Flint move would be a pointless one to be honest.

He's big, he wins headers, he's a no nonsense defender who is pretty slow and not the most mobile. Use that description and it could equally describe Shackell as well as it could Flint. Out of all our defenders, I think Shackell is our best and he would be the one I would look to sell last. A Flint/Shackell partnership would be far too slow in my opinion, I think any time with a pacey striker would do well against us. If we had a pairing of Roberts from Barnsley and Flint, that should work much better, but would that be worth £8million? I don't think so.

If we have to sell to buy this summer then I think the £5mil for Flint would be much better utilised elsewhere personally. If he was already our player, I'd have him starting, but if we need to pay £5mil to get him here I'd rather look elsewhere.

[bcnram]

2 hours ago, jimbobram said:

 

The fact that he is our best defender says it all. We need to move on. We need to progress. He might be the best we have, but he isn't good enough if we want to be serious challengers. I've not seen a player (especially a captain) blame other people so much for his mistakes. I love the way he makes last ditch tackles and shows passion when we score and win, but most of the time he's making last ditch tackles because he has allowed that to happen.

 

And wolfie, Hughes has much more chance of progressing to become a better player with age on his side, Keogh at 30 doesn't.

I think you have summed up why so many supporters like Keogh with the first bold part. The second sums up why I think we can do much, much better than Keogh. I liked him under Clement because he was more controlled in his play, but to my mind he has regressed back to where he was. I don't like the centre-backs charging around, I like them to show a better ability in reading the game. Paolo Maldini said that "if I have to make a tackle then I have already made a mistake". I am not expecting a championship defender to be that good, but I do expect them to be much better than Richard Keogh in that department if our defence is to improve. It is also no use in changing the other centre back if we still have one lacking discipline in his positioning, those two above all have to operate as a partnership together. 

[Nuwtfly]

Worth pointing out as well that it's often a pretty bad idea to base your opinion of an individual player on the performances of his team in general. Jordan Pickford's a fantastic keeper, but not if you look at Sunderland's form, etc.

[PodgeyRam]

1 hour ago, Nuwtfly said:

Worth pointing out as well that it's often a pretty bad idea to base your opinion of an individual player on the performances of his team in general. Jordan Pickford's a fantastic keeper, but not if you look at Sunderland's form, etc.

Indeed. Jake Buxton got relegated last season with Wigan and he's better than all of our centre-backs.

[Wolfie20]

35 minutes ago, PodgeyRam said:

Indeed. Jake Buxton got relegated last season with Wigan and he's better than all of our centre-backs.

He isn't and never was. Loved his commitment and JB was a good passer of the ball but his positional play was poor.

[PodgeyRam]

18 minutes ago, Wolfie20 said:

He isn't and never was. Loved his commitment and JB was a good passer of the ball but his positional play was poor.

I disagree. If his positional play was poor, he would've been caught out a hell of a lot more times than he was, given he was never the paciest of players.

I think he's better than Pearce in every department (except for age), better than Shackell in most departments and better than Keogh in most departments. 

Suspect most people won't agree with me there though.

[EnigmaRam]

2 hours ago, PodgeyRam said:

I disagree. If his positional play was poor, he would've been caught out a hell of a lot more times than he was, given he was never the paciest of players.

I think he's better than Pearce in every department (except for age), better than Shackell in most departments and better than Keogh in most departments. 

Suspect most people won't agree with me there though.

At least you got something right ?

[Andicis]

3 hours ago, PodgeyRam said:

I disagree. If his positional play was poor, he would've been caught out a hell of a lot more times than he was, given he was never the paciest of players.

I think he's better than Pearce in every department (except for age), better than Shackell in most departments and better than Keogh in most departments. 

Suspect most people won't agree with me there though.

I agree with him being better than Pearce and Shackell, don't agree with him being better than Keogh however. 

[PodgeyRam]

1 hour ago, EnigmaRam said:

At least you got something right ?

What part do you disagree with? Is it that I think he's better than Keogh? or is it that I think he's better than Shackell? Or both?

For what it's worth, I think him and Keogh are roughly on a par with one another, with Buxton's calmness when under pressure putting him just ahead.

[PodgeyRam]

4 minutes ago, Andicis said:

I agree with him being better than Pearce and Shackell, don't agree with him being better than Keogh however. 

I can see why you'd think that. There's no doubt in my mind that Keogh is our best defender right now, and I think Buxton's only a tiny bit better than him.

[Andicis]

40 minutes ago, PodgeyRam said:

I can see why you'd think that. There's no doubt in my mind that Keogh is our best defender right now, and I think Buxton's only a tiny bit better than him.

It's a fair point, I think Keogh's height advantage gives him a slight edge over Buxton, although Buxton was very good in the air still. The fact of the matter is Buxton was a much better fit for Derby in playstyle, and he had the passion to go with it!

[BathRam72]

On ‎07‎/‎05‎/‎2017 at 11:51, Bwash_Ram said:

He's massive and scores quite a few goals, would improve us at set pieces (at either end of the pitch)

We don't need someone who will score at both ends, just theres

[DazzaRam]

Don't like the look of Flint at all. He's gangly and gets caught out plenty of times. He actually reminds me of Albentosa,and will cost a lot more.

[swadieram]

Buxton gave the team the heart & togetherness we are missing .