richinspain Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, The Key Club King said: Given we don't know the value of this deal, and other than Hughes (who has been only moderately successful at Watford), who have we not had market value for under Mel? Anya went a lot a cheaper than he should have done. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted September 9, 2020 Author Share Posted September 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, GenBr said: I'm in inclined to believe we got towards the upper end of reported figures, but why would Shef Utd need to be paying us in instalments? They aren't short of cash and we surely would prefer the payment in one big lump rather than dribbled over several years. Pretty much all transfer fees are paid in installments. Makes no difference to the selling club, other than the cash flow, all the money due is accounted for from day one in the accounts, as it's guaranteed. Newcastle are pretty much an outlier in that they pay upfront, in return for a lesser fee, but not many do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, The Key Club King said: Given we don't know the value of this deal, and other than Hughes (who has been only moderately successful at Watford), who have we not had market value for under Mel? We've made a profit on very few players since he's been here, players we've spent a fortune on have walked away for next to nothing or for free. I guess that doesn't really depict market value, but it was also in my thinking. Tom Ince - made an ok profit - fair value. I felt at the time we should've had more. Will Hughes - made a profit - crap deal for us. Below market value. Jeff Hendrick - made a profit - great deal for us. It was on the back of a good euros. Albentosa - made a small profit - decent enough considering how much of a howler the signing was Luke Thomas - made a profit - fair value. He did well in League One, showed some character flaws, so we got shot. Jayden Bogle - made a profit - not sure how much. fair value at best, crap deal at worst. Max Lowe - made a profit - as above, but at worst this is still not bad for us. I believe everyone else that has left the club has left at a loss or on a free in the past five years. I think when you see Brentford make nearly £100m profit in the same amount of time then it leaves food for thought. Mel, at the very least, has surrounded himself with incompetence that has cost him millions and me some of the best years of my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 On 07/09/2020 at 20:42, europia said: I wonder how this fits the chairmans strategy for the academy. Is the academy's objective to produce players to sell to PL clubs, or to produce a Derby County team, over a period of time, capable of getting promoted and competing at the top level? Honestly ? As a championship club with an income / Investment / Wages and cost balance that is so skewed and manipulated by outside influences... It’s got to be a bit of both. football is football but the stage we are on is a tilted, wind blown mess. We do what we have to do. Some good, some not so ... and at times it hurts. We will get days in the sun like Max Bird growing with Wayne Rooney and rainy days when promising kids Like Max and Jayden get sold because the piper needs paying. C’est la vie” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 17 minutes ago, Ambitious said: We've made a profit on very few players since he's been here, players we've spent a fortune on have walked away for next to nothing or for free. I guess that doesn't really depict market value, but it was also in my thinking. Tom Ince - made an ok profit - fair value. I felt at the time we should've had more. Will Hughes - made a profit - crap deal for us. Below market value. Jeff Hendrick - made a profit - great deal for us. It was on the back of a good euros. Albentosa - made a small profit - decent enough considering how much of a howler the signing was Luke Thomas - made a profit - fair value. He did well in League One, showed some character flaws, so we got shot. Jayden Bogle - made a profit - not sure how much. fair value at best, crap deal at worst. Max Lowe - made a profit - as above, but at worst this is still not bad for us. I believe everyone else that has left the club has left at a loss or on a free in the past five years. I think when you see Brentford make nearly £100m profit in the same amount of time then it leaves food for thought. Mel, at the very least, has surrounded himself with incompetence that has cost him millions and me some of the best years of my life. You write so many good posts .. this wasn’t one of them. Get a grip lad, or do you need some trauma therapy ? Look, the bad times and regrets were character building .. think of it as cold showers and toughening your self up. A bit of self flagellation never hurt anyone .. it didn’t do me any harm. It’s the sort of stoicism that made this country great (cue land of hope and glory) God for Harry (and his dog with the bank account) England and St George Thorne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 47 minutes ago, GenBr said: I'm in inclined to believe we got towards the upper end of reported figures, but why would Shef Utd need to be paying us in instalments? They aren't short of cash and we surely would prefer the payment in one big lump rather than dribbled over several years. Hardly any deals of value are single payment upfront transactions these days, especially for younger players. Also don't forget not every club in the Prem makes bombs. A significant number lose money each year. The deferred payments are also interest free. Add that to stadia being closed since March and you have a few relatively compelling reasons why they would look to spread the cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, jono said: You write so many good posts .. this wasn’t one of them. Get a grip lad, or do you need some trauma therapy ? Look, the bad times and regrets were character building .. think of it as cold showers and toughening your self up. A bit of self flagellation never hurt anyone .. it didn’t do me any harm. It’s the sort of stoicism that made this country great (cue land of hope and glory) God for Harry (and his dog with the bank account) England and St George Thorne. Very patriotic ? My point was simply that the transfer window and player recruitment has been the worst part of Mel Morris' tenure here. I'm not even piling on, but we've had a pretty rough time of incomings and outgoings. Nothing more than Mel backed the wrong horse in this regard. Unfortunately it's one of the most critical, if not THE most critical, part of a Championship club. My attitude is always that you should never be happy with not being the best in every area: why are Brentford able to do things in this regard much better than us - we had the financial resources to be able to make more of the opportunities their recruitment has provided them. I just hope we've looked at our own processes and going forward we will be the best club in the country, even division, when it comes to player recruitment. It wasn't a bedwetting post, just using examples to show that it's something that we need to improve on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritstone Ram Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 38 minutes ago, Ambitious said: We've made a profit on very few players since he's been here, players we've spent a fortune on have walked away for next to nothing or for free. I guess that doesn't really depict market value, but it was also in my thinking. Tom Ince - made an ok profit - fair value. I felt at the time we should've had more. Will Hughes - made a profit - crap deal for us. Below market value. Jeff Hendrick - made a profit - great deal for us. It was on the back of a good euros. Albentosa - made a small profit - decent enough considering how much of a howler the signing was Luke Thomas - made a profit - fair value. He did well in League One, showed some character flaws, so we got shot. Jayden Bogle - made a profit - not sure how much. fair value at best, crap deal at worst. Max Lowe - made a profit - as above, but at worst this is still not bad for us. I believe everyone else that has left the club has left at a loss or on a free in the past five years. I think when you see Brentford make nearly £100m profit in the same amount of time then it leaves food for thought. Mel, at the very least, has surrounded himself with incompetence that has cost him millions and me some of the best years of my life. What about Vydra? I reckon we made a bit on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 1 minute ago, Van Gritters said: What about Vydra? I reckon we made a bit on him. Yes - although I think the fee was slightly lower than we all hoped. I thought I'd put him in all honesty, bought for £8m and sold for £11m. I guess when you take into account his wages then the actual profit would've been quite minimal. At least we were able to sell him after it initially looked like he was a flop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 15 minutes ago, Ambitious said: Very patriotic ? My point was simply that the transfer window and player recruitment has been the worst part of Mel Morris' tenure here. I'm not even piling on, but we've had a pretty rough time of incomings and outgoings. Nothing more than Mel backed the wrong horse in this regard. Unfortunately it's one of the most critical, if not THE most critical, part of a Championship club. My attitude is always that you should never be happy with not being the best in every area: why are Brentford able to do things in this regard much better than us - we had the financial resources to be able to make more of the opportunities their recruitment has provided them. I just hope we've looked at our own processes and going forward we will be the best club in the country, even division, when it comes to player recruitment. It wasn't a bedwetting post, just using examples to show that it's something that we need to improve on. I was just messing around. Too much sauce and not enough matches. Yes, you’re right in so far as these things go. There are clubs who manage consistently to work the world better than others. Brentford and Burnley are star pupils. It would be nice if we could be as savvy as they are ... which I guess was your point ? i just had to respond though when you started talking about your wasted years, jees I was reaching for the Kleenex aloe vera tissues it was so tragic ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 20 minutes ago, Van Gritters said: What about Vydra? I reckon we made a bit on him. The early 18/19 season saw us sell players worth £12.8m for a total of £11.7m - Vydra, Weimann and possibly Jerome. During the same period we signed players worth £18.5m (Waghorn, Marriott, Jozefzoon, Malone, Evans, Holmes) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 50 minutes ago, jono said: Honestly ? As a championship club with an income / Investment / Wages and cost balance that is so skewed and manipulated by outside influences... It’s got to be a bit of both. football is football but the stage we are on is a tilted, wind blown mess. We do what we have to do. Some good, some not so ... and at times it hurts. We will get days in the sun like Max Bird growing with Wayne Rooney and rainy days when promising kids Like Max and Jayden get sold because the piper needs paying. C’est la vie” This ☝️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jram Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 Honestly the Brentford love-in on this forum is hilarious ? they’ll probably finish 15th next season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 32 minutes ago, Ambitious said: Very patriotic ? My point was simply that the transfer window and player recruitment has been the worst part of Mel Morris' tenure here. I'm not even piling on, but we've had a pretty rough time of incomings and outgoings. Nothing more than Mel backed the wrong horse in this regard. Unfortunately it's one of the most critical, if not THE most critical, part of a Championship club. I almost read this backwards , as if you suggested Uncle Mel has been the worst (bloke in charge) as we have done in and out transfers. Uncle Mel has been guilty of one thing, TRUST. whether he was trusting the slimy salesman or the upcoming coach.... to be continued. the police are here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 Oh and our summer 15/16 spend was lower than expected. Just £22m for Johnson, Ince, Butterfield, Shackell, and Weimann for fees, as well as Carson, Bent, Pearce and Baird on frees (plus agent fees) Blackman, Camara and Olsson were later signed for a combined £4.1m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 In summer 2016 (16/17), we sold Hendrick, Albentosa and Shotton for a combined £9.7m. Those players had a combined book value of just £700k. We signed Vydra for £8.5m, Weale for free (nominal agents fee), with Anya and academy purchases for £5.7m ? Grant, Hughes and Ince were sold for a combined profit of about £8m. Christie was sold for £2.25m (book value of £213k). At the end of the 17/18 season we received a further £1.5m for Ince (which may have been a sell-on fee?) In summer 2017, Lawrence, Wisdom, Huddlestone, Davies and Ledley were signed at a cost of £12.8m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marriot Ram99 Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 46 minutes ago, Jram said: Honestly the Brentford love-in on this forum is hilarious ? they’ll probably finish 15th next season Most people have them down as top 2 for a reason, 28mill in the bank to help add to an already good team should mean they atleast finish in the top 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Buckley’s Dog Posted September 9, 2020 Share Posted September 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said: Oh and our summer 15/16 spend was lower than expected. Just £22m for Johnson, Ince, Butterfield, Shackell, and Weimann for fees, as well as Carson, Bent, Pearce and Baird on frees (plus agent fees) Blackman, Camara and Olsson were later signed for a combined £4.1m Didn't put a foot wrong there did we. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richinspain Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 Would this be her husband? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 7 hours ago, Marriott Ram99 said: Most people have them down as top 2 for a reason, 28mill in the bank to help add to an already good team should mean they atleast finish in the top 6. Most had them down as top two finish with a few games to go last season ,then most had them down as play off winners ,turned out they were not quite the same team under the weight of expectation that they were as dark horses , puts me in mind of another team over a few years , 28 mill could help but you take Watkins goals away too and see how they faired , also Watkins revelation was down to a switch in position which they’re coach tried with him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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