The Politics Thread 2020

[Sith Happens]

2 hours ago, 1967Ram said:

She admitted what she did was wrong. She has though shown integrity by resigning. Whereas..........

Thats a bit economical with the truth though. People were calling for Cummings to resign from his job in its entirety i.e, she hasn't stepped down as an MP so hasn't resigned from her main job.

I don't think she should by the way, just think applauding her for resigning when she hasn't in fact resigned is not quite right.

[Andicis]

43 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

People stressing about it being "too early" and fearing a "second wave" are only correct on the second point. There will almost certainly be a second wave and almost certainly we'll go back to March 23rd lockdown levels at some point. Repeat until vaccine

A lot of scientists are saying the opposite now. We might get a second wave, but it's nowhere near nailed on that we will. There is a decent probability that we don't.

[Bob The Badger]

1 hour ago, Boycie said:

Come on people I know it’s hot, no need to let things boil over in here.

Ive removed some minor sniping, let’s not start it up again.

Count to 10 before posting.

Thats what we do before issuing points.

I was about to snipe at you after I wasted 2 precious minutes looking for that Steve McQueen scene only to see you had already posted it.

I nastily didn't give you a handclap though, so I'll leave it there for this time.

[maxjam]

 

Interesting article (and hour long podcast that I'll listen to at a later date) about Michael Lind’s The New Class War: Saving Democracy from the Managerial Elite.

I know some of you will shudder at the thought of Brendon O'Neill and Spiked so here is a Guardian article as well;

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/feb/02/the-new-class-war-michael-lind-democrats-trump

I'll try and give the podcast a listen later and maybe add the book to my reading list, some interesting ideas imo.

 

[Bob The Badger]

2 hours ago, jono said:

I saw this one on Facebook. It a load of ill educated rubbish. Anyone with even a minute amount of brain will know that each country collects and reports data in different ways , with different levels of accuracy and compliance .. then add in demographics, population density and a huge pile of other variables. The truth is every Western Europe’s country allowing for obvious variables will have had a broadly Similar infection and death rate. We are all human and in European terms live in a similar way. All governments have made errors, none has failed to respond sensibly. 

If what you're saying is right, then the figures would have been out of whack all along.

Or, are you suggesting that Spain changed the way they reported, or they are lying now?

This is a crazy hypothesis I know, but let me run in by you.

Maybe the fact that the UK and Spain had their first case on the same day but Spain locked down 9 days earlier and made it more brutal was a factor?

Spain went into lockdown and we had Cheltenham Festival.

What do you think?

And I'm sure you're right that no country didn't make any mistakes.

But there are levels of incompetence.

Germany and Austria both narrowly missed out on an 'A' in their chemistry exam after screwing up the chemical symbol for mercury.

The UK got asked to leave the room after spelling its name wrong in crayon at the top of the paper and then getting the crayon stuck up one nostril.  

[TramRam]

2 hours ago, Angry Ram said:

Did it take much Labour to put it up?

No not really, But I did get a lot of opposition from the neighbours to the Left of me.

[TramRam]

2 hours ago, Boycie said:

Must have been some quality sausage laid on his bbq that’s all I’m saying.

Definitely not  Richmonds quality.

The reason they were having difficulties is she was served up a Chipolata.

[King Kevin]

22 hours ago, Bob The Badger said:

Stunned you ignore the alcohol thing - perhaps you like a drink, but you're not overweight?

Alcohol puts a massive burden on the NHS both directly and indirectly

With the smoking again, I was largely meaning the impact on the NHS in general, as I'm pretty sure you knew, but wanted to deflect.

But yeh, there was some conjecture when looking at very small samples early on, but this is the latest WHO position on it which will disappint smokers.

Tobacco smoking is a known risk factor for many respiratory infections and increases the severity of respiratory diseases. A review of studies by public health experts convened by WHO on 29 April 2020 found that smokers are more likely to develop severe disease with COVID-19, compared to non-smokers.

COVID-19 is an infectious disease that primarily attacks the lungs. Smoking impairs lung function making it harder for the body to fight off coronaviruses and other diseases. Tobacco is also a major risk factor for noncommunicable diseases like cardiovascular disease, cancer, respiratory disease and diabetes which put people with these conditions at higher risk for developing severe illness when affected by COVID-19. Available research suggests that smokers are at higher risk of developing severe disease and death.

Although Trump doesn't trust the WHO, so maybe you don't?

Here is the link if you want to learn stuff

This guy goes to the doctors ,I've got some terrible news the doctor says ,you've only got 3 months to live .

You must help me doctor says the man ,sorry was the reply not a lot I can do .

The man pleads with the doctor and eventually the doctor says well there is something we could try .

I'll do anything says the man ,well the doctor replies you must give up drinking ,smoking and sex. 

Will that make me live longer ? asks the man .

No replies the doctor but it will seem like it .

 

[Norman]

9 hours ago, alexxxxx said:

Where's the conspiracy in that article? 

Some Labour peer dislikes Cummings and when presented with evidence he broke lockdown she allegedly raises the alarm against him. Not exactly a deep conspiracy. 

The bloke who picks up his daughter, again doesn't break lockdown as far as Im aware. It's not against lockdown to move house and using public transport isn't allowed. 

Some rogue guy allegedly makes up some stuff against Cummings which was always denied by the government- doesn't excuse him from the stuff he did actually did. 

Well, no. Because they weren't the conspiracies. 

[alexxxxx]

34 minutes ago, Norman said:

Well, no. Because they weren't the conspiracies. 

I read it again and I'm not seeing a conspiracy? Would you care to explain? 

[Norman]

1 minute ago, alexxxxx said:

I read it again and I'm not seeing a conspiracy? Would you care to explain? 

There isn't one, that's the point. Yet a few of us were compared to Corbyn's crazy brother and called 5g mast burners. 

[alexxxxx]

2 minutes ago, Norman said:

There isn't one, that's the point. Yet a few of us were compared to Corbyn's crazy brother and called 5g mast burners. 

I'm confused at your original post now but okay! 

[Eddie]

Quote

The government says it has reached its target to increase testing capacity to 200,000 per day by the end of May - its figure for Saturday was 205,634.

That means the various labs doing tests say they could handle that number of tests. The actual number of tests being done is a lot lower than that (115,000 on Saturday).

Even in capacity terms, the government was a long way short of its target last week - on Thursday its capacity was about 165,000.

Then on Friday and Saturday it was boosted by an extra 40,000 in testing capacity. This is for antibody tests that tell if people have had the virus before rather than if they have the virus now. They will primarily be used on healthcare staff at first.

But the government’s figures say that the actual number of these tests that have been processed so far is 0.

Sorry, not sure if this should be posted here.  You know how touchy some people are.

 

[Gritstone Ram]

4 hours ago, GboroRam said:

Richmond make the worst sausages in the world. Fact. If anyone disagrees, I don't think you know the meaning of the word fact and should refer to a dictionary. 

Lips and ********* as my mate would call them.

[Gritstone Ram]

2 hours ago, King Kevin said:

This guy goes to the doctors ,I've got some terrible news the doctor says ,you've only got 3 months to live .

You must help me doctor says the man ,sorry was the reply not a lot I can do .

The man pleads with the doctor and eventually the doctor says well there is something we could try .

I'll do anything says the man ,well the doctor replies you must give up drinking ,smoking and sex. 

Will that make me live longer ? asks the man .

No replies the doctor but it will seem like it .

 

I went to the doctor and he said “ the best thing you can do is give up smoking, drinking and fried food”. 
I said “what’s the second best?”.

[maxjam]

Just stumbled across this on youtube which is well worth a watch regardless of what camp you belong to - largely discusses the science behind the campaign;

 

 

If nothing else watch from about 28m55s for a couple of minutes, he talks about that sign on the side of the bus - the £350m to the NHS.

[Comrade 86]

7 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Just stumbled across this on youtube which is well worth a watch regardless of what camp you belong to - largely discusses the science behind the campaign;

 

 

If nothing else watch from about 28m55s for a couple of minutes, he talks about that sign on the side of the bus - the £350m to the NHS.

Hmmm. So it transpires that he's actually very comfortable with public speaking, after all. I guess the mad stammer must have developed between this forum and last week. I wonder why!

More interestingly, have we not been assured for several years now by your good self and several other habitual posters, that the £350 million to the NHS was purely aspirational and nothing more, as Cummings here is quite clearly saying the polar opposite. You guys have been telling us that nobody believed the figure was a literal promise and yet he we have the very architect of the Brexit campaign and the slogan itself saying it absolutely was.

The last point of interest for me is his openly stated view that by and large, Tory MPs don't care about the British public. Hmmmm. Seems he doesn't lie all the time then. I'm now trying to decide now whether I respect him more, or less, as a consequence.

Interesting post nonetheless. Might watch the vid in its entirety when I have more time.

 

[maxjam]

12 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

Hmmm. So it transpires that he's actually very comfortable with public speaking, after all. I guess the mad stammer must have developed between this forum and last week. I wonder why!

More interestingly, have we not been assured for several years now by your good self and several other habitual posters, that the £350 million to the NHS was purely aspirational and nothing more, as Cummings here is quite clearly saying the polar opposite. You guys have been telling us that nobody believed the figure was a literal promise and yet he we have the very architect of the Brexit campaign and the slogan itself saying it absolutely was.

The last point of interest for me is his openly stated view that by and large, Tory MPs don't care about the British public. Hmmmm. Seems he doesn't lie all the time then. I'm now trying to decide now whether I respect him more, or less, as a consequence.

Interesting post nonetheless. Might watch the vid in its entirety when I have more time.

He stutters and stammers through the video at various points should you watch all of it.  It offers an interesting view behind the scenes so to speak about how they used science to swing the vote.

Dunno about the £350m being purely aspirational, nice to hear that it was Boris intention to deliver it though had he won the leadership contest - something that perhaps bore out when he pledged record NHS funding within days of actually becoming PM. 

It will also be interesting to see if after Brexit and Coronavirus whether Boris does get chance to settle into his job without lurching from one crisis to another and deliver the 'peoples government' he promised.  Dominic Cummings does seem to suggest he is more in touch with the common man and understands that the Tories have traditionally been an uncaring party than your typical Tory.  My hopes aren't high but time will tell I guess.

[RamNut]

@maxjam that is an interesting video.

he comes across as brutally honest and rational. His withering opinion of MPs - particularly Tory MPs - is an eye opener.

 

[Rev]

2 hours ago, maxjam said:

Just stumbled across this on youtube which is well worth a watch regardless of what camp you belong to - largely discusses the science behind the campaign;

 

 

If nothing else watch from about 28m55s for a couple of minutes, he talks about that sign on the side of the bus - the £350m to the NHS.

Thanks for posting that.

The main thing I took from it was he's smart enough to see the majority of the electorate as neither left or right wing, but as individuals who will pick and choose which policies apply to them, in contrast to the elected MPs who believe we sit at one end or the other of the scale.

I didn't however find him particularly principled one way or the other, I got the impression he'd have quite happily worked for remain if they'd have got to him first, or paid him more.

In fact, I'd say he comes across as a smug twit, for whom being on the winning side of an argument is more important to him personally than whether he believes in a cause or not.

That's not even a criticism, more an observation.