rynny Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 6 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: That wasn't specifically at you David,it's what I perceive to be the general feeling to be from some posters. Surely the balance on a forum comes from fans having alternate views that balance themselves out?... certainly myself and archied have had many discussions on the subject and both taken something out of the others views that we both can agree on. There are posters on both sides that are completely at the opposite end of the scale that annoy me. You have your totally negative fans, never give any credit, complain about everything. Then you have the fans that are super positive and can't/won't criticise anything at all, even justifiable things and jump on anyone who even mutters anything that isn't super duper 100% positive. It is just a handful of posters on each side. It just gets boring and repetitive. Just to be clear I don't see you as one of those posters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 8 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: However that is THE crux of the matter isn't it. 'Mac-style' football and players vs 'Rowett-style' football and pensioners... I think we have said this before...it absolutely is. There is such a massive gulf in the style of play of Mac and rowett that it was bound to cause friction. If we had brought in a manager with a style closer to Mac's but edging towards some of rowetts then this either wouldn't have happened or the effect would have been much less apparent in the forum's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 1 minute ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: I think we have said this before...it absolutely is. There is such a massive gulf in the style of play of Mac and rowett that it was bound to cause friction. If we had brought in a manager with a style closer to Mac's but edging towards some of rowetts then this either wouldn't have happened or the effect would have been much less apparent in the forum's. That's not the cause of any friction though is it, this has nothing to do with who the manager is or isn't. It's how opinions are being put across on the internet within a community, it has resulted in some members no longer using the forum as regular as they once were. That is down to us, the members, how we communicate with one another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, rynny said: There are posters on both sides that are completely at the opposite end of the scale that annoy me. You have your totally negative fans, never give any credit, complain about everything. Then you have the fans that are super positive and can't/won't criticise anything at all, even justifiable things and jump on anyone who even mutters anything that isn't super duper 100% positive. It is just a handful of posters on each side. It just gets boring and repetitive. Just to be clear I don't see you as one of those posters. Aye @kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong aint the problem, I don't agree with his sentiments of late but I've agreed with him on many a topic in the past and will in the future I'm sure. For clarity on my post, and I think @Wolfie and @The Scarlet Pimpernel - the problem isn't really the criticism; that's just something to challenge, and nor is it the specific people leading the charge on the current wave of criticism - they just have the most desire to voice their opinion. The problem, for me, is the amount of topics started that are saying the same thing, incessantly - and the amount of topics that devolve into those same arguments. With the same people saying the same thing over and over again on both sides of the fence. Without any growth, there is no point in having the conversation, you may as well just have a 20 page chain of one person saying "YES" and the other saying "NO"; and it seems like multiple people are having the same exchange of posts multiple times a day - it just seems tedious and I've lost motivation to get involved. I've put a lot of effort into Keogh defense on this forum over the seasons, for example - putting thought into replies to peoples criticism that lead to them (and sometimes me, admittedly) compromising on our views as we came to understand each others perspectives - and then the next day someone else would bump a Keogh bashing thread or start a new one with an eloquent "He's ******* **** get rid of him" and I'd go through it all again. My point being, that it doesn't take long before people stop caring enough to put any effort into counterarguments on either side. And once people stop putting effort into the conversation, it becomes tedious to read - hence my absence of late. I hope that clarifies my stance. I choose to be supportive (sometimes, overly) of the club because in my opinion I've got far too much in my life, that actually matters, to be critical of and upset with to be able to afford putting effort into critiquing or getting upset with Derby County. I'm not one of those people who thinks someone who spends their time criticising is not a "proper fan" though, each to their own. It's hopefully a temporary problem - we've hit my threshold for this sort of thing a couple of times in the past and it's moved on on those occasions. I'm sure we'll survive this one too Just an afterthought I've had - what actually does annoy me is people who claim to be supporters of the club seeming to revel or bask in the club, manager or a player failing as they feel it vindicates their criticism. I think that's where people stray out from the realm of "supporter" - it just comes across as malicious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 4 hours ago, RamNut said: vydra has been the saving grace this season. unfortunately gary reminds me of john gregory and phil brown......... We must remember their reigns very differently if you would compare a team sat in 5th position with the 5th best strike force and 3rd best defence with either of their teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 26 minutes ago, David said: That's not the cause of any friction though is it, this has nothing to do with who the manager is or isn't. It's how opinions are being put across on the internet within a community, it has resulted in some members no longer using the forum as regular as they once were. That is down to us, the members, how we communicate with one another. Clearly there is some thuth in that David. But,I look on this almost as derbys Brexit moment.....it's a subject that is capable of dividing a set of fans who are as passionate about their club as each other and have firm ideas on how we should be playing and run. Hard to moderate something so important to them as that.... Good points from saint ram though...perhaps we could limit posts on the same subject to existing threads?....sounds easier said then done tho!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BondJovi Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 1 minute ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Clearly there is some thuth in that David. But,I look on this almost as derbys Brexit moment.....it's a subject that is capable of dividing a set of fans who are as passionate about their club as each other and have firm ideas on how we should be playing and run. Hard to moderate something so important to them as that.... Much like brexit though i am beyond bored of it. All we seem to have left are the extremes on both sides. I read less of the forum now because it currently drains all enthusiasm, i see the same circles traced over and over. The worst part is those so desperate to find fault with the club. I want to hear different views, but endless unnecessary negativity is tiresome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 1 hour ago, David said: Point is still valid ? It is indeed and I'm in agreement. My reply was a lighthearted, sarcastic jest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 25 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Clearly there is some thuth in that David. But,I look on this almost as derbys Brexit moment.....it's a subject that is capable of dividing a set of fans who are as passionate about their club as each other and have firm ideas on how we should be playing and run. Hard to moderate something so important to them as that.... I can't figure out if there is a big divide or a case of the vocal minority taking over, and I mean no offence to anyone when I say that. Totally conscious of the fact I can get quite vocal at times and have to say to myself give others a chance to reply, it's ok picking up the likes and saying everyone agrees whoop, but I would rather see their thoughts written down as well than just my ramblings. I'm sat on here most hours of the day making sure you are all behaving, it's hard not to jump in on every comment as I have opinions, lots of em! You have mentioned before that fans around you are not happy with the style of football, at the same time I am in a few private messaging groups that are fairly happy right now, season ticket holders as well. I will pull a random number out and say 8 ish members I recognise as not being overly happy with things which stand out, this month we have had 550+ members which have submitted new content, followed something, or reacted to something on the forum, but that number really is tiny in this small sample pool already. Challenge is to get those members posting more, do we remove reactions so the only way you can agree is by using words, I'm not sure, but as I say, I'm not sure if that divide is actually there or not either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 I think that deep down, we're all missing @Ninos! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamRam Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, David said: I can't figure out if there is a big divide or a case of the vocal minority taking over, and I mean no offence to anyone when I say that. Totally conscious of the fact I can get quite vocal at times and say to myself give others a chance to reply, it's ok picking up the likes and saying everyone agrees whoop, but I would rather see there thoughts as well than just my ramblings. I'm sat on here most hours of the day making sure you are all behaving, it's hard not to jump in on every comment as I have opinions, lots of em! You have mentioned before that fans around you are not happy with the style of football, at the same time I am in a few private messaging groups that are fairly happy right now, season ticket holders as well. I will pull a random number out and say 8 ish members I recognise as not being overly happy with things which stand out, this month we have had 550+ members which have submitted new content, followed something, or reacted to something on the forum but, so that number really is tiny in this small sample pool already. Challenge is to get those members posting more, do we remove reactions so the only way you can agree is by using words, I'm not sure, but as I say, I'm not sure if that divide is actually there or not either. I’m probably in one of those 8 :-) and have also restricted my posts recently in the hope that GR proves me wrong, and despite him not, will continue to refrain from posting. I would also say though that there are around the same that are on the other end of the scale, hopefully you won’t mind me classing you as one of these, and hopefully you will find a solution for the members in between... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Just now, AdamRam said: I’m probably in one of those 8 :-) and have also restricted my posts recently in the hope that GR proves me wrong, and despite him not, will continue to refrain from posting. I would also say though that there are around the same that are on the other end of the scale, hopefully you won’t mind me classing you as one of these, and hopefully you will find a solution for the members in between... Make that 9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Sam Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 judge him when the dust as settled,don't think he will be jumping ship and running to Newcastle though do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LazloW Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 What tends to aggravate me is that you know generally from a title thread what way certain posters are going to go even before you read it. I’m a happy clapper (sorry for the term) but am capable of criticising the manager, the club, the team, the stewarding, the traffic management and any other aspect of the club as and when I consider it warranted and necessary to do so (search hard and you will find ‘negative’ posts, though actually I tend to follow the line of ‘if I haven’t got anything positive to say; I won’t say anything at all’). What pushes me to the ignore button is the ability of some to find a negative in anything and everything the club does. I used to get drawn into all sorts of arguments with people over their comments.. and still do now and again, though I try not to bite as often as I did (indeed, a constant argument I was having with one particular regular poster during NCs time drove me from the site for about 5 years). It does seem that there is a bit of deja vue about most threads (including the descent into punning!) and this leads me to lurk more, arbitrarily ‘like’ more without justification or stay clear of some topics altogether. However, of the 8/9 posters really unhappy with Rowett, I imagine the same names will crop up who seem really unhappy and critical of Mel, the academy, rams tv, why we postponed Sunday’s match (and automatically jumping on the anti/DCFC bandwagon) and so on. There is often a lack of balance or even willingness to consider an alternative view which irks and which undoubtedly leads to the same arguments cropping up time and time again. Obviously the same could be said from those who won’t hear a word said against anybody. I actually think that some people tend to stick to their guns a lot because of a tendency for people to drag up comments from yonks before which would suggest somebody has - shock of shocks - changed their mind about something. Being called a hypocrite or inconsistent seems to be the worst thing in the world in social media, so for some I think it is just easier to carry on regardless even if they don’t believe it. In terms of GR, I’m currently giving him the benefit of the doubt. This may change. My comments over time might reflect this. It doesn’t make me a bad person or a liar, I’m just reacting to a changing context (politicians suffer from this too). This isn’t a ‘don’t be negative’ comment, this is really just a ‘you don’t have to be negative to meet your internet persona or justify the previous 1000 posts you made’ plea. Indeed, if people react to the situation and context more then, in general, I tend to take more notice of what they say. Those with a one track mind - for or against the club - tend to be ignored (as most of my posts are probably ?). Wow - that’s really long!! Sorry (trying to avoid work) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistaram Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 20 minutes ago, Seaside Sam said: judge him when the dust as settled,don't think he will be jumping ship and running to Newcastle though do you? Love it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyhill60 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 20 minutes ago, Seaside Sam said: judge him when the dust as settled,don't think he will be jumping ship and running to Newcastle though do you? Not unless he gets sacked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 1 hour ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Clearly there is some thuth in that David. But,I look on this almost as derbys Brexit moment.....it's a subject that is capable of dividing a set of fans who are as passionate about their club as each other and have firm ideas on how we should be playing and run. Hard to moderate something so important to them as that.... Good points from saint ram though...perhaps we could limit posts on the same subject to existing threads?....sounds easier said then done tho!! GRexit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistaram Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 2 hours ago, RoyMac5 said: However that is THE crux of the matter isn't it. 'Mac-style' football and players vs 'Rowett-style' football and pensioners... Or do you really mean Mac style failure ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 For me I’ve reached the stage where it feels like some posts are just clearly made to wind people up ,not fellow derby fans debating football matters , there’s a difference and for me that difference is summed up by whether I can respect a posters different view and debate it ( kash ) or whether I feel it’s just anything and everything just to wind Derby fans up like a Roy Mac ,,, there it’s said ,, perhaps wrong to say it but over a period of time that’s what I see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 For what it’s worth, I think there’s been some great contributions to this forum recently and that has included posters like Kash and Roy. I’ve certainly found it more interesting than say Dec-Jan period. Ive not really read through the thread but I dare say there’s some throwing of stones in glass houses going on here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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