The coronabrexit thread. I mean, coronavirus thread

[G STAR RAM]

17 minutes ago, Eddie said:

Not rising to the bait here, other than to spend a little while looking at the statistics in order to determine whether or not the lockdowns in the UK had any effect at all.

Let's look at the number of cases and deaths in the UK, in relation to the first period of lockdown. Each set of figures is the daily average over a 7 day period, with the daily average number of reported deaths in parentheses.

• 12/03/2020               68 (1)
• 19/03/2020            383 (26)
• 26/03/2020           1198 (138)
• 03/04/2020          3946 (580)
• 10/04/2020          4925 (911)
• 17/04/2020          4991 (914)
• 24/04/2020         4967 (806)
• 01/05/2020          4856 (642)
• 08/05/2020         4844 (494)
• 15/05/2020          3621 (411)
• 22/05/2020         2498 (316)
• 29/05/2020         2432 (306)

The key dates here are 26/03/2020, when the lockdown was implemented, and 10/05/2020, when the 'conditional' plan for ending lockdown was announced.

Without boring you too much, it is clear that it took about 2 weeks after lockdown for new cases to stabilise, and another week or so for deaths to start to reduce. And this is before home testing kits etc. In the early days of the pandemic, something like 10% of confirmed cases died. Basically, you weren't tested unless to were hospitalised.

Picking things up a little later, the number of cases and deaths continued to decline...

• 05/06/2020        2026 (235)
• 12/06/2020         1377 (171)
• 19/06/2020         1266 (132)
• 26/06/2020         1078 (132)

Key dates here were 01/06/2020 - phased re-opening of schools; 15/06/2020 - non-essential shops re-opening; 23/06/2020 - relaxation of 'social distancing'.

 

Personally, I think that a lot of people should congratulate themselves for sticking to the rules, even if members of the stazi/politbureau/government felt the rules only applied to the proles and not to them.

In no way do I think that government ministers having lockdown BYOB parties, groping sessions etc should be construed as justification for doing likewise.

Summary - the first lockdown saved the lives of a lot of vulnerable people. I could prove exactly the same result for the second lockdown, but the people this post is aimed at have already stopped reading and just posted their laughing emoji.

Haven't you just described a wave?

Would be interested to see if you carried out the same exercise for 3rd and 4th waves if the numbers followed the same pattern.

[uttoxram75]

The CEO of Pfizer has said in an interview yesterday that “I don’t believe there is a need for a fourth booster”.

His company are moving toward an antiviral drug seemingly.

Hopefully this is the beginning of the end of  the genuinely scary attempts at forced vaccination that so many are keen to see. 

[ariotofmyown]

1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said:

Well I think it is disgraceful what Johnson has done.

To see him smirking and refusing to answer whether he took part in this party shows the utter contempt he has for his voters (myself included).

Fair play. Time for an adult to be in charge. Not many of them about, but debating policy rather than debasing politics would be a welcome change.

[G STAR RAM]

10 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

Fair play. Time for an adult to be in charge. Not many of them about, but debating policy rather than debasing politics would be a welcome change.

Unfortunately I think we got Prime Minister that the country deserved at the time.

Until both sides realise that issues have to be debated sensibly as opposed to just attacking the other side this is the sort of poo show we will have running the country. 

 

[ariotofmyown]

3 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Unfortunately I think we got Prime Minister that the country deserved at the time.

Until both sides realise that issues have to be debated sensibly as opposed to just attacking the other side this is the sort of poo show we will have running the country. 

 

I think Sunak vs Starmer could be the boring and sensible match up we need.

[G STAR RAM]

22 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

I think Sunak vs Starmer could be the boring and sensible match up we need.

I think Starmer not opposing this Government at all during this pandemic has damaged his cause.

I'm not sure how I can take someone seriously that backs the Government in every single vote only to attack them a couple of weeks later.

Any competent opposition would have this Government in tatters by now.

[ramit]

Quebec to tax the non vaccinated.  Outrageous.

https://globalnews.ca/news/8503151/quebec-to-impose-a-tax-on-people-who-are-unvaccinated-from-covid-19

[ariotofmyown]

I was checking out how the Daily Mail was reporting the latest Johnson scandal. I'm not quite sure how they have the gall to write this stuff. Their more uninformed readers might ask why they weren't told some of this stuff before certain key votes.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10390811/From-lockdown-parties-No10-misleading-Queen-cocaine-confusion-Boriss-worst-scandals.html

[Carl Sagan]

The terrible thing is if we'd had Starmer we'd have been way slower to acquire and then distribute vaccines, and massively stricter on authoritarian lockdowns. You can understand why Boris has survived to date, because however bad he is, all the other options appear worse. And one thing we need at the top is optimism and positivity and the ability not to bow to every media clamour going. 

Yes Boris deserves to go, but be careful what you wish for. Of the people vying to step in, it probably comes down to a choice of Sunak, Truss or Patel. Would people rather have one of them? The perceived wisdom is that the voters factor in our PM's behaviour but like him for other reasons. And the visceral hatred of him by the left is funny because he is by far the most left-wing Tory going, which is why he was able to win London twice when it is a Labour city through and through.

Politicians have an inflated idea of their own position in the country. In the Westminster Village they don't see it, but not many people would recognize Starmer, Sunak, Truss or Patel in the street if they walked past them. Everyone would recognize Boris. That is his gift and the political reality, and to his slight credit he has kept things more open than in Scotland and Wales. Derby County wouldn't exist had we locked down again. It will be interesting to see what happens. PMQs tomorrow could be decisive.

[sunnyhill60]

2 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

The terrible thing is if we'd had Starmer we'd have been way slower to acquire and then distribute vaccines, and massively stricter on authoritarian lockdowns. You can understand why Boris has survived to date, because however bad he is, all the other options appear worse. And one thing we need at the top is optimism and positivity and the ability not to bow to every media clamour going. 

Yes Boris deserves to go, but be careful what you wish for. Of the people vying to step in, it probably comes down to a choice of Sunak, Truss or Patel. Would people rather have one of them? The perceived wisdom is that the voters factor in our PM's behaviour but like him for other reasons. And the visceral hatred of him by the left is funny because he is by far the most left-wing Tory going, which is why he was able to win London twice when it is a Labour city through and through.

Politicians have an inflated idea of their own position in the country. In the Westminster Village they don't see it, but not many people would recognize Starmer, Sunak, Truss or Patel in the street if they walked past them. Everyone would recognize Boris. That is his gift and the political reality, and to his slight credit he has kept things more open than in Scotland and Wales. Derby County wouldn't exist had we locked down again. It will be interesting to see what happens. PMQs tomorrow could be decisive.

Total fiction. You have swallowed hook line and sinker the LIES that being in the EU would have stopped the UK from carrying out its vaccine policy. We carried out the vaccine strategy whilst under EU rules FFS. How sad that you prefer a "personality" as opposed to someone with honesty and integrity, and choose instead a serial liar and adulterer.  Bringing DCFC survival into this discussion is total gonads.

[G STAR RAM]

4 hours ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Total fiction. You have swallowed hook line and sinker the LIES that being in the EU would have stopped the UK from carrying out its vaccine policy. We carried out the vaccine strategy whilst under EU rules FFS. How sad that you prefer a "personality" as opposed to someone with honesty and integrity, and choose instead a serial liar and adulterer.  Bringing DCFC survival into this discussion is total gonads.

So the EU vaccine rollout must have been the same as the UK one then if we were operating under the same rules I assume?

[ariotofmyown]

5 hours ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Total fiction. You have swallowed hook line and sinker the LIES that being in the EU would have stopped the UK from carrying out its vaccine policy. We carried out the vaccine strategy whilst under EU rules FFS. How sad that you prefer a "personality" as opposed to someone with honesty and integrity, and choose instead a serial liar and adulterer.  Bringing DCFC survival into this discussion is total gonads.

We need someone in charge that people recognise. He's goes by the name of Wayne Rooney. Be careful what you wish for...if Johnson goes we could well lose our manager and get Starmer as a replacement. And he has no football background at all!

[Wolfie]

5 hours ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Total fiction. You have swallowed hook line and sinker the LIES that being in the EU would have stopped the UK from carrying out its vaccine policy. We carried out the vaccine strategy whilst under EU rules FFS. How sad that you prefer a "personality" as opposed to someone with honesty and integrity, and choose instead a serial liar and adulterer.  Bringing DCFC survival into this discussion is total gonads.

Eh?

We approved the vaccines under our rules and were getting on with it for weeks before the EU authorities authorised them.

[ariotofmyown]

 

7 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

The terrible thing is if we'd had Starmer we'd have been way slower to acquire and then distribute vaccines

Johnson says this pretty much every week at PMLs, but this article makes interesting reading...

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-johnson-claims-starmer-would-have-joined-eu-vaccine-scheme

 

 

[Bob The Badger]

14 hours ago, uttoxram75 said:

The CEO of Pfizer has said in an interview yesterday that “I don’t believe there is a need for a fourth booster”.

His company are moving toward an antiviral drug seemingly.

Hopefully this is the beginning of the end - of  the genuinely scary attempts at forced vaccination that so many are keen to see. 

I loved that post until you had to tack that on to the end.

Did the Pfizer CEO also say the first two vaccines and booster were necessary?

If he did, and I would imagine that is highly likely, you have to ask yourself, do you trust the guy or not?

Or more to the point, do you only trust people who say what you want to hear?

[Bob The Badger]

8 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

The terrible thing is if we'd had Starmer we'd have been way slower to acquire and then distribute vaccines, and massively stricter on authoritarian lockdowns. Of course that's just in my opinion because there's obviously no way of knowing this for sure as a whole host of different factors come into play when a party comes to power, but that could have happened, just like it might not have.

FTFY

 

[uttoxram75]

18 minutes ago, Bob The Badger said:

I loved that post until you had to tack that on to the end.

Did the Pfizer CEO also say the first two vaccines and booster were necessary?

If he did, and I would imagine that is highly likely, you have to ask yourself, do you trust the guy or not?

Or more to the point, do you only trust people who say what you want to hear?

The CEO of Pfizer will do what is best for Pfizer. Thats his job to maximise profits and shareholder value. 

Either there is more money to be made in antiviral drugs or he knows there is potential harmful side effects from boosters.

 

I see the EMA have also said that repeat boosters could harm the immune system.

 

Time will tell eventually whether the vaccines are safe in the long run. I hope and pray they are.

[G STAR RAM]

An apology at last, quickly ruined by a pitiful attempt at an excuse.

[Carl Sagan]

4 hours ago, Bob The Badger said:

FTFY

 

Aren't you funny, Bob? As well as totally deluded.

You've surely seen what's been enacted by a Labour government in Wales? Even now, Chester had to call their FA Cup game off because some of the ground is across the border and Labour doesn't allow such things.

And Starmer's clamour to be part of the EU Medicine's Agency makes his attitudes pretty clear. https://fullfact.org/health/keir-starmer-european-medicines-agency/

Labour constantly criticized Kate Bingham who headed up the UK vaccine procurement. Not a chance they would have done anything similar. 

 

[JoetheRam]

Anyone got any idea what testing requirements are needed to get into the U.S and back into England? 

I've totally ignored all the news regarding international travel in the last two years because I decided it wasn't worth the hassle, but need to go over soon. Started reading the government website and the amount of if's and buts and different options just confused me.