Ghost of Clough Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 15 minutes ago, Nuwtfly said: At least that £8.5m figures loosely ties in with the club's published accounts. That suggests a 9 point penalty if found guilty. I still believe we'll be let off by either the EFL panel, or the courts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, alexxxxx said: I think this would seem to be the only reasons I could think of. But even still why does it take this long to get to a charge. Because it's the incompetent EFL and they have been bullied into it. I hope Mel counter sues the EFL and gets them to investigate Boros sale of its tax losses to a connected company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: I'm still interested to know where the figure of £8.5m comes from. Our accounting losses only came to £46m for the 3 years and that is assuming that:- (a) no profit was made on the sale of the ground (b) there were no costs included in the DCFC accounts for qualifying academy expenditure Another thing that is being overlooked is that the actual profit on the sale of the ground was £60m (being the £80m sales value less the original cost of £20m) as for FFP purposes we would have received none of the benefit when the ground was revalued upwards from £20m to £55m Aren't the academy accounts filed separately from the club's? Therefore, the figures given in the club's accounts will give us a pretty accurate FFP figure. FYI, our acadamy costs seem to be £6m per year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenBr Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 10 hours ago, Millenniumram said: I don’t know, I’m not a professional scout. All I’m saying is there’s evidence from other clubs business that they’re out there. I’ve said before my strategy would be to look at the big club academy cast offs. Players who haven’t quite made it at the top but could still make it at this level, and at their age wouldn’t demand huge wages. Preston have done well with players like Ben Pearson and Ryan Ledson that we’re of this ilk. It’s a much better strategy than whatever our current approach is imo. FWIW Bielik looked like a positive step in that direction, but his fee was quite large tbf. George Evans is from Man Citys academy Bielik is from Arsenals. Butterfield started at Man Utds academy and we had 3 of the best youth players in the country last year. Ex academy players are on of our main recruitment pools as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 10 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: Based on Transfermarkt figures you're understating the net transfer spend 18/19 in - Waghorn (£5m), Marriott (£3m), Jozefzoon (£2.8m), Holmes (£0.7m), Evans (£?), Malone (£?) 18/19 out - Vydra (£11m), Weimann (£2m), Jerome (£?), Hanson (£?) Net - c£2m profit 17/18 in - Lawrence (£5m), Wisdom (£2m), Huddlestone (£2m), Jerome (£1.5m), Davies (£0.5m) 17/18 out - Ince (£8.2m), Hughes (£8.2m), Christie (£2.5m), Russell (£0.25m) Net - £8m profit 16/17 in - Vydra (£8.5m), Anya (£4.2m), Nugent (£2.6m) 16/17 out - Hendrick (£10.6m), Grant (£1.35m), Albentosa (£0.7m), Shotton (£0.3m) Net - £2.35m profit The issue is the £30m+ net spent in 15/16... We made a profit on Ince, we've still got Carson, but heavy losses on the rest we paid a fee for. Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFC1388 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 There is no point in comparing us to Sheff Weds as their issue is down to the financial year the sale went into the books compared to when it was actually sold. Ours is purely based on the valuation, not who it was sold to, or when. I just cannot understand how a valuation 18months after the original valuation can be deemed acceptable, personally think its a case of the EFL savings face to the other owners who are moaning, like the investigation into Rooney wearing 32 which resulted in nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: Aren't the academy accounts filed separately from the club's? Therefore, the figures given in the club's accounts will give us a pretty accurate FFP figure. FYI, our acadamy costs seem to be £6m per year. I think they are now but pretty sure that is a relatively new thing, will check back when I get chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 9 minutes ago, Woodley Ram said: Hi @Carnero where did you get those figures? They seem to make sense just wondered By piecing together the info stated by Kieran Maguire (Price of Football twitter), John Percy & Ryan Conway. They all have slightly different figures but all indicate a required stadium value in the £55m-£60m range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 @G STAR RAM 2016 = -£14,725,353 2017 = -£7,872,715 2018 = +£14,571,628 Profit on fixed assets (stadium) = £39,940,387 Total loss without sale = -£47,966,827 Overspend = £8,966,827 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abu Derby Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 The EFL will take months to implement the punishment and so it’s next season we ought to be concerned about. Starting with a potential 12 point deduction and transfer ban would see us confined to the lower reaches for a considerable time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 15 minutes ago, Carnero said: Different people all coming up with different figures. It looks like a summary of the situation is: - we valued the stadium at £80m - EFL value the stadium at £50m - in order to comply the stadium value needs need be in the range of £55m-£60m I think we'll be fine. This is bonkers... Looking at the numbers the Guardian are quoting £14.7m loss in 15-16 £8m loss in 16-17 £25.3m loss in 17-18 Total 3 year loss of £48m (ie, £9m above FFP rules) Ground Sale @ £80m - Profits listed as £39m - ie, the asset value was £41m as listed on ALL previous approved accounts for the last 10 years So we're claiming the ground has increased in value by £39m since 10 years ago - However all we need to hit FFP is an increase in value of £10m - (ie, asset sale value of £51m) Just saying - If that pile of rubble and wood which is Hillsborough is worth £60m then PP is worth at least that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: @G STAR RAM 2016 = -£14,725,353 2017 = -£7,872,715 2018 = +£14,571,628 Profit on fixed assets (stadium) = £39,940,387 Total loss without sale = -£47,966,827 Overspend = £8,966,827 So...I repeat. the real problems will be in the next two years unless we have made significant cuts. For 2019 the max loss would be @-£6m. A huge reduction compared to the underlying -25m loss for 2018. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mucker1884 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 I've just had a vision... Mel woke this morning, looked in the mirror, and there before his very eyes, broke the widest, brightest smile he had ever witnessed. His heart skipped a beat. He wrung his hands with glee and anticipation... and then he skipped downstairs all the way to his awaiting smoked salmon breakfast. I dream a lot about Mel... and he's never looked happier. Never been more confident. Never been so excited! Today is a good day, people. In Mel we trust! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: @G STAR RAM 2016 = -£14,725,353 2017 = -£7,872,715 2018 = +£14,571,628 Profit on fixed assets (stadium) = £39,940,387 Total loss without sale = -£47,966,827 Overspend = £8,966,827 So does that tie in with others saying if the stadium were to be valued circa 55-60m we still comply Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimeram Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 8 hours ago, philmycocu said: That's that then Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimeram Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, Abu Derby said: The EFL will take months to implement the punishment and so it’s next season we ought to be concerned about. Starting with a potential 12 point deduction and transfer ban would see us confined to the lower reaches for a considerable time. Exactly.......next season looks buggered now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanjwitham Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 16 minutes ago, GenBr said: George Evans is from Man Citys academy Bielik is from Arsenals. Butterfield started at Man Utds academy and we had 3 of the best youth players in the country last year. Ex academy players are on of our main recruitment pools as it is. If you're following that logic, then *every* player is an ex-academy player. They don't just appear out of nowhere as fully-formed football players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Mucker1884 said: I've just had a vision... Mel woke this morning, looked in the mirror, and there before his very eyes, broke the widest, brightest smile he had ever witnessed. His heart skipped a beat. He wrung his hands with glee and anticipation... and then he skipped downstairs all the way to his awaiting smoked salmon breakfast. I dream a lot about Mel... and he's never looked happier. Never been more confident. Never been so excited! Today is a good day, people. In Mel we trust! In a previous life you were clearly Captain on the Titanic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, RamNut said: So...I repeat. the real problems will be in the next two years unless we have made significant cuts. For 2019 the max loss would be @-£6m. A huge reduction compared to the underlying -25m loss for 2018. That depends on the verdict of the panel/courts. As we went into those season under the supposedly safe knowledge of the sale being okay, those following two years may be given the thumbs up. It's anyone's guess at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mucker1884 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 Just now, DRBee said: In a previous life you were clearly Captain on the Titanic I haven't had a previous life... yet! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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