Depression, anxiety, stress and other related issues

[Mostyn6]

I did read all of that @RamDon but  decided not to quote you. 

I hate bullies and i hate judgemental sections in the workplace whose directive is to clearly find negative in people. 

Hope you get chance to bend them over mate. Sad thing that a junior manager appears to have been promoted with a proviso of getting you out.  Her career could also be ruined for selling her soul, assuming you hurt them. 

Keep us updated, more importantly, keep on top of yourself mate x

[Cisse]

I'm worried that this thread will become very active in about four hours.

[EssendonRam]

12 hours ago, Mostyn6 said:

I did read all of that @RamDon but  decided not to quote you. 

I hate bullies and i hate judgemental sections in the workplace whose directive is to clearly find negative in people. 

Hope you get chance to bend them over mate. Sad thing that a junior manager appears to have been promoted with a proviso of getting you out.  Her career could also be ruined for selling her soul, assuming you hurt them. 

Keep us updated, more importantly, keep on top of yourself mate x

Thanks Mostyn. I tried to "like" your comment but am getting a response telling me I am not permitted to.

Until relatively recently, I had defended my new reporting line, much to the chagrin of my sister who, as a qualified psychologist, 'picked' the agenda far earlier than I did. Ironically, one of the more valid criticisms of me in my professional life (aside from a tendency to overanalyse  almost everything and  everyone; that doesn't come through in my writing, does it? ?) has been how judgemental I could be of others' behaviour and how cold and calculated I could be when office politics got 'nasty'.

(In my defence, I was NEVER the initiator but - to be blunt about it - it was probably better to have me on your side than against you and, as one of my closest friends said to me once only half-jokingly (two employers ago, after he found himself in a position not dissimilar to that which I have faced recently with a person I had appointed to replace me), "Why did you seem to enjoy it so much?" 

It actually disturbed me at the time that he could think that.

Although I was appalled by much of what was being done to me, I could see the discomfort they were feeling in having to do it and actually felt for them. While I would have resigned rather than carry out instructions as (frankly) immoral as those they were presumably given, I was equally appalled on their behalf at the position they had been put in.

But, contrary to my sister's perception of my sympathy for them, I (a) needed to know that I had done literally all I could have done to avoid a 'war' over the entire situation because I knew that a 'war' would probably be career-ending for all involved, and (b) it was an honest offer to find a decent and mutually beneficial way out without undermining my self-interest.

At the risk of sounding almost schizophrenic*, that is an example of how, even when I was genuinely battling depression and serious anxiety over what was happening (there were many days when I sat on my couch - fully clothed and literally ready to leave for work - endlessly trying to think of an excuse to avoid going in until I was late... despite knowing full well that being late for work would bring another (justified this time) barrage, I still had the ability to 'strategize' unemotionally.

I knew that winning them over personally and (even though it turned our reporting lines on its head) leading them to the realisation that they could both keep my skills ultimately to the benefit of their careers AND claim resolution of a very difficult situation that they had not been responsible for creating was really the only chance I had to get a 'win' without a fight. But, while offering them olive branch after olive branch, I was deliberately setting and re-setting the boundaries as a test to prove the patterns of behaviour with ultimately a court case in mind.

As emotional and fatigued and disgusted and, quite honestly, as GUTTED as I was that my career was ending in a manner akin to Hitler's retreat to Berlin**, I was still setting the tripwires, gauging the reactions, and recording the evidence for my Nuremberg.

As I tried to reassure my sister many, many times, she was misinterpreting my attempts to be conciliatory as weakness. If it came to it, I would not hesitate to blow the lot of them up (metaphorically speaking, please note ASIO***) to save myself. They had more than earned it.

She clearly thought the black humour and the bravado ("the biggest advantage I have is that they have  no idea who they have taken on") was just a diversion to placate her.

When it became clear to me that trying to find a mutually acceptable way out was simply unfeasible, I thought it had probably been a stupid idea from the start. More importantly, while I knew I hadn't  done anything to undermine my case for unfair dismissal, it was probably been too taxing on me mentally.

While I had come to the realisation some time before, the sign that I had probably kept trying to be conciliatory for far too long came in one of our 'performance management meetings' where I learned, usually for the first time, my list of transgressions for the week, tried to respond and / or seek clarification, was ignored or "corrected" in my perspective, and requested the evidence to support her perception. The next morning, the four of us (my boss and I, her boss and my witness) would receive her minutes. I would correct her minutes and return them, initially only where I considered them grossly misleading but later (in sheer frustration and, I now realise, a sign that my ability to cope was beginning to fail) corrected even a slightly misleading account (usually my response to an alleged statement of "fact"), spelling mistakes and grammatical errors.

The latter were both petty and deliberately provocative but the former law student in me justified their inclusion as addressing a key accusation, ie my alleged lack of attention to detail. Literally every week, I would remind her that her "minutes did not constitute the evidence for (her) accusations and that (she) had not provided the evidence that I had both requested and to which I was entitled. Indeed, (she) ought to have provided it before the allegation had been discussed as a 'performance management issue'."

When I added "Yet again, I have to remind you of the fundamental principles of the process designed to ensure fairness and accountability. I have copied and pasted it from last email to save some wasted effort as these 'minutes' are clearly intended only to pursue the desired outcome" it was probably the first time I had been anything less than totally civil. My witness, who has been a friend of mine for over 20 years, and I probably should have realised then that I was beginning to 'break'. The next week, after we had gone through a few of my alleged failures that week in the usual way, she raised an issue I had been Intending to confront her on, I literally interrupted her in mid-sentence saying "see, this is a perfect example of why we are wasting our time here". She appeared to ignore me. When she finished, everyone was waiting for me to respond. When I realised they were expecting me to say something, I said (pretty rudely): "Asked and answered. Next."

Apparently I had said it so quietly that no-one had heard me. Even Wayne, my witness, admitted he hadn't heard me (which, I must admit, annoyed me at the time). I then apologised and repeated that I felt my presence for the discussions were completely unnecessary. Wayne told me later that the tirade over the next few minutes was incredibly impressive, that it should have put the fear of God into them should I ever get anywhere near a witness box.

It didn't apparently.

The next day I was accused of missing several deadlines we had not even discussed, of not keeping her fully informed "in accordance with her instructions" (having provided her with an update on a particular matter a few minutes before having a 19-minute (late) lunch break during which the fellow had recalled that she'd told him to send her any of my emails on which I did not cc her and, kindly or stupidly, sent it to her with those words.

Fortuitously for me, she used his email to attack me for not updating her. It self-evidently made no sense. As I was literally stopping myself from responding in an manner which would have warranted instant dismissal, I closed down that email and opened one from her boss; it accused me of lying in my purported corrections of her minutes and threatened me with a "review of my employment status" if I persisted.

My response was a work of art (if I do say so myself). I have no idea where the calmness came from since, truthfully, I felt like crying hysterically or putting my fist through my laptop only moments before (to the extent that several of my colleagues had noticed and were genuinely concerned).

I briefly noted some of the 'issues' to which I had been subjected to on that day alone.

Then, acknowledged his accusation of deceit and pointed out that she had misinterpreted my words simply by juxtaposing what I had actually said with the interpretation she had placed on it and concluded that it was in all of our interests that I depart for the day without commenting further.

That preceded my first bout of stress leave.

At the time, I was relieved on two counts: mainly, that I was out of the maelstrom for a while and finally had a chance just to 'stop'. There's obviously no comparison (and I do not say it to offend; trust me I am not suggesting there is any comparison) but I could suddenly understand to a small degree what it must be like after leaving a war zone.

Secondly, I was fully aware of how close I had been to losing "it". Many times I barely managed to stop myself from reacting. Truthfully, that reaction had a 50-50 chance of being either hysterical or verbally abusive and I have no idea which it would have been had I not succeeded in stopping it.

With the full benefit of hindsight, I am not certain if trying so hard to be conciliatory was the right or wrong thing to do. From a legal standpoint, my solicitor was "over the moon". He has always said it is one of the clearest cases of unfair and unconscionable dismissal he has ever seen (and he is an expert in the field) but it's fair to say he was almost wetting his pants as he reviewed my response to the three-page letter of dismissal and my attached evidence.

As he said, it doesn't just raise questions about my former employers' competence and decency, it gets to the point where you have to query if they border on unhinged.

As he also noted, my deterioration from trying desperately to find a cooperative solution to the brink of snapping point comes through. He's asked my psych to review my daily notes and provide him with a formal opinion. For the first time, he is of the view that compensatory and punitive damages may come in to play. After cautioning me all along that he would be recommending I waive any future claims when they make a settlement offer (there is a maximum amount in Australia for unfair dismissal), he is now persuaded that he might recommend rejecting any settlement offer if a condition is attached to it that I must waive any future cause of action against them.

A major point I think I may have omitted (unbelievable as it may seem, after all of these words): they included in their letter of dismissal that they first had concerns about my performance last September and discussed with me those concerns; they considered placing me on performance management then. I was told this several months ago but assumed the HR expert had confused his dates. It turns out that they DID raise the possibility of subjecting me to performance management even before I returned to my original role (in October) and despite my annual performance assessment raising no issues whatsoever as at 30 September.

Getting to bend them over is no longer even remotely in question Mostyn; they will soon learn that.

As it comes out, I will be surprised if at least two don't lose their jobs, probably three. The HR expert who has been advising them will presumably be safe but he shouldn't be.

The viciousness of their conduct, right down to the precise timing of my dismissal and the pre-emptive decision not to pay my sick leave (which is not an illegal act only because I had not formally raised a  work cover claim even though I reserved the right to pursue one), followed by a direct breach of their obligations to pay my severance payment, has opened some doors which we should never have had to consider opening.

My solicitor warned me directly that, if it ends up in court, he will be asking them if they had ever had concerns over my mental state or worried about suicide or self-harm; he now holds the view that, at best, they can argue only reckless indifference to the possibility.

When they presumably answer "of course not, he's mentally incredibly strong", the entire question of their motivation behind this will be open for exploration. 

And, depending on the answers, for recompense in a separate cause of action.

 

I do apologise for, yet again, going into so much detail. I hope those reading this understand this is a 'therapy' of sorts for me, not an attempt to bore you all to death. In some (most!) ways, I would probably prefer no one to read these posts; in other ways, it is 'nice' to hear validation. But, hopefully, those who might gather some insight or hope from it might stumble across it.

Or those like myself who are suffering serious sleep deprivation.

 

* Another example of how my brain "issue" actually affects me now and where it has stabilised for at least 12 months. As I started the sentence, I knew that my ability to simultaneously be bordering on an emotional breakdown yet still be unemotional and calculating sounds ridiculous, and even sounded like I had multiple personalities. But, for the life of me, I could not summon the word for "multiple personality disorder" to mind. I had to Google it.

** Sorry. Another coping mechanism of mine. I adore history (not Hitler!) and the analogy of me sitting in my bunker going insane while the "enemy" pounds me relentlessly on all fronts - with me fighting for every inch of "territory" (integrity and self-respect) - amuses me. Hopefully, the analogy fails at "delusional" and long before "bullet in temple" or "escape to Argentina dressed in a frock" depending on your view of Hitler's fate.

*** No, really, ASIO. No need to knock my front door down. Deflecting all this bulltish with humour is ultimately the only way I know of not letting it drive me crazy. If I can still "dack" it, laugh it and point out that it has an embarrassingly small wiener then I still own it.

I still control it.

Which means I can tell it when to stop bothering me.

My sister, the qualified psychologist, says that's the biggest load of garbage she's ever heard. That I am just deflecting.

But it works for me because I don't use it to deflect from the issues bothering me. I think them through, work out the aspects over which I have some control or influence, and determine what I must do to deal with those aspects alone.

Then I work out how the residual aspects will affect me and accept that I can only ameliorate or deflect the consequences.

Sound remotely familiar?

 

 

 

 

[Mafiabob]

Just had to block a long standing person on Twitter, currently bloke sitting on sign on M1 in turmoil etc about child abuse, clearly unwell. I can understand frustration and irritation it has caused to people caught up in traffic.....

But this one guy moaning about it, I asked him what he would do..... And he said shoot him, asked him if he really meant it. He said yes..... Still some ignorance out there in this day and age ?

[Animal is a Ram]

Sorry if this upsets anyone, but I just felt I had to get it down somewhere and this felt the best place for it. I was also wondering if there was anyone else who had been through similar, who could share their experience of the big C.

It's been a tough month.

My girlfriend's dad was diagnosed with lung cancer about a month ago. Since then its been setbacks and balls ups all over.

Monday, he was due to have his lung removed, after a bronchoscopy, at Nottingham City Hospital. They then had to refill a lengthy consent form out because the original one was for a child, anaesthetist needed him to have an echocardiogram at short notice, thus turning a 8.00am procedure start into a 12.30pm start.

At about 6, we then had the news that they couldn't remove the lung, as the size and location made it more risky than they first thought. Quite why this didn't show on the bronchoscopy, or any of the numerous CT/PET is beyond my knowledge. He will now be referred back to the Derby oncologist for a chemo/radiotherapy to shrink the tumour, to then have a second attempt at removing the lung.

To make matters worse, having already incised from shoulder to hip on his back, they then got his pain relieving epidural wrong.

We are gutted, confused, angry, and losing heart. Fortunately, he isn't, bless him.

 

[rynny]

4 hours ago, Animal is a Ram said:

Sorry if this upsets anyone, but I just felt I had to get it down somewhere and this felt the best place for it. I was also wondering if there was anyone else who had been through similar, who could share their experience of the big C.

It's been a tough month.

My girlfriend's dad was diagnosed with lung cancer about a month ago. Since then its been setbacks and balls ups all over.

Monday, he was due to have his lung removed, after a bronchoscopy, at Nottingham City Hospital. They then had to refill a lengthy consent form out because the original one was for a child, anaesthetist needed him to have an echocardiogram at short notice, thus turning a 8.00am procedure start into a 12.30pm start.

At about 6, we then had the news that they couldn't remove the lung, as the size and location made it more risky than they first thought. Quite why this didn't show on the bronchoscopy, or any of the numerous CT/PET is beyond my knowledge. He will now be referred back to the Derby oncologist for a chemo/radiotherapy to shrink the tumour, to then have a second attempt at removing the lung.

To make matters worse, having already incised from shoulder to hip on his back, they then got his pain relieving epidural wrong.

We are gutted, confused, angry, and losing heart. Fortunately, he isn't, bless him.

 

Sorry to hear that mate. Hope everything goes as well as it can. You all need to keep strong, around him at least.

If you need a chat or owt, send a pm here or dm on twitter, even if it is to vent, it's not a problem.

[Rev]

7 hours ago, Animal is a Ram said:

Sorry if this upsets anyone, but I just felt I had to get it down somewhere and this felt the best place for it. I was also wondering if there was anyone else who had been through similar, who could share their experience of the big C.

 

We are gutted, confused, angry, and losing heart. Fortunately, he isn't, bless him.

 

Sorry to hear your of your girlfriend's dad's troubles, certainly sounds like rotten luck.

My mother in law is currently staying in the same hospital, and has been on and off for the past year.

She was diagnosed with Breast Cancer 11+ years ago, but after Chemo/Radiotherapy and surgery she recovered well, and apart from regular scans never saw the inside of the hospital again for 4 years.

Then a scan showed the cancer had spread to the lining of a lung, and the chemo started again.

The last 7 years have been a cycle of scans, chemo, shrinking cancer, scans, spreading cancer,more chemo etc.

She now has cancer in more places than not it seems, and right now it's a struggle to think she'll be with us much longer.

The fact is though, there's been a lot more good times than bad the last 10 years, some treatments have dreadful side effects and dont seem to work, while others seem to have no side effects at all, yet are effective.

We've had nice family holidays together, she's seen her two eldest grandchildren grow up, a new one born, and celebrated 11 more Christmas dinners and birthdays than we thought we would when she was first diagnosed. 

She's even done the race for life a couple of times, not bad for a woman in her sixties!

Everyone is different, but if your girlfriends dad's cancer is confined to just the lung, there's no reason for him not to make a complete recovery in time, and even if that's not possible things are rarely as bad as they seem.

It's natural to be angry, scared and pessimistic, but it's not worth expending energy on things you can't change at the expense of things you can.

A short wallow every now and again doesn't do any harm either, just the length of a Radiohead album or so I find puts me back on track.

If I could offer one bit of advice, find someone for you to talk to, apart from the people affected. 

I've bottled my own feelings up to be strong for my wife, after all it's her mother who has cancer, and to be honest I'm a mess for it.

Good luck, you come across as well sorted type, if you need anything just ask.

[Animal is a Ram]

Cheers @reveldevil, @rynny

11 hours ago, reveldevil said:

A short wallow every now and again doesn't do any harm either, just the length of a Radiohead album or so I find puts me back on track.

This is exactly what I've been doing, blasting out the Radiohead on my journeys to and from work!

[Animal is a Ram]

Went to visit last night, after fighting all the Nottingham traffic, doing loops of the hospital to find a car park, taking out a bank loan to park, then getting soaked walking from the car.

I hate hospitals. They always fill me with a sense of impending doom.

Still, pain aside, he's in good spirits, all the nursing staff have been lovely, and all being well should be back home Thursday, ready for the result of the oncology department's meeting on Tuesday.

[Rample]

20 hours ago, Animal is a Ram said:

Sorry if this upsets anyone, but I just felt I had to get it down somewhere and this felt the best place for it. I was also wondering if there was anyone else who had been through similar, who could share their experience of the big C.

It's been a tough month.

My girlfriend's dad was diagnosed with lung cancer about a month ago. Since then its been setbacks and balls ups all over.

Monday, he was due to have his lung removed, after a bronchoscopy, at Nottingham City Hospital. They then had to refill a lengthy consent form out because the original one was for a child, anaesthetist needed him to have an echocardiogram at short notice, thus turning a 8.00am procedure start into a 12.30pm start.

At about 6, we then had the news that they couldn't remove the lung, as the size and location made it more risky than they first thought. Quite why this didn't show on the bronchoscopy, or any of the numerous CT/PET is beyond my knowledge. He will now be referred back to the Derby oncologist for a chemo/radiotherapy to shrink the tumour, to then have a second attempt at removing the lung.

To make matters worse, having already incised from shoulder to hip on his back, they then got his pain relieving epidural wrong.

We are gutted, confused, angry, and losing heart. Fortunately, he isn't, bless him.

 

We lost my wife's dad to cancer last year, and it was a catalogue of errors and horror stories (thankfully for you not in Derby.)

From terminal diagnosis in May, to knowing that last fathers day would be his last, hospitalisation soon after and passing in early July.  It's been a hell of a week for us this week with so many memories flooding back.

The hospital were useless and infuriating. Upon admission we were given so little information about what was going on and what was going to happen, charts were completed incorrectly, he was given little attention even when machines were beeping and malfunctioning, promised that things would happen later that day (scans/tests etc) that were never practical or going to occur, and too low a dosage of medicine and pitiful out of hours monitoring meant that he died in agony and without dignity.

Fight and hassle, the hospital will do things under duress (some nurses are much better than others) but you must pressure them all the time - don't be afraid of asking lots of questions until you understand and ask repeatedly for things until they actually happen, as it's the only way he will get the necessary treatment.  In the last week we ended up there 24 hours a day and having to learn and do things ourselves and take over other things to smooth the ride.  McMillan were good but have limitations, little out of hours contact etc - however they are able to get things moving and apply pressure if needed.  They always start on the lowest dosage of pain relief but can up it dramatically, fight hard for it, and make sure you do it in hours as only certain doctors can sign off on it.

The great thing is belief is half the battle, as long as he stays positive it increases his chances no end.

Another positive, a chap across the road has just survived his 3rd cancer diagnosis and after chemo is making a good recovery, putting the weight back on, and getting out and about.  It isn't always a death sentence!

[Rev]

My mother in law passed away yesterday evening, when it's less raw I'll maybe post more on the subject of end of life care, and the frankly shocking way some doctors treated her towards the end.

One thing I will say, the care and support shown by the nursing staff at the hospital, not just to her, but the family has made a difficult time so much easier.

I've heard them called angels many times in the past, but having witnessed the care they provide first hand, it's an appropriate tag.

Truly a credit to the NHS, each and every one of them .

[Animal is a Ram]

8 hours ago, reveldevil said:

My mother in law passed away yesterday evening, when it's less raw I'll maybe post more on the subject of end of life care, and the frankly shocking way some doctors treated her towards the end.

One thing I will say, the care and support shown by the nursing staff at the hospital, not just to her, but the family has made a difficult time so much easier.

I've heard them called angels many times in the past, but having witnessed the care they provide first hand, it's an appropriate tag.

Truly a credit to the NHS, each and every one of them .

My condolences, reveldevil.

To echo your post - all the way through my 'father in law''s care so far, the doctors have been p*ss poor - but the support from nurses, porters, etc. has been first class

[Gypsy Ram]

Jesus it's ******* awful. 

[JaguarRam]

I suffer from OCD and BDD. I am currently having cognitive behavioural therapy and making great improvements. As soon as you admit to yourself that it is an illness and allow yourself to be treated and follow the advice given then it can make a huge difference. 

[Gypsy Ram]

I don't know how bad its going to get before it is better. I just don't believe the NHS. 

[Cisse]

I just spend an evening with my mate. He is the same age as me. There is a group of five left of us that have been together at least a quarter of a century. All of us are kind of weird. Today I learned my friend suffers from OCD. No wonder he has been acting so strange. We always just thought he is weird and shrugged it off.

He told me this after I told him that I have been suffering from some kind of anxiety disorder for the last fifteen years. No wonder I had been acting so strange so long. But he had just shrugged it off the same way I had.

Funny as hell when you really think about it.

[Gypsy Ram]

13 minutes ago, Cisse said:

I just spend an evening with my mate. He is the same age as me. There is a group of five left of us that have been together at least a quarter of a century. All of us are kind of weird. Today I learned my friend suffers from OCD. No wonder he has been acting so strange. We always just thought he is weird and shrugged it off.

He told me this after I told him that I have been suffering from some kind of anxiety disorder for the last fifteen years. No wonder I had been acting so strange so long. But he had just shrugged it off the same way I had.

Funny as hell when you really think about it.

Sounds like  a great party. Can i come? 

[Cisse]

53 minutes ago, Gypsy Ram said:

Sounds like  a great party. Can i come? 

Well our group lacks an individual with a hump on his back...

[Gypsy Ram]

8 minutes ago, Cisse said:

Well our group lacks an individual with a hump on his back...

Two humps you racist, I'm not Asian. 

[Cisse]

5 minutes ago, Gypsy Ram said:

Two humps you racist, I'm not Asian. 

We want a dromedary. Just one hump. We have got enough troubles with those with two humps.