Alty_Ram

Not all players come through an academy are going to make it. Some are there to make up numbers for the academy squad so we can put out a team. Throwing them all in isn't right isnt right
Some players develop faster than others, some burst onto the scene & can play every game, some need bedding in, some are ready at 18 years old some don't develop until they're 22 - 23 year old. Thats both physically and mentally
It isn't about chucking them in and seeing if they sink or swim. You could chuck someone in & they sink but they could have well swam with the right guidance and bedding in. 
We're reliant on throwing in too many academy products in one hit. Some aren't ready for a 46 game season & it'll be damaging to their development 
It also shouldn't be morris' decision that academy players are ready. He employs far more qualified people than him to decide what is best for our team.
Im not saying mothball youngsters i just dont think its fair to throw 18 year olds in to match day squads potentially before they are ready   

I never post, but I do check in pretty regularly and browse around the topics here.  This forum is such a great source for keeping up with the club, and I just felt like chiming in today to shout out David and the moderators for the job they do here.  I have the utmost respect for the way this message board is run; and following this thread over the last couple days has only encouraged more admiration of the work you all do here.  
I appreciate David's patience and leadership in drafting the summary and pursuing clarifications, and thank you for the latest update Boycie.  Once again: I really appreciate this place, and I know that the work that goes into its maintenance goes too often unappreciated.
#COYR

But how will them struggling in a team help their development? 

Looks like they've been consulting the Italians tackling manual in that top pic ?

Nobody likes to see what has happened to our beloved club. The last few years excesses have caught up with the club and we are in a terrible state of the clubs own making. The EFL are certainly making things much harder but we simply should not be in this position.
The flip side though is that right now, despite barely being a going concern, wages are being paid because Mel Morris is making sure that happens. Without that we are truly down the pan.
MM wanted a legacy of the academy to leave behind and he has had some success in that regard but now we need an urgent resolution to the ownership saga and we may need MM to take a hit for the sake of the club. That is easy for fans to say because it is not our money but as each week passes and potentially the season unfolds badly, the club will be worth less and less and his bargaining position becomes weaker still. None of us know what deal is on offer from potential investors nor what MM wants for him to hand over control so it is hard to judge.
I would however be very careful about discussions about 'pounds of flesh' and people venting their spleen because we need MM to want to do what's right for the future of the club and I don't see that abuse and 'MM out' campaigns are helpful in that regard because we are in a precarious position. I'm fine with people asking tough/straight questions at the meeting and on forums but I really hope that it doesn't become toxic. Wednesday may or may not give us some of the answers that we so badly want but in recent weeks the idiots on social media have shown us how hateful things can get in the cess pool of the internet. We desperately needs a calm transition of power to someone who will run this club prudently but it has to be right and none of us have a seat at that particular table. Tough times..

Nobody likes to see what has happened to our beloved club. The last few years excesses have caught up with the club and we are in a terrible state of the clubs own making. The EFL are certainly making things much harder but we simply should not be in this position.
The flip side though is that right now, despite barely being a going concern, wages are being paid because Mel Morris is making sure that happens. Without that we are truly down the pan.
MM wanted a legacy of the academy to leave behind and he has had some success in that regard but now we need an urgent resolution to the ownership saga and we may need MM to take a hit for the sake of the club. That is easy for fans to say because it is not our money but as each week passes and potentially the season unfolds badly, the club will be worth less and less and his bargaining position becomes weaker still. None of us know what deal is on offer from potential investors nor what MM wants for him to hand over control so it is hard to judge.
I would however be very careful about discussions about 'pounds of flesh' and people venting their spleen because we need MM to want to do what's right for the future of the club and I don't see that abuse and 'MM out' campaigns are helpful in that regard because we are in a precarious position. I'm fine with people asking tough/straight questions at the meeting and on forums but I really hope that it doesn't become toxic. Wednesday may or may not give us some of the answers that we so badly want but in recent weeks the idiots on social media have shown us how hateful things can get in the cess pool of the internet. We desperately needs a calm transition of power to someone who will run this club prudently but it has to be right and none of us have a seat at that particular table. Tough times..

Nobody likes to see what has happened to our beloved club. The last few years excesses have caught up with the club and we are in a terrible state of the clubs own making. The EFL are certainly making things much harder but we simply should not be in this position.
The flip side though is that right now, despite barely being a going concern, wages are being paid because Mel Morris is making sure that happens. Without that we are truly down the pan.
MM wanted a legacy of the academy to leave behind and he has had some success in that regard but now we need an urgent resolution to the ownership saga and we may need MM to take a hit for the sake of the club. That is easy for fans to say because it is not our money but as each week passes and potentially the season unfolds badly, the club will be worth less and less and his bargaining position becomes weaker still. None of us know what deal is on offer from potential investors nor what MM wants for him to hand over control so it is hard to judge.
I would however be very careful about discussions about 'pounds of flesh' and people venting their spleen because we need MM to want to do what's right for the future of the club and I don't see that abuse and 'MM out' campaigns are helpful in that regard because we are in a precarious position. I'm fine with people asking tough/straight questions at the meeting and on forums but I really hope that it doesn't become toxic. Wednesday may or may not give us some of the answers that we so badly want but in recent weeks the idiots on social media have shown us how hateful things can get in the cess pool of the internet. We desperately needs a calm transition of power to someone who will run this club prudently but it has to be right and none of us have a seat at that particular table. Tough times..

Only become the main focus of humour in a David Squires cartoon! ?
https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2021/aug/03/david-squires-on-the-football-leagues-return-and-the-rooney-blues

Nobody likes to see what has happened to our beloved club. The last few years excesses have caught up with the club and we are in a terrible state of the clubs own making. The EFL are certainly making things much harder but we simply should not be in this position.
The flip side though is that right now, despite barely being a going concern, wages are being paid because Mel Morris is making sure that happens. Without that we are truly down the pan.
MM wanted a legacy of the academy to leave behind and he has had some success in that regard but now we need an urgent resolution to the ownership saga and we may need MM to take a hit for the sake of the club. That is easy for fans to say because it is not our money but as each week passes and potentially the season unfolds badly, the club will be worth less and less and his bargaining position becomes weaker still. None of us know what deal is on offer from potential investors nor what MM wants for him to hand over control so it is hard to judge.
I would however be very careful about discussions about 'pounds of flesh' and people venting their spleen because we need MM to want to do what's right for the future of the club and I don't see that abuse and 'MM out' campaigns are helpful in that regard because we are in a precarious position. I'm fine with people asking tough/straight questions at the meeting and on forums but I really hope that it doesn't become toxic. Wednesday may or may not give us some of the answers that we so badly want but in recent weeks the idiots on social media have shown us how hateful things can get in the cess pool of the internet. We desperately needs a calm transition of power to someone who will run this club prudently but it has to be right and none of us have a seat at that particular table. Tough times..

Nobody likes to see what has happened to our beloved club. The last few years excesses have caught up with the club and we are in a terrible state of the clubs own making. The EFL are certainly making things much harder but we simply should not be in this position.
The flip side though is that right now, despite barely being a going concern, wages are being paid because Mel Morris is making sure that happens. Without that we are truly down the pan.
MM wanted a legacy of the academy to leave behind and he has had some success in that regard but now we need an urgent resolution to the ownership saga and we may need MM to take a hit for the sake of the club. That is easy for fans to say because it is not our money but as each week passes and potentially the season unfolds badly, the club will be worth less and less and his bargaining position becomes weaker still. None of us know what deal is on offer from potential investors nor what MM wants for him to hand over control so it is hard to judge.
I would however be very careful about discussions about 'pounds of flesh' and people venting their spleen because we need MM to want to do what's right for the future of the club and I don't see that abuse and 'MM out' campaigns are helpful in that regard because we are in a precarious position. I'm fine with people asking tough/straight questions at the meeting and on forums but I really hope that it doesn't become toxic. Wednesday may or may not give us some of the answers that we so badly want but in recent weeks the idiots on social media have shown us how hateful things can get in the cess pool of the internet. We desperately needs a calm transition of power to someone who will run this club prudently but it has to be right and none of us have a seat at that particular table. Tough times..

There seems to be a strange misconception that ANY Derby fans are actually pleased when we lose. Surely by definition of a fan that simply isn't the case ? I'm certainly not of the 'happy clappy' persuasion but I definitely want us to win every single game we play. Some may choose to temper the enthusiasm of a particular win if say for example the opposition wasn't up to much. That's OK right ? Beating Fulham this season is surely going to be received in a different way to narrowly seeing off Stockport County in a cup game with a soft penalty.
Fundamentally, discussing the shortcomings of the squad is part and parcel of having a Forum just as much as praising good individual and teams performances. It's not a case of either/or (of your scenarios) because I wouldn't want the lack of perspective of just having one of them. Sometimes when I'm on a bit of a downer after a bad result I find it useful that someone is able to pick some positives. OK, we lost 1-0 but they are a decent side and we have only conceded 2 goals in 5 games or whatever. I might counter and say that we have only scored 2 in 5 but that's kind of the point of the forum ? ?
I think the biggest danger is that differences in how you see things relating to DCFC spill over into increasingly pithy comments and drift into name calling. I don't expect all posters to agree with me (god knows, I not the oracle of all wisdom !) but I'd hope that you could come up with a good counter argument as to why I am perhaps seeing things more unfavourably than perhaps I need to, rather than just calling me a clueless **** ?
As regards the forum in general, I think on the whole the debates are conducted in the spirit in which they are intended and serious disagreements (beyond just pithy responses) are relatively uncommon compared the sheer weight of forum posts. As others have said, it'd be a dull forum if everyone agreed on everything !

There seems to be a strange misconception that ANY Derby fans are actually pleased when we lose. Surely by definition of a fan that simply isn't the case ? I'm certainly not of the 'happy clappy' persuasion but I definitely want us to win every single game we play. Some may choose to temper the enthusiasm of a particular win if say for example the opposition wasn't up to much. That's OK right ? Beating Fulham this season is surely going to be received in a different way to narrowly seeing off Stockport County in a cup game with a soft penalty.
Fundamentally, discussing the shortcomings of the squad is part and parcel of having a Forum just as much as praising good individual and teams performances. It's not a case of either/or (of your scenarios) because I wouldn't want the lack of perspective of just having one of them. Sometimes when I'm on a bit of a downer after a bad result I find it useful that someone is able to pick some positives. OK, we lost 1-0 but they are a decent side and we have only conceded 2 goals in 5 games or whatever. I might counter and say that we have only scored 2 in 5 but that's kind of the point of the forum ? ?
I think the biggest danger is that differences in how you see things relating to DCFC spill over into increasingly pithy comments and drift into name calling. I don't expect all posters to agree with me (god knows, I not the oracle of all wisdom !) but I'd hope that you could come up with a good counter argument as to why I am perhaps seeing things more unfavourably than perhaps I need to, rather than just calling me a clueless **** ?
As regards the forum in general, I think on the whole the debates are conducted in the spirit in which they are intended and serious disagreements (beyond just pithy responses) are relatively uncommon compared the sheer weight of forum posts. As others have said, it'd be a dull forum if everyone agreed on everything !

I prefer posters who are balanced. When there is something to criticise, they criticise; when there is something to praise, they praise. In the main I prefer positivity to negativity, but if there is justifiable criticism then I prefer reasoned argument to ranting and vitriolic hyperbole. 
Whatever the stance on ‘wrist slasher’ Vs ‘happy clapper’ I think it is an undeniable truth that there are some posters who find a cloud for every silver lining and who will leave no stone unturned to find a way to have a dig at Mel/the club/certain players. Equally, there are some who get so upset at any criticism that reason can also go out of the window and we descend into the aforementioned happy clapper vs wrist slasher debate.  Super and uncritical positivity in spite of all evidence to the contrary can be just as off putting as the opposite (though easier to ignore in my case).
For myself, I’m probably a glass half full kind of guy and have undoubtedly gotten into arguments on here with people I consider to be overly negative (though less so in recent years as I have grown up and realise you can’t win an internet argument so there’s no point). I also haven’t posted much recently because there isn’t a lot to be positive about and I’m certainly not going to try to persuade people otherwise (though I still occasionally try to put a less negative spin on some things).
So, in conclusion, I prefer a forum without entrenched views, where people can observe what is happening, comment on it, change their minds as the context changes and do so in peace and harmony. Oh and I like puns too. Yes, must have puns.

Good news ! In the interests of clarity, apparently the EFL have now published the all new 'Special Derby County rules that we made up this week'....

Good news ! In the interests of clarity, apparently the EFL have now published the all new 'Special Derby County rules that we made up this week'....

Good news ! In the interests of clarity, apparently the EFL have now published the all new 'Special Derby County rules that we made up this week'....

Tomori looked a bit suspect when he first arrived. Not that you couldn't see a good player in there doing some great work but needed game time to improve and he certainly did that. Mengi is not quite there but could improve hugely with game time if we can afford to give it to him as long as it was alongside one of the canny old heads.

Like a bunch of sore losers stood around the ref brandishing imaginary cards for every tackle...

I would like to submit this non football related question, but one that I feel on a human level should be asked.
Mel, how are you and how is your health?

Maybe we got the 5th player by Rooney sleeping upright in a hotel room chair and there was certainly wind blown

I'm genuinely glad that there are some optimists about but I think that we are miles from being a competitive force even if we sign the trialists. The squad is palpably weaker than last year IMHO even with them. The central defence recruitment smacks of desperation and is just not enough for a season and we are desperate for more goals from the whole team. Far too often last year we were seen of by teams who knew that once they got their noses out in front then we wouldn't score.
That's not to say that it is hopeless as a fit Bielik is a massive asset to return and if we can sort ownership issues then we may yet reinforce but I can't see much happening beyond the trialists and the danger is that we are dead and buried by the time the January window opens.

A sort of 'Clinging to a burning rope attached to a crumbling cliff above a waiting pride of lions while wearing a metal hat as a thunderstorm rages'... but at least you've managed to shake the annoying lobster that had hold of your toe sort of 'good'? ?

I'm not naturally in the wildly optimistic camp but if the issue re accounts is being worked on quietly behind the scenes between the DCFC and the EFL to find a submission that both are happy with then that sounds a lot more healthy than the public spats, counter spats and pithy statements that have served as our lines of communication with the EFL for a while now. Sounds at least like both are keen to put this to bed with a pre-agreed approach and statement rather than have further public antipathy and appeals. Hopefully we can find something acceptable quickly and maybe, just maybe we can all move on... who knows...
48 hours then.. ?

I'm not naturally in the wildly optimistic camp but if the issue re accounts is being worked on quietly behind the scenes between the DCFC and the EFL to find a submission that both are happy with then that sounds a lot more healthy than the public spats, counter spats and pithy statements that have served as our lines of communication with the EFL for a while now. Sounds at least like both are keen to put this to bed with a pre-agreed approach and statement rather than have further public antipathy and appeals. Hopefully we can find something acceptable quickly and maybe, just maybe we can all move on... who knows...
48 hours then.. ?

I'm not naturally in the wildly optimistic camp but if the issue re accounts is being worked on quietly behind the scenes between the DCFC and the EFL to find a submission that both are happy with then that sounds a lot more healthy than the public spats, counter spats and pithy statements that have served as our lines of communication with the EFL for a while now. Sounds at least like both are keen to put this to bed with a pre-agreed approach and statement rather than have further public antipathy and appeals. Hopefully we can find something acceptable quickly and maybe, just maybe we can all move on... who knows...
48 hours then.. ?