Derby County Versus Crewe Alexandra - Match Day Thread - ( FA Cup 1st Rd Replay )

[Tamworthram]

39 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

We’ve just won our last 3 home games conceding 0 goals and scoring 9 including battering a promotion rival. Win our game in hand we’re in the top 6 and we’re closer to top 2 than we were a few weeks ago. We lost 3 of the first 6 and then lost 2 of our last 10. League is wide open this season.

The writing was on the wall after three away performances but the cup game should be discounted IMO. Poor performances in cups happen and have happened even when we’ve had a good team.

Lose or don’t win the next 2 (Bristol and Vale) then writing is on the wall again. That’s when we can fundamentally say this team is inconsistent 

I agree to an extent in the sense that cup games should (potentially) be excluded (I don’t imagine Portsmouth fans are losing too much sleep over losing to Chesterfield) but, wouldn’t you say we have already been fundamentally inconsistent in the league even before the Bristol and Vale games? I would turn it around and suggest we have been inconsistent and it will take a longer run of good results (or at least good performances) to prove otherwise.

[StaffsRam]

44 minutes ago, admira said:

That was definitely the all-time low. As bad as things are at the moment at least we're not playing Kenny Burns in the starting XI.

[silverback]

10 hours ago, CBRammette said:

Doesnt sound like it but can anyone explain why would one ever bring Bradley on at 1-3 down in a cup competition? 

bit like bringing David Cameron back into the cabinet ......oh wait A minute

[jimtastic56]

59 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

We’ve just won our last 3 home games conceding 0 goals and scoring 9 including battering a promotion rival. Win our game in hand we’re in the top 6 and we’re closer to top 2 than we were a few weeks ago. We lost 3 of the first 6 and then lost 2 of our last 10. League is wide open this season.

The writing was on the wall after three away performances but the cup game should be discounted IMO. Poor performances in cups happen and have happened even when we’ve had a good team.

Lose or don’t win the next 2 (Bristol and Vale) then writing is on the wall again. That’s when we can fundamentally say this team is inconsistent 

We have been scoring goals from Wildsmith lumping it into the box and winning second balls . I don’t know why we tried to out - pass them last night .

[silverback]

IMHO opinion Warne and the team failed to show the respect Crewe earned by taking us to the wire at their place.

 

Consequently you get your ar££ handed to you on a plate.

 

The mighty Derby once again expecting teams to bow down and pay homage, when will they all realise that every team like Crewe see us as the team to beat and we have to be up for it on every occasion.

 

[DavesaRam]

10 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

eh?

Do you mean he shouldn't be telling them to cross the balls in too high? Do you think he told them to cross the ball too high?

No. He should be saying “If you can see that crossing the ball in too high isn’t working, try playing football”. But he doesn’t.

Or “Perhaps I should concentrate the training on crossing the ball better”. But he doesn’t. 
 

Or recognise that he doesn’t have the players to play this way, and change it. But he doesn’t.

Or recognise you can start removing the skin from the cat from the front, from the rear, from either side, or even do it diagonally, but that there isn’t just one way to do the job.
 

 

[DavesaRam]

10 hours ago, JPRamFan said:

I'm not defending Warne and I am not a fan of him, but was tonight maybe one game too many from this set of fixtures since the October international break? This is our fourth midweek game in a row. 8 games in 24 days.

It’s their job. All they have to do to have a fortune thrown into their bank account every week is play games. What would your boss do if you continually underperformed like this? Keep picking you for the job, like Warne does? Or keep you employed, like Clowes is doing?

[DavesaRam]

9 hours ago, DerbyAleMan said:

At least I can say I care, I was there, and after the Barnsley game, I felt confident going to the game tonight, oh how wrong was I, but on the 25th I will be back getting behind the team, and driving them onto victory, and hope the good Derby turn up, like we did against Northampton and Barnsley. It's in our DNA youth. 

Well play the youth, then!

[Ghost of Clough]

Our style of play relies on set pieces or the opposition giving us space to play in. Once we get a goal, the opposition leave more gaps at the back which allows us to hit them on the break and give us 1 on 1 situations

We struggle against the sides who make the middle of the pitch compact and get back into defence quickly. If we concede first, it just makes the task harder as the opposition sit deeper and deeper.

Why do we struggle against those compact defences?  Simply put, the players resort to crosses - from an inability to create through the middle and down to manager instructions. The manager takes most of the blame for that as he chooses the team. He consistently chooses the least creative midfield possible (one of which relies heavily on crossing the ball as a form of creating chances), and the way the full backs and wide attackers are set up means we have 4 players in wide positions who would rather cross the ball than play passes into the middle of the pitch.

Looking at our central players (starts only), Fornah, Hourihane and Smith combined are creating fewer non-cross open play chances per 90 than Bird. Thompson marginally leads the list, with Sibley in 3rd. Since Thompson is injured (and unlikely to play much under Warne), and Sibley preferred on the wing (if at all), we rely heavily on Bird to create against those more compact sides. Crowd Bird out of the game and the crosses are inevitable.

[angieram]

Just now, Ghost of Clough said:

Our style of play relies on set pieces or the opposition giving us space to play in. Once we get a goal, the opposition leave more gaps at the back which allows us to hit them on the break and give us 1 on 1 situations

We struggle against the sides who make the middle of the pitch compact and get back into defence quickly. If we concede first, it just makes the task harder as the opposition sit deeper and deeper.

Why do we struggle against those compact defences?  Simply put, the players resort to crosses - from an inability to create through the middle and down to manager instructions. The manager takes most of the blame for that as he chooses the team. He consistently chooses the least creative midfield possible (one of which relies heavily on crossing the ball as a form of creating chances), and the way the full backs and wide attackers are set up means we have 4 players in wide positions who would rather cross the ball than play passes into the middle of the pitch.

Looking at our central players (starts only), Fornah, Hourihane and Smith combined are creating fewer non-cross open play chances per 90 than Bird. Thompson marginally leads the list, with Sibley in 3rd. Since Thompson is injured (and unlikely to play much under Warne), and Sibley preferred on the wing (if at all), we rely heavily on Bird to create against those more compact sides. Crowd Bird out of the game and the crosses are inevitable.

Spot on. Bird was heavily marked from the first whistle. Smith and Hourihane had the space but both failed to capitalise on it, one because he couldn't be arsed and one because he doesn't know how. 

Interesting how low everyone is marking Sibley because he assisted the first goal and continued to try to play the ball into the box along the ground. Admittedly he was under pressure doing this and the balls weren'tquite getting through, but the high crosses were so ineffective, that we needed Bird and Sibley to continue to try and unlock the defence by other means. Collins had no service to feet all game and he's never going to win headers in a crowded box.

I'd at least have brought Weston on for Sibley, rather than another crosser of the ball in Ward. 

Disappointing that Warne didn't think of this before the game. 

But I'd rather we lost last night than on Saturday.

[admira]

41 minutes ago, StaffsRam said:

That was definitely the all-time low. As bad as things are at the moment at least we're not playing Kenny Burns in the starting XI.

He’d have bossed our midfield last night 

[Tamworthram]

18 minutes ago, DavesaRam said:

No. He should be saying “If you can see that crossing the ball in too high isn’t working, try playing football”. But he doesn’t.

Or “Perhaps I should concentrate the training on crossing the ball better”. But he doesn’t. 
 

Or recognise that he doesn’t have the players to play this way, and change it. But he doesn’t.

Or recognise you can start removing the skin from the cat from the front, from the rear, from either side, or even do it diagonally, but that there isn’t just one way to do the job.
 

 

How do you know they don’t practice crossing the ball (at an appropriate height) in training?

Perhaps he’s thinking they’re crossing the ball too high, why don’t they do what we’ve practiced in training?

I agree though that if it’s not working he should change the tactics (if he’s capable of doing so) and they should be practicing the different ways to skin a cat (an unfortunate phrase given we have two indoor cats - one called Hector 😀) to at least make us less predictable.

[FlyBritishMidland]

1 hour ago, admira said:

Is this in the wrong thread?  I’m going for FA Cup 1st round v Hartlepool.  Lost 2-1.  1984 if I remember correctly.

[DavesaRam]

11 hours ago, HonitonRam said:

We`re doing Turkey and all the usual trimmings

 

Please don’t kill that turkey - we could use it to get on the end of all those crosses into the box!

[Jubbs]

25 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

We struggle against the sides who make the middle of the pitch compact and get back into defence quickly. If we concede first, it just makes the task harder as the opposition sit deeper and deeper.

Yep. Out of the 7 games we've gone behind in the league, we've won 4 points.

1 win - Peterborough
1 draw - Cheltenham.
5 losses - Wigan, Oxford, Bolton, Shrewsbury and Stevenage.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Jubbs

[jimtastic56]

16 minutes ago, angieram said:

Spot on. Bird was heavily marked from the first whistle. Smith and Hourihane had the space but both failed to capitalise on it, one because he couldn't be arsed and one because he doesn't know how. 

Interesting how low everyone is marking Sibley because he assisted the first goal and continued to try to play the ball into the box along the ground. Admittedly he was under pressure doing this and the balls weren'tquite getting through, but the high crosses were so ineffective, that we needed Bird and Sibley to continue to try and unlock the defence by other means. Collins had no service to feet all game and he's never going to win headers in a crowded box.

I'd at least have brought Weston on for Sibley, rather than another crosser of the ball in Ward. 

Disappointing that Warne didn't think of this before the game. 

But I'd rather we lost last night than on Saturday.

Sorry to disagree with you , but I was at the game last night and didn’t think anyone went anywhere near Bird . The lad that ran midfield was Joe White , and guess what - he is on loan from Newcastle Utd .

[MadAmster]

17 hours ago, Foreveram said:

At the start of the season I wrote down the figures for each block, it’s then easy to take away numbers left.

8,446 seats available.

👍

[MadAmster]

There will, doubtless, be the usual OTT comments all over "social media". It's the Cup. Shocks, both great and small, happen.

1968. 2nd division Derby drew 0-0 away against 1st division Chelsea in the League Cup. Beat them 3-1 in the return.
Drew 0-0 away at Everton and beat them 1-0 in the return.
Then drew 0-0 at home to 3rd division Swindon and then lost the return 1-0.
Swindon went on to beat Arsenal 3-1 at Wembley in the final.

[TheRamOfSwad]

One thing I notice is that if we don't score within the first 15/20 minutes we lose steam and tend not to play very well, if our confidence and self esteem as players is that bad I suggest a psychology coach in the club 

Also it's the total inconsistency game to game... the hope pre match that we are going to win convincingly and from the terrible last 15 years of trying to reach the premier league again we have been disappointed many times and its the longest as a club we've had to wait and it's impaitence is mounting on people imo.

Paul Warne isn't the most tactically renound manager ever but as a former player it's always the players who win the match, you dont have have to follow the managers orders to the letter, you do have free will and are allowed to make decisions and think on your feet which I'm sure Paul Warne would encourage 

I'm in the camp of the players we have aren't as good as we think, a lot have had good careers and in our heads we  probably picture the "best version of them" as Paul likes to say

They definitely need to dig in more, we can't break down teams when they sit back and we play well against bigger teams as they tend to go for it more and are left exposed and because our defence is usually pretty solid we beat those bigger teams 

Need to sign a few creative players in the window plus a pacy striker, a MUST

You Rams 🐏 

Edited November 15, 2023 by TheRamOfSwad

[Barney1991]

11 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

I assume you're not referring to me. I've made several posts on this thread questioning the tactics and players tonight (as I say though, my comments were only based on the score line and other comments on this forum). 

There is nothing wrong with praising the tactics and players after a game like Saturday (but some couldn't bring themselves to do this) but then questioning/criticising the same after a game like tonight (although, maybe some others can't bring themselves to do that). 

Saturday was okay we scored 2 goals off long free kicks but you’ve got to score them somehow. The other a soft penalty. Still didn’t like our overall play but when you win who cares. When you don’t win then this is what is looked at. What really annoys me more than anything with warne is his inability to change a game when it’s not going his way. Also what is the point of a cat 1 academy if the manager doesn’t at least throw them in a cup game when we have 12 senior players who played 3 days earlier. At least Rooney and Rosenior would have chucked them in. 
 

if I was an academy prospect I’d look at other teams than derby with the current set up as with this manager I don’t see a pathway to the first team