Derby v Portsmouth Match Thread

[Gerry Daly]

1 hour ago, DavesaRam said:

Welcome to the banquet, Sibbers. We’ve  got a fantastic feast lined up, and there’s an opportunity for you to eat under the table. Here’s a dustpan and brush to make it easier to pick the crumbs up. Actually - bring your own dustpan and brush.

Well, where would he play in your team? Or rather one that Warne is likely to pick given that he disagrees with you that Sibley should be first name on the team sheet lol. Assuming then it isn't to be in either a back 4 or back 5, does he get into midfield ahead of Fornah, Smith or Hourihane? Moving on though as injuries clear does he get into midfield ahead of those 3 plus Embleton, Thompson and Bird? No chance I'd say. Up front? Ahead of Waggy, Washington, NML, TJJ, Collins and Barkhuizen? I don't think so. The only position where we need somebody is left wing back where he played a good chunk of last season    

[RadioactiveWaste]

Sibley has "absence ability improvement delusion syndrome" from fans.

The more he is absent from the team, the better his perceived abilities are.

He might yet make it, but delivering on promises has been where so many a gifted young player has evaporated.

 

[RoyMac5]

54 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

Not a single 90’ !! Not even one  

After the success against Oxford he just didn’t deliver. That’s the truth and it is a sad one 

Warne expects players to ‘gas out’ there are rarely 90 minute games for the more forward players. Dobbin was more popular but what did he do better?

 

[DavesaRam]

2 hours ago, kevinhectoring said:

His last crack of the whip was end of last season where Warne persevered with him despite disappointing performances and he failed to deliver. I was at the time advocating that Sibley should continue to start. In retrospect it would have been better if he hadn’t 

And in what position was the whip cracked?

[DavesaRam]

36 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Warne expects players to ‘gas out’ there are rarely 90 minute games for the more forward players. Dobbin was more popular but what did he do better?

 

Dobbin laid on two goals against Port Vale, hit the bar, scored a scorching goal, but spent the rest of his considerable opportunities looking like he was going to produce something but never doing it.

[DavesaRam]

1 hour ago, Gerry Daly said:

Well, where would he play in your team? Or rather one that Warne is likely to pick given that he disagrees with you that Sibley should be first name on the team sheet lol. Assuming then it isn't to be in either a back 4 or back 5, does he get into midfield ahead of Fornah, Smith or Hourihane? Moving on though as injuries clear does he get into midfield ahead of those 3 plus Embleton, Thompson and Bird? No chance I'd say. Up front? Ahead of Waggy, Washington, NML, TJJ, Collins and Barkhuizen? I don't think so. The only position where we need somebody is left wing back where he played a good chunk of last season    

That was my dilemma in my first comment on this thread. Warne expressed frustration for Sibley in that just as he had the chance to cement his place in the team ge got injured. 
 

But now he is on his way back from injury, Warne has signed Embleton, Fornah and TJJ who will definitely  be picked ahead of him. Lets hope they are better than him. It looks like they will be, and if so we pin our hopes on them.

Sorry, Sibbers! Look to Weimman for your inspiration. He too never “produced the goods” while being played in the wrong position or being dropped. But he went to Bristol who for some  curious reason played him where he was at his best, and he started scoring for fun. I have no idea if it lasted, but you get my point. 
 

Sibley isn’t the first we have done this to, not by a long, long way, and he won’t be the last.

So, Embleton, Fornah and TJJ: good luck. Here’s to a fair crack of the whip. But don’t hold your breath waiting.

Edited September 11, 2023 by DavesaRam

[Gerry Daly]

Or he could take a leaf out of Thompsons book, really apply himself in training and in games, get that 10% of extra fitness and force his way into the team

[RoyMac5]

3 hours ago, Gerry Daly said:

Or he could take a leaf out of Thompsons book, really apply himself in training and in games, get that 10% of extra fitness and force his way into the team

He forced his way in when Bird was injured - who else would have played?

[Gerry Daly]

16 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

He forced his way in when Bird was injured - who else would have played?

But he played brilliantly when he got his chance. Consecutive man of the match performances. Also by all accounts he has been really putting in the effort in training and impressing the manager. In pre season he played at left wing back -rather than Sibley - and gave it 100%. You and others who think Sibley is better than he is are missing the point. Football is a total meritocracy. If Sibley was good enough he would be picked. Its about results and performances, only that. Sentiment has no place  

[RoyMac5]

3 minutes ago, Gerry Daly said:

But he played brilliantly when he got his chance. Consecutive man of the match performances. Also by all accounts he has been really putting in the effort in training and impressing the manager. In pre season he played at left wing back -rather than Sibley - and gave it 100%. You and others who think Sibley is better than he is are missing the point. Football is a total meritocracy. If Sibley was good enough he would be picked. Its about results and performances, only that. Sentiment has no place  

Maybe he would have been picked if he wasn’t injured. Where was Tommo last season, demanding to go out on loan.

[Jimbo Ram]

I think Sibbo has done well in the 5 or so minutes he is often given. Got the injury time winner in one game and also hit the post in a 5 minute cameo in another. When he was finally played he looked very good at left wing back. Why not play him there again if Warney refuses to give up on his 3 at the back? 

[sunnyhill60]

Sibley, in 4 seasons and 100 appearances has had plenty of chances, has yet to convince managers he deserves a starting place on a regular basis and is just a good squad player. The simple explanation, unlikely to be accepted by many Rams fans, is that he ain't that good. His contributions range from fabulous to anonymous, consistent he is not, and he will not be a game-changer for our season.

[Gerry Daly]

9 hours ago, Jimbo Ram said:

I think Sibbo has done well in the 5 or so minutes he is often given. Got the injury time winner in one game and also hit the post in a 5 minute cameo in another. When he was finally played he looked very good at left wing back. Why not play him there again if Warney refuses to give up on his 3 at the back? 

I agree and as I said earlier, that’s what I think will happen

[duncanjwitham]

9 hours ago, Jimbo Ram said:

I think Sibbo has done well in the 5 or so minutes he is often given. Got the injury time winner in one game and also hit the post in a 5 minute cameo in another. When he was finally played he looked very good at left wing back. Why not play him there again if Warney refuses to give up on his 3 at the back? 

He didn't look good at wingback, he barely played there and struggled when he did.  The decent spell he had in the team was almost entirely playing at left back in a 4, with a winger in front supporting him.  And even towards the end of that spell, teams were starting to target his lack of experience defensively.

[RoyMac5]

6 hours ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Sibley, in 4 seasons and 100 appearances has had plenty of chances, has yet to convince managers he deserves a starting place on a regular basis and is just a good squad player. The simple explanation, unlikely to be accepted by many Rams fans, is that he ain't that good. His contributions range from fabulous to anonymous, consistent he is not, and he will not be a game-changer for our season.

Might a simpler explanation be that four, is it, different managers have played a young inexperienced player in multiple positions? What does Cashin look like in LCB role, or Bird as an AM?

[May Contain Nuts]

I'm not in the "Sibley must start" camp and certainly don't think he's out best player, just that he offers rather certain useful attributes that when used correctly by a good manager allow him to make a positive impact. He doesn't have to play 60-90 minutes every week he just needs to be used correctly - subbed on at the right time, in the right position, put up against a certain defender possibly . Clever tactical management to get the best out of him.

The "multiple managers haven't trusted / rated him" doesn't really prove anything unless you're talking about good managers with proven game management skills who know what they're doing tactically and know how to develop young players - Rooney & Warne, that ain't. The "red card waiting to happen" thing bizarre for a player who's never rightfully been sent off at senior level. The "he'll give away silly free kicks" a valid point and rather annoying, but you'd think he's the only footballer in the world ever to have a habit of doing that - any time he does it people moan and groan, any time someone like Smith does it you won't hear a peep.

And the "he's had plenty of chances" type attitude which often only seems to look at appearance numbers, not actual minutes on the pitch never mind where those minutes were, and in what circumstances just annoys me. You wouldn't constantly play a CF as a CM, DM, LM for about 70% of their time on the pitch with only 30% at CF and say they've had plenty of chances to prove they can score goals.

Edited September 12, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Jimbo Ram]

7 hours ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Sibley, in 4 seasons and 100 appearances has had plenty of chances, has yet to convince managers he deserves a starting place on a regular basis and is just a good squad player. The simple explanation, unlikely to be accepted by many Rams fans, is that he ain't that good. His contributions range from fabulous to anonymous, consistent he is not, and he will not be a game-changer for our season.

Sometimes it’s a case of if your face fits. There are plenty of players who haven’t been great but still get regular game time.

[Gerry Daly]

2 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Sometimes it’s a case of if your face fits. There are plenty of players who haven’t been great but still get regular game time.

Sibley made 42 league appearances and 52 appearances in total last season so nobody can tell me his face doesn't fit under Warne

[Jimbo Ram]

12 minutes ago, Gerry Daly said:

Sibley made 42 league appearances and 52 appearances in total last season so nobody can tell me his face doesn't fit under Warne

How many of those were starts 🤔

[Caerphilly Ram]

16 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

How many of those were starts 🤔

33, total mins played last season according to transfermarkt was 3021 so an average across his 52 apps last season of 58 mins per game (I know it’s not as simple as that).

I think Warne has used Sibley more than previous managers, and actually deserves some credit (or his staff do) for getting him playing effectively when placed in an unfamiliar position through circumstance, as well as curbing what could be described as ill discipline. Sibley seemed to work out the defensive side of his game last season and picked up less rash bookings, that’s based purely on memory I accept I might be mistaken. He was then using him as a 10 in the final games of the season and for good minutes in 4 out of the final 5, with Davies’ red card meaning he was unfortunately sacrificed for the team.

The challenge for Warne is to use Sibley effectively this season, he’s yet to have chance to do so with injury and I know there are many who question whether he can or will do so anyway. The challenge for Sibley is to take those chances when presented and deliver consistently so Warne has no choice but to play him. Nothing’s written in the future of this scenario yet, there’s still chance for Sibley to do well for us.