Gotta love Extinction Rebellion

[Stive Pesley]

3 hours ago, Boycie said:

I’m sure I’ll try to be cancelled and bombarded with info to support the other views but this is the way I see it..

You just asked some very valid questions, but this sentence suggests that you believe you already know the answers and don't want to listen to facts that might change your mind? 

 

[Boycie]

30 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

You just asked some very valid questions, but this sentence suggests that you believe you already know the answers and don't want to listen to facts that might change your mind? 

 

Facts have to be proven. We aren’t at the end to prove any of them yet.

Some people want opinions removed rather than challenge them, that’s my view on some debates, it’s all a bit woke.

Edited August 13, 2022 by Boycie

[Highgate]

6 hours ago, Archied said:

The question is more what evidence I require to reach the level of hysteria and stupidity of the people this topic is about ,

of course I believe we contribute to a degree ( to what level debatable) because every action has a reaction , where you and these loons lose me is exactly that every action has a reaction, swathes of trees cut down in Scotland for wind farms where the tariff for energy is set by the cost of fossil fuel even though wind farms are producing cheaper energy ( profit or green motivation?) 

headlong rush to electric cars which I’m sure will have massive problems a few years down the line including take make throw away issues let alone the fact we are nowhere near having the reliable power power producing sources to power them all along with the power we already need to produce now , the infrastructure? The prohibitive cost to ordinary people who will be taxed back onto buses and trains that are quite frankly useless and vastly expensive ,

I could go on and on but what’s the point , you see one thing ,motive for the greater,, I see another MORE greed and profit and more push down for the ordinary masses ,

prentending to be carbon neutral by buying from other countries is a farce on the scale of Maggie selling companies to us that we already owned and silly people happy to buy shares for a relatively tiny quick profit,

so as stated over and over again , if and when there are properly costed plans in terms of cost , impact on lives and the environment motivated for the greater good then I’m happy to be on board but at this point I am passionately against thes ext rebellion loon types without a thought in they’re heads beyond they’re current pet drum to bang

Well ok, you answered a different question, fair enough. 

Let's see where we can agree.  You are worried that a rapid change in how we source our energy will result in profiteering by the already wealthy at the expense of the vulnerable.  That's a realistic and commendable concern in my opinion.  But isn't it always a concern no matter what economic policies we follow? Currently we are enriching the fossil fuel industry.  Either way it doesn't affect whether anthropogenic climate change is real and a threat or not.

You would favour a much more gradual change in response to the threat.  Ordinarily I'd say that was a perfectly sensible approach.  The problem is we've known about this for problem for decades now.  The original Carl Sagan informed half the world in Cosmos in 1980, but no governments listened.  We have lost decades where we have done nothing,...therefore urgency is required now, and that's our fault. 

XR are beside the point as far as I'm concerned and I can see how they can irritate people trying to get on with their lives.  Maybe if they only focused their protests on the politicians who have the actual power to change things.  I'm not sure.

Not referring to anything you said but I think the fatalistic approach of 'let's all relax and do nothing, Putin might drop a nuke on us next week anyway' isn't very helpful.  If the 99% of climate scientists (latest comprehensive estimates of the scientific consensus), are correct then our children and grandchildren won't thank us for that attitude in years to come. 

[GboroRam]

What if we remove our reliance on finite fossil fuels and clean our air and generally make the environment better for everyone, all for nothing? 

[Boycie]

5 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

What if we remove our reliance on finite fossil fuels and clean our air and generally make the environment better for everyone, all for nothing? 

We could, but China won’t, Russia won’t and America won’t.

Thats quite a lot of land mass polluting our atmosphere.

Im sure we have the capability to burn coal cleanly.  I’d have a look but to be honest it wouldn’t matter.

[GboroRam]

1 hour ago, Boycie said:

We could, but China won’t, Russia won’t and America won’t.

Thats quite a lot of land mass polluting our atmosphere.

Im sure we have the capability to burn coal cleanly.  I’d have a look but to be honest it wouldn’t matter.

Oh, I agree that China, Russia and the USA should stop the polluting too. 

We've known how to create hydrogen power plants for decades now. I'm sure I remember watching a tomorrows world in the 80s with it being brought up. 

Why did we not start this 40 years ago? The UK could have led the world. But we would rather sell our utilities into private hands, taking away any semblance of planning. Let the market decide. And the market decided to keep on using oil and gas (and probably would have been coal as well but there's too much politics involved to discuss the decline of the coal industry). 

FWIW I think it's too late. We've totally screwed the planet up beyond redemption, and we're too addicted to cheap Chinese electronics and Russian oil and gas to ever begin to reverse it. 

[Boycie]

4 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

Oh, I agree that China, Russia and the USA should stop the polluting too. 

We've known how to create hydrogen power plants for decades now. I'm sure I remember watching a tomorrows world in the 80s with it being brought up. 

Why did we not start this 40 years ago? The UK could have led the world. But we would rather sell our utilities into private hands, taking away any semblance of planning. Let the market decide. And the market decided to keep on using oil and gas (and probably would have been coal as well but there's too much politics involved to discuss the decline of the coal industry). 

FWIW I think it's too late. We've totally screwed the planet up beyond redemption, and we're too addicted to cheap Chinese electronics and Russian oil and gas to ever begin to reverse it. 

Yeap. 
https://global.honda/innovation/FuelCell.html

I wonder why governments won’t push this technology? Is it because the main components are plentiful?

[Archied]

11 hours ago, Stive Pesley said:

Enjoy your blissful and wilful ignorance while you can. Things are moving fast now

https://link.medium.com/8kinyHJcssb

 

Enjoy your doom gloom end of the world is nigh wallowing,, have you considered a megaphone and sandwich board act round Hyde park?

[Archied]

10 hours ago, Boycie said:

I remember when Matlock flooded, there’s a sign by the river bridge on the park that marks its height.  Touch wood it’s never been nowhere near that height since.

Also in the fifty’s there was mass flooding in Ingoldmills, claimed nearly 50 lives after a sea surge.   Then I recently visited the town of Lynmouth, similar death toll.

Would these events in the 50’s and 60’s be down to climate change?

The last prolonged heat wave I remember was in 1976.  I wonder if the result of hotter weather is down to the fact that after we banned cfc’s etc our air is clearer and more heat is getting though?

I’m sure I’ll try to be cancelled and bombarded with info to support the other views but this is the way I see it..

Nobodies completed a full term existence on this planet from creation to extinction.  Nobody knows if this is just the way the world will go.  Who can say that all these actions will preserve the planet? They can assume, but we all know to assume makes an ass out of you and me.

Stop stressing about things so much, we were never here for ever.  We could be wiped out by a meteor next week and no matter how many cows you get to stop farting won’t help I’m afraid.

Then there’s Putin riding his nuke into oblivion.

Do your bit if you want, if it make you feel better, but forcing you views onto others is a bit tiresome.

Believe in what you believe in, do what you think is right.  We’ll still all end up the same way in the end. 
 

Only the Rams and Bucko will live forever.

Quality post sir?,,, it makes me howl how these same caring people didn’t give a fig about the youths future when they thought covid might shave a few years off they’re lives 

[AndyinLiverpool]

19 minutes ago, Archied said:

Quality post sir?,,, it makes me howl how these same caring people didn’t give a fig about the youths future when they thought covid might shave a few years off they’re lives 

Yes, they are definitely the same people 

[Archied]

6 hours ago, Highgate said:

Well ok, you answered a different question, fair enough. 

Let's see where we can agree.  You are worried that a rapid change in how we source our energy will result in profiteering by the already wealthy at the expense of the vulnerable.  That's a realistic and commendable concern in my opinion.  But isn't it always a concern no matter what economic policies we follow? Currently we are enriching the fossil fuel industry.  Either way it doesn't affect whether anthropogenic climate change is real and a threat or not.

You would favour a much more gradual change in response to the threat.  Ordinarily I'd say that was a perfectly sensible approach.  The problem is we've known about this for problem for decades now.  The original Carl Sagan informed half the world in Cosmos in 1980, but no governments listened.  We have lost decades where we have done nothing,...therefore urgency is required now, and that's our fault. 

XR are beside the point as far as I'm concerned and I can see how they can irritate people trying to get on with their lives.  Maybe if they only focused their protests on the politicians who have the actual power to change things.  I'm not sure.

Not referring to anything you said but I think the fatalistic approach of 'let's all relax and do nothing, Putin might drop a nuke on us next week anyway' isn't very helpful.  If the 99% of climate scientists (latest comprehensive estimates of the scientific consensus), are correct then our children and grandchildren won't thank us for that attitude in years to come. 

To be fair this topic is a topic about extinction rebellion, they’re attitudes and tactics , the debate you want have is a different one and if you actually read my posts I’m sure you will know I’m not averse to proper debate on the issue and I’m far from closed minded on the subject though it’s clear there are differences on our views and appropriate approach,

my bug bear on here is with these loons ext reb,  just stop oil , insulate Britain and they’re ilk who I have no time for whatsoever as from what I can see are people who often have totally motives and use this stuff as a vehicle for political agitation , hypocrites, and naive people taken in by them often with unrealistic nervana fantasies 

it does really concern me these people are opening a door very wide on government being able to bring in laws to stop peoples rights to protest with the misguided support of people sick to the back teeth of these loons

Edited August 13, 2022 by Archied

[Archied]

1 minute ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

Yes, they are definitely the same people 

I can only speak as I find

[ariotofmyown]

On 11/08/2022 at 12:04, BaaLocks said:

You've obviously not been watching the Tory leadership debates then?

Erm, you obviously missed Rishi saying his daughters are the experts on recycling in his house! What a policy!

[Highgate]

4 hours ago, Archied said:

To be fair this topic is a topic about extinction rebellion, they’re attitudes and tactics , the debate you want have is a different one and if you actually read my posts I’m sure you will know I’m not averse to proper debate on the issue and I’m far from closed minded on the subject though it’s clear there are differences on our views and appropriate approach,

my bug bear on here is with these loons ext reb,  just stop oil , insulate Britain and they’re ilk who I have no time for whatsoever as from what I can see are people who often have totally motives and use this stuff as a vehicle for political agitation , hypocrites, and naive people taken in by them often with unrealistic nervana fantasies 

it does really concern me these people are opening a door very wide on government being able to bring in laws to stop peoples rights to protest with the misguided support of people sick to the back teeth of these loons

That's true enough I suppose.  Although you can see how whether or not anthropogenic climate change is real or not has a bearing on how people should feel about XR. 

Yeah governments taking the opportunity to clamp down on protests of all kinds is an extremely worrying trend.

[Gone]

13 hours ago, GboroRam said:

What if we remove our reliance on finite fossil fuels and clean our air and generally make the environment better for everyone, all for nothing? 

Isn’t that the plan? 

[Boycie]

https://apple.news/ALa4ImGA4Qo-lYN_e7vrnnw
 

large meteor over Utah America, oh dear, is the end nigh? 

Edited August 14, 2022 by Boycie

[Archied]

1 hour ago, Boycie said:

https://apple.news/ALa4ImGA4Qo-lYN_e7vrnnw
 

large meteor over Utah America, oh dear, is the end nigh? 

Cheers , have got my cable ties and a just stop meteors banner in a bag and am headed for Stamford bridge this afternoon 

[Norman]

40 minutes ago, Archied said:

Cheers , have got my cable ties and a just stop meteors banner in a bag and am headed for Stamford bridge this afternoon 

Don't forget your glue. 

[Archied]

16 minutes ago, Norman said:

Don't forget your glue. 

Have Run out of natural gum gum sticks like butter brand ,, having to accept the plastic cable ties but at this point I’m targeting meteors and letting ocean and land fill plastics slide ,, somethings have to give when needs must

[Leeds Ram]

18 hours ago, Boycie said:

We could, but China won’t, Russia won’t and America won’t.

Thats quite a lot of land mass polluting our atmosphere.

Im sure we have the capability to burn coal cleanly.  I’d have a look but to be honest it wouldn’t matter.

America's already put together a multi billion dollar package to reduce its carbon emissions and get it closer to the Paris agreement on emission standards so to say they won't isn't quite right. The big problems are China and emerging economies (I'd no longer put Russia in that bracket tbh) and how they manage to motivate growth whilst simultaneously reducing emissions. I'm not entirely sure how we can keep those things moving simultaneously, especially when changing our model of growth is an extremely costly thing to do. 

But you're not wrong in the fact that us alone changing how we create and use energy is not going to solve the problem that does stand before us. What we don't know is how we will manage the future, we can't contemplate technological breakthroughs in the next 50-100 years. To pretend we can in the way XR does is a mark of extreme arrogance, if you asked anyone in 1900 what 2000 would look like they'd all be remarkably incorrect. Does this mean we do nothing? no, but does it also mean the end is nigh? also no.