Playing style

[FindernRam]

Recent comments seem to show polarised views: how do you want Derby to play?

[RoyMac5]

Says Frankie:

 

[EnigmaRam]

Playing a style that plays it out from the back is fine. But when the opposition plays the high press we need to go long to exploit the spaces this has created.

its not rocket science. 

[Millenniumram]

Personally I like possession, if we’re in control of the football, only we can hurt ourselves. Lumping it just conceded the game and allows teams to come at us. Naturally if we can’t break teams down then mixing it up is always a good idea, but otherwise we just have to patient, create some holes in defence, and then once we get some space, make sure to move the ball quickly into dangerous areas.

[Smyth_18]

In an ideal world i think everybody would want to mix it up but it isn't that simple.

The team dynamics will dictate how we should play. Everybody needs to be in it together and 100% believe in the job required of them and the team to be effective.

[Alph]

None of them or all of them. Pointless possession is only pointless when you're not winning. 

The thing that's got a few arguments over Mac has been when people rewrite history and say Mac had a possession team. He didn't. We averaged about 53% in his first spell. 

That's the football I want and from the sounds of it is also the football Lampard will give if he can. 

Mac is the best recent example of the football I enjoy. The pointless possession at the back was only to draw teams onto us or to defend a scoreline by controlling the game. Whenever we needed and a goal or the opportunity came to fire it into Martin then we'd take it. We didn't need a second invite to come forward. We didn't take the risks with losing the ball that Rowett would take but neither were we obsessed with keeping it like Clement was. As soon as the ball was into Martin then you can guarantee there was pace in the passing. 

When winning then obviously you take even less risk. 

If the pressing is heavy we'd try to skip passes out. Remember how often Forsyth and Keogh would target Martin? Thorne was another one who would skip out Bryson or Hendrick/Hughes. 

It was skipping passes out that made teams park the bus. We never got pressed so often or heavy as Lampard has because Derby were a great viewing for neutrals because if you invited an open game then they would likely blast through. 

Now I know Mac wasn't perfect but there was always a method in the way we went about our business up until the point we were decimated by injuries that made our system and style break down.

Lampard has spoken a lot about decision making. At the minute it's pretty poor. But under Mac, with some thanks to Nigel Clough, players judged the momentum of the game well. 

We had scrappy games at the likes of Sheff Wednesday and Blackpool. Games where we couldn't cope with the press and were finding we had to skip passes out a lot.

But the system never really changed. It was literally an unfussy team that didn't mind how they played in and off Martin. If it took 15 passes to get there or 1. 

But there was none of the hoofing in the general direction to Martin. Or hoofing into empty pitch for someone to chase. We had technicians like Hughes to go to if we needed an escape and he was the magician to find that one player who had time and space. He was the go to guy that helped us avoid kick and chase. 

 

[cosmic]

2 hours ago, EnigmaRam said:

Playing a style that plays it out from the back is fine. But when the opposition plays the high press we need to go long to exploit the spaces this has created.

its not rocket science. 

That’s exactly what teams want you to do when you’re the most threatening playing it on the deck. Most teams can deal with long balls all day. 

[Carnero]

4-4-2, up and at 'em.

Defenders who defend, 2 box-to-box midfielders who cover for each other, 2 hard-working wingers who get to the by-line and cross, big man/little man combo up front to feed off the wingers delivery.

IE. Football from when i grew up.

[ollycutts1982]

Its okay playing out from the back as long as the CBs don't dawdle on the ball too much, this is reliant on the CDM finding space or other players showing and finding space. I don't mind Keogh having the ball as long as he moves it on quicker.

[Angry Ram]

Attack, attack, attack. ?

[Angry Ram]

Just play quicker..

[LazloW]

I agree with the last post.  Tempo,  movement and (controlled) aggression are big factors to me.  Don’t care if it’s short passing, long passing or a mix but do it at pace and ensure you are moving to create space and getting at teams when you don’t have the ball.  There is obviously a subtle but important difference between being high tempo and just rushing around like headless chickens!  Good teams manage to work out what the difference is (I’m not saying we aren’t a good team!)

[Day]

14 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

Attack, attack, attack. ?

Playing style not posting style Angry ?

[Ambitious]

I see it at the moment as a mindset change. I think everyone knows in midfield and defence that they should be having a touch of the ball as soon as possible. We know each defender gets a touch, the opposition come out to 'greet' them and then the ball goes sideway, the opposition player filters back into position & we repeat. 

I understand that it all starts off with a mindset change, but we need to implement a deeper plan. If an opposition player comes out to meet Keogh with the ball, perhaps another comes out to block the pass to Davies/Tomori the other player comes out to block the pass to Bogle - which happens quite a lot. We tend to panic and go backwards to Carson or flounder and get caught out. 

The whole purpose of a possession game at the back is to drag opposition players out of their 'system' then it's up to our midfielders to take advantage of those gaps they've left. It's an incredibly difficult system to implement because everyone needs to be on the same wavelength. It's not as easy as winning the percentages. I also think aside from Evans that none of the midfielders have been able to take advantage of the space left behind by the opposition because they aren't focused enough.

Thorne consistently used to have the most touches, make the most passes, make the most tackles, etc when he played that role & that's what it takes. It's such a huge, important role in how we're playing that the lack of a natural option is killing us. The positioning is absolutely key, people asking for Tomori to play there because he's strong, quick & can pick a pass would soon see that 90% of the game is in their head, not what they can do with their feet. 

[jono]

23 minutes ago, ollycutts1982 said:

Its okay playing out from the back as long as the CBs don't dawdle on the ball too much, this is reliant on the CDM finding space or other players showing and finding space. I don't mind Keogh having the ball as long as he moves it on quicker.

Yep ! Dead right. Everything is about pass and move .. the movement creates space and opportunity. No use moaning at the CB’s unless the players in front of them are moving and presenting themselves. We are showing flashes of it but it needs to get embedded. I am sure that both Fergie and Clough always coached .. aim to give the man with the ball at least 2 options to pass to. 

I was very encouraged in the first 10 mins when Bogle and Bennett passed and moved for each other - me to you to me with darting runs in between with first time passes .... do that and your almost untouchable. I’d like to think that is what Frank wants to see. 

[Shang]

I like the way Frank wants us to play. Will take a few games for the defenders to get used to be willing to take risks passing through the lines and seeing how the people in front of them move and like to receive the ball to feet. Currently I think they're way too  worried about playing the perfect ball. Not worried about this, I know we'll get there eventually.

[Alph]

30 minutes ago, Ambitious said:

I see it at the moment as a mindset change. I think everyone knows in midfield and defence that they should be having a touch of the ball as soon as possible. We know each defender gets a touch, the opposition come out to 'greet' them and then the ball goes sideway, the opposition player filters back into position & we repeat. 

I understand that it all starts off with a mindset change, but we need to implement a deeper plan. If an opposition player comes out to meet Keogh with the ball, perhaps another comes out to block the pass to Davies/Tomori the other player comes out to block the pass to Bogle - which happens quite a lot. We tend to panic and go backwards to Carson or flounder and get caught out. 

The whole purpose of a possession game at the back is to drag opposition players out of their 'system' then it's up to our midfielders to take advantage of those gaps they've left. It's an incredibly difficult system to implement because everyone needs to be on the same wavelength. It's not as easy as winning the percentages. I also think aside from Evans that none of the midfielders have been able to take advantage of the space left behind by the opposition because they aren't focused enough.

Thorne consistently used to have the most touches, make the most passes, make the most tackles, etc when he played that role & that's what it takes. It's such a huge, important role in how we're playing that the lack of a natural option is killing us. The positioning is absolutely key, people asking for Tomori to play there because he's strong, quick & can pick a pass would soon see that 90% of the game is in their head, not what they can do with their feet. 

In turn as the opponent closes down and leaves a space as our player moves to the space he attracts another opposition player to leave a space for someone else. 

As you say it's getting all this movement to synchronise that's taking time. Full of genuine movement into space to receive the ball and also dummy movement to create the chance for others. 

I think it's fair to say a lot of Rowett's work was based on defending against this kind of play. His attacking was quite simplistic really. But it was based on sucking the opponents in when they had the ball. Complete reverse to how Lampard wants to play. 

[Kirkbyram]

I like what Frank is trying to do possession wise. The fans need to give it time. They were constantly on the defenders back yesterday when they passed it backwards or shifted it across, I think this booing/sighing indirectly lead to Keogh and Tomori overplaying when a sideways pass was on, resulting in an opportunity for Ipswich. I though Derby worked the ball around well and with a bit more movement from midfield, both towards the ball to colllect it, or away from the ball, to make space for other players and a bit more patience we should see more of mount/Bryson/Lawrence etc... on the ball in the final 3rd. This seems to be the end game but it won’t happen overnight though and people need to accept that. 

[Jimbo Ram]

5 hours ago, FindernRam said:

Recent comments seem to show polarised views: how do you want Derby to play?

Possession football but at a faster tempo and 30 yards further up the pitch. Don't like the pointless tappy tappy stuff outside our own area......

[Rev]

Such a restrictive poll it's not worth voting. 

What does mix it up lot more even mean?

The OP obviously has his own opinion on how we should play, and the poll reflects that.