Don’t be too dismayed Rosenier ball is still painful

[minesahartington]

If you take away the main man you are bound to struggle.. look at Spurs without Kane..

[G STAR RAM]

9 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

If you want. Your point is what about McGoldrick, he wouldn't have played in a 4231? 

I didn't have a point about McGoldrick, others were factoring his absence into the results under Rosenior so I asked if we should factor the current injuries into Warnes results.

[RoyMac5]

6 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

I didn't have a point about McGoldrick, others were factoring his absence into the results under Rosenior so I asked if we should factor the current injuries into Warnes results.

Are any of them our main goal scorer?

[Bris Vegas]

7 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Now show me any league table that has ever been included a 'chances for' column. 

[Blondest Goat]

29 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Ridiculous and shows there is no objectivity.

There's no lack of objectivity.  You can't blame poor form on injuries when those that are injured are players you barely use anyway.  Whose not been available that would be a certain starter for Warne?  Only really Max Bird and whilst he's a good player we really should be able to cope without him.  Possibly Ward if we're playing wing-backs but we ditched that anyway as it wasn't working.

We've just had a transfer window where Warnes had the chance to look at the squad and address it's shortcomings.  Every team has injuries.  You can blame injuries for your team not being able to string 3 passes together.  It's a poor excuse.

[May Contain Nuts]

The attempt to weedle into the thread the idea of Warne being the one who's suffering from double standards is rather lacking in guile.

Warne is an experienced League One manager who'd been brought in because of a history of getting promotions and knowledge of the league. The level of expectation on him to get results, to make best use of his available players, to cope with injuries and anything else is  naturally higher than for someone in their first head coach / manager job. And so it should be.

They're different standards, sure, but they're not double standards because they're being fairly applied based on the manager's experience and reputation.

You can factor in injuries, but the importance of those players to the team's success also has to be considered. Some of the players currently inured were here last season, so you can look at the way they were used / performed under him last season to determine how much of a miss they are.

You can also factor in how the availability (or lack of) has affected team shape. If we had a full squad available we'd have been more likely to persist with the 3-5-2 with wing backs. Whether that's for better or worse we can't say with absolute certainty, but we do have some evidence to say that it left our defence too exposed and we've tended to look better (both last season and this) playing with a back 4 instead. Thanks injuries! 😄

....but those are just a couple of things amongst a whole whole host of other things, each affecting the scenario differently and providing opportunity to twist the conversation this way or that.

We haven't got all day to list and evaluate them all (well I certainly haven't, can't speak for anyone else) but bloody hell do we really need to keep covering old ground and making useless comparisons?

Edited September 22, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[duncanjwitham]

1 minute ago, Kokosnuss said:

We haven't got all day to list and evaluate them all (well I certainly haven't, can't speak for anyone else) but bloody hell do we really need to keep covering old ground and making useless comparisons?

 

[Anag Ram]

30 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

The attempt to weedle into the thread the idea of Warne being the one who's suffering from double standards is rather lacking in guile.

Warne is an experienced League One manager who'd been brought in because of a history of getting promotions and knowledge of the league. The level of expectation on him to get results, to make best use of his available players, to cope with injuries and anything else is  naturally higher than for someone in their first head coach / manager job. And so it should be.

They're different standards, sure, but they're not double standards because they're being fairly applied based on the manager's experience and reputation.

You can factor in injuries, but the importance of those players to the team's success also has to be considered. Some of the players currently inured were here last season, so you can look at the way they were used / performed under him last season to determine how much of a miss they are.

You can also factor in how the availability (or lack of) has affected team shape. If we had a full squad available we'd have been more likely to persist with the 3-5-2 with wing backs. Whether that's for better or worse we can't say with absolute certainty, but we do have some evidence to say that it left our defence too exposed and we've tended to look better (both last season and this) playing with a back 4 instead. Thanks injuries! 😄

....but those are just a couple of things amongst a whole whole host of other things, each affecting the scenario differently and providing opportunity to twist the conversation this way or that.

We haven't got all day to list and evaluate them all (well I certainly haven't, can't speak for anyone else) but bloody hell do we really need to keep covering old ground and making useless comparisons?

Yes, 3-5-2 can be a very effective lineup if you have the right players and they know how to play it.

The three central defenders need to know each other’s game inside out so they mark/ intercept/ cover as required. In short, they need to be a tight unit.

At the start of the season the three looked a disorganised rabble and this wasn’t helped by Bradley’s poor form.

The wing backs need to provide a real outlet but ideally they also need a presence in the box to aim for. We had Collins on his own.

When everyone is fit, we will have a strong squad but finding the right starting eleven will remain tricky.

Sometimes the best players don’t make the best team. We have to play to our strengths.

Amazing that playing the ball on the deck and trying first time passes produced some great goals on Tuesday.

 

 

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

Not sure if this is the right thread or not but anyway...........I noticed on Tuesday just gone we made 672 passes whereas we have in the othe games been around the 250 -300 mark. Is this as it seems a deliberate change of tactic or just players now implimenting more fully how Paul Warne wants to play? (He said himself that  we saw how he wants his teams to play).  I'm a tad confused.

[Tyler Durden]

7 hours ago, trappatoni said:

That's nonsense.  Obviously if you take the best player out of a squad you are less likely to do well.  Evidence doesn't have to be 100% proof.  

Would Britain have repelled German invasion if the RAF had comprised half a dozen bi-planes ? Would Tyson Fury be world champion if he was born with one arm ?   

You get the point.

Tottenham seem to be doing pretty well without Harry Kane.

But let's not use that example as it doesn't fit your narrative 

[Foreveram]

9 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

They played x10 better in those 25% minutes than we ever have under Warne. I'd be happy to play like them.

And lose ?

[Foreveram]

8 hours ago, S8TY said:

It does happen no one wins every game 

But have more chance of winning the game than losing if you actually have the ball 

Not if you don’t do anything with it.

[G STAR RAM]

3 hours ago, Blondest Goat said:

There's no lack of objectivity.  You can't blame poor form on injuries when those that are injured are players you barely use anyway.  Whose not been available that would be a certain starter for Warne?  Only really Max Bird and whilst he's a good player we really should be able to cope without him.  Possibly Ward if we're playing wing-backs but we ditched that anyway as it wasn't working.

We've just had a transfer window where Warnes had the chance to look at the squad and address it's shortcomings.  Every team has injuries.  You can blame injuries for your team not being able to string 3 passes together.  It's a poor excuse.

Nothing to do with the 2 right wing backs he signed getting injured then?

[RoyMac5]

59 minutes ago, Foreveram said:

And lose ?

In Europe.

[Blondest Goat]

55 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Nothing to do with the 2 right wing backs he signed getting injured then?

Think it was more to do with it not working.

Edited September 22, 2023 by Blondest Goat
.

[jono]

On 17/09/2023 at 20:51, LeedsCityRam said:

Yeah, must be awful - I assume their goals for column being comparable with others in top 6 is a misprint?

Not scoring enough goals and too many going in. I remain unconvinced. Warne Ball has flaws but for me he has time. My only criticism is the two faced nature of out team. One week glimmers of light and flair, the next a bunch of rudderless tired hacks. It’s weird at the moment 

[sage]

5 hours ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said:

Not sure if this is the right thread or not but anyway...........I noticed on Tuesday just gone we made 672 passes whereas we have in the othe games been around the 250 -300 mark. Is this as it seems a deliberate change of tactic or just players now implimenting more fully how Paul Warne wants to play? (He said himself that  we saw how he wants his teams to play).  I'm a tad confused.

More footballers on the pitch and playing mainly a reserve team with the intensity of bath sponge. 

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

3 minutes ago, sage said:

More footballers on the pitch and playing mainly a reserve team with the intensity of bath sponge. 

Which would mean Warne does want to play football but the players aren't good enough. 

[RoyMac5]

28 minutes ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said:

Which would mean Warne does want to play football but the players aren't good enough. 

What's he been doing all summer then? 😄

Of course the players are good enough, Warne chooses to play it wide and then sling in crosses if he says otherwise his memory is delusional.

Edited September 22, 2023 by RoyMac5

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

35 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

What's he been doing all summer then? 😄

Of course the players are good enough, Warne chooses to play it wide and then sling in crosses if he says otherwise his memory is delusional.

My comment was logic based on the post I was responding to, not what I think is happening.