The Politics Thread 2019

[FindernRam]

Reported this morning that the UK has had the highest INWARD investment of any EU country this last quarter. 

Leavers will say will be even better when we go

Remoaners will say its because investors think we will stay.

Oh to be a spin doctor now that election time is here!

[Stive Pesley]

A general political question on the notion of "small government". I think @maxjam mentioned this as something he was "for" (apologies if it wasn't you)

My understanding of this term, is that it means a low amount of government interference in people's lives? Low taxes - leaving everyone to be more autonomous in how they spend their income. Is that loosely right?

Would it also be right to say that conservative parties are more aligned to the concept of small government than socialist parties?

 

[McRamFan]

37 minutes ago, FindernRam said:

Reported this morning that the UK has had the highest INWARD investment of any EU country this last quarter. 

Leavers will say will be even better when we go

Remoaners will say its because investors think we will stay.

Oh to be a spin doctor now that election time is here!

Or it's Russian Oligarch's buying up property in London...or you could say that since voting brexit, it has decreased by over 75%.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/foreign-direct-investment

But hey, don't let the bigger picture get in the way.

[maxjam]

16 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

A general political question on the notion of "small government". I think @maxjam mentioned this as something he was "for" (apologies if it wasn't you)

My understanding of this term, is that it means a low amount of government interference in people's lives? Low taxes - leaving everyone to be more autonomous in how they spend their income. Is that loosely right?

Would it also be right to say that conservative parties are more aligned to the concept of small government than socialist parties?

 

Small government is traditionally seen as more of a conservative thing but I personally view it as increasing accountability. 

Ideally the UK would take power back from the EU then hand more out to local councils - people would then be far closer to the 'seats of power' then and more likely to be both heard and understood.

[Stive Pesley]

22 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Small government is traditionally seen as more of a conservative thing but I personally view it as increasing accountability. 

Ideally the UK would take power back from the EU then hand more out to local councils - people would then be far closer to the 'seats of power' then and more likely to be both heard and understood.

Thanks

The reason I ask is closer to home, as the local elections are this week and there seems to be an enormous amount being made by the Conservatives about how they restored the free brown bin collections

5 years ago the Labour council of the time implemented a cost-saving measure to charge £40 to anyone who wanted to have their brown bin collected

That feels like more of a small government/accountability move. ie Rather than spend x million on running a full service for people that don't even want/need it, we're making it optional and giving people the choice. You can pay a small amount to continue and we then save money to use on other things. It's loosely a similar principle to NHS vs private healthcare I guess

I don't want to debate about the right/wrong of the previous labour council (even as a Labour voter I think they got a lot of things wrong) - I'm just interested in the topsy-turviness of some political principles

 

 

 

 

[Wolfie]

14 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

Thanks

The reason I ask is closer to home, as the local elections are this week and there seems to be an enormous amount being made by the Conservatives about how they restored the free brown bin collections

5 years ago the Labour council of the time implemented a cost-saving measure to charge £40 to anyone who wanted to have their brown bin collected

That feels like more of a small government/accountability move. ie Rather than spend x million on running a full service for people that don't even want/need it, we're making it optional and giving people the choice. You can pay a small amount to continue and we then save money to use on other things. It's loosely a similar principle to NHS vs private healthcare I guess

I don't want to debate about the right/wrong of the previous labour council (even as a Labour voter I think they got a lot of things wrong) - I'm just interested in the topsy-turviness of some political principles

Indeed. It does seem to be the wrong way round. Our £35 brown bin collection was introduced by the Tories but then we are a very safe Tory council (and constituency).

I'm guessing your area is more closely fought and that brown bin fees were a vote winner (getting rid of them, that is) to get the Tories into power. it does seem an odd thing for a Tory council to do, though.

[Stive Pesley]

Just now, Wolfie said:

Indeed. It does seem to be the wrong way round. Our £35 brown bin collection was introduced by the Tories but then we are a very safe Tory council (and constituency).

I'm guessing your area is more closely fought and that brown bin fees were a vote winner (getting rid of them, that is) to get the Tories into power. it does seem an odd thing for a Tory council to do, though.

Ah OK - so I'm not going mad, but yes it's a close fought council (Labour actually have the most seats but the Tories head a coalition with UKIP to lead the council currently) - and definitely seems to be perceived as a vote winner amongst the furred arteries of the well-off suburbs here. God knows why. It's a bin

 

 

[1of4]

I view small government the same as I view the trickle down theory of economics. A good idea so long as you're financially secure, but not if you're ill, unemployed, poor or even that wonderfully named group the JAMS.( just about managing).

[cstand]

18 hours ago, eddie said:

So which lot are you voting for in the Euro elections - Kippers or Kippers lite?

Do we still have a democracy with a meaningful vote? 

Which vote are you talking about the 1st 2nd or best of 3 vote, peoples or rabid remainers vote.

 

[GboroRam]

18 minutes ago, cstand said:

Do we still have a democracy with a meaningful vote? 

Which vote are you talking about the 1st 2nd or best of 3 vote, peoples or rabid remainers vote.

 

We're talking the "fool me twice, shame on me" vote.

[Day]

9 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

We're talking the "fool me twice, shame on me" vote.

And after that one is it third time lucky eh? ?

[cstand]

On ‎21‎/‎04‎/‎2019 at 08:45, ariotofmyown said:

I went to Eastbourne yesterday for the first time. Nice place. My mate told me that he helped build the sewage works there in the early 2000s. At that point, raw sewage was just pumped out into the sea, but those pesky EU regulations made us build a proper sewage system.

So we was pumping sewage into the sea could not afford to build a sewage plant due to giving the EU billions of ££££££s every year, the EU then monitor sea pollution a few years later then give us our own money back to build the sewage plant with a big sign funded by the EU.

Surely it would have quicker and cheaper to cut out the middle man/woman/person.

 

 

[cstand]

8 hours ago, McRamFan said:

3 points:

1. French always riot.

2. Spain's issue goes back 40 odd years, gamon related.

3..,

French always riot.... for 6 months I think not have they not taken their demonstrations to Strasbourg now?

Spain Gamon related ?

Italy ?

 

 

[1of4]

9 hours ago, McRamFan said:

3 points:

1. French always riot.

2. Spain's issue goes back 40 odd years, gamon related.

3..,

What's that, the Spanish got upset by an irate white English bloke, going red in the face. Isn't that a common occurrence in places like Benidorm.

[Archied]

Ok time to throw your hats in the ring before the event ,,,, if the brexit party blow others out of the water in the euro elections will you take it as a pointer that the country has not swayed to remain since the referendum as claimed by remainers or will it mean nothing ? In which case the same importance applied if a pro remain party comes out on top , be good to put it out ther before any result so no after the event spin will cut it

[maxjam]

6 minutes ago, Archied said:

Ok time to throw your hats in the ring before the event ,,,, if the brexit party blow others out of the water in the euro elections will you take it as a pointer that the country has not swayed to remain since the referendum

I'd widen that to Brexit Party and UKIP, they should have worked together to get vote - all they will do is split the leave vote between themselves ?

It will be interesting to see what the turn out is and if its higher than normal whether its the leavers or remainers that can be bothered to vote.

[ariotofmyown]

4 hours ago, cstand said:

So we was pumping sewage into the sea could not afford to build a sewage plant due to giving the EU billions of ££££££s every year, the EU then monitor sea pollution a few years later then give us our own money back to build the sewage plant with a big sign funded by the EU.

Surely it would have quicker and cheaper to cut out the middle man/woman/person.

 

 

We should be able to pollute our own see if we want too!

[eddie]

Just now, ariotofmyown said:

We should be able to pollute our own see if we want too!

Kipper spelling detected.

?

[cstand]

9 minutes ago, eddie said:

Kipper spelling detected.

?

Fell for the trap only picked up a spelling mistake so you agreed with the rest of my post..two for the price of one aswell. ? 

[Stive Pesley]

4 hours ago, Archied said:

Ok time to throw your hats in the ring before the event ,,,, if the brexit party blow others out of the water in the euro elections will you take it as a pointer that the country has not swayed to remain since the referendum as claimed by remainers or will it mean nothing ? In which case the same importance applied if a pro remain party comes out on top , be good to put it out ther before any result so no after the event spin will cut it

It's a good question - I suspect turn out will be incredibly low for the Euro elections, people are generally disillusioned by it. The type of person to go and out deliberately vote for a Brexit party MEP is the stereotypical beetroot-faced gammon, full of rage protesting against their own impotence. They probably will garner a lot of those votes, but it won't be more than the 17 million who voted Brexit - so I wouldn't read anything into it.

I think most people will just vote the same way they always vote. "pro-remain" = Lib Dems then? I voted remain but I'm not going to vote Libdem in the euro elections