Unsung NHS Heroes (potentially polical depending on how you read it)

[GboroRam]

1 hour ago, PistoldPete said:

Ok sorry it was possibly someone else who mentioned it. . More generally I think (as you said) that picking and choosing which procedures should be charged for is a minefield and I would prefer to keep to a principle that healthcare should be free at point of use (not free obviously). 

It's a difficult one, as it doesn't matter how everything is organised, clearly there's resources involved - and until we invent that starship enterprise thingy that magics up stuff, we will need to prioritise. But it isn't simple. 

For example should breast implanys be given on the NHS? 

[Archied]

8 hours ago, Wolfie said:

Who pays for all this private healthcare for employees?

Companies will protect their profits by making either consumers pay or shareholders pay, which means that we all pay in the end via higher prices or lower pension returns. 

Your final point is Very much so, I hadn’t really realised that a lot of these huge profit making companies are so linked into our pensions in terms of investment returns , it’s almost as if the house of cards is teetering 

[i-Ram]

2 hours ago, GboroRam said:

For example should breast implants be given on the NHS? 

I am prepared to accept a 1p in the £ tax increase by way of support.

[Rev]

Having read through the thread, not one person has addressed the biggest issue facing the NHS. 

Every pound spent on prevention of illness saves multiple pounds curing it.

Ban smoking, drinking, processed foods, takeaways, car and public transport journeys under 3 miles, unless you're disabled.

 

 

 

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

19 minutes ago, Rev said:

Having read through the thread, not one person has addressed the biggest issue facing the NHS. 

Every pound spent on prevention of illness saves multiple pounds curing it.

Ban smoking, drinking, processed foods, takeaways, car and public transport journeys under 3 miles, unless you're disabled.

 

 

 

I would imagine the revenue lost on that lot would be hugely more than they'd save .  That's why it won't happen. Life would be a bit boring as well without a few naughty options.

[Anag Ram]

7 hours ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

I would imagine the revenue lost on that lot would be hugely more than they'd save .  That's why it won't happen. Life would be a bit boring as well without a few naughty options.

 

7 hours ago, Rev said:

Having read through the thread, not one person has addressed the biggest issue facing the NHS. 

Every pound spent on prevention of illness saves multiple pounds curing it.

Ban smoking, drinking, processed foods, takeaways, car and public transport journeys under 3 miles, unless you're disabled.

 

 

 

One of the issues which makes the NHS unaffordable is its own success in keeping people living longer.

When it was formed, people tended to die by about 70, thanks often to a life spent smoking and working in poor conditions. 

Now modern medicine and working practice means we are all living longer, though not necessarily in good health.

There is far more money needed than can be funded by taxation.

[Stive Pesley]

1 hour ago, Anag Ram said:

There is far more money needed than can be funded by taxation.

A curiously absolute statement. 

We could as individuals on PAYE and NI pay more tax and I would be happy to

We could also close lots of tax loopholes and ensure that large corporations pay their fair share 

But then your point is that still might not be enough?

OK well welcome to modern monetary theory. We're at the point where it can't possibly be any worse than the teetering house of cards we have currently 

Edited February 19, 2023 by Stive Pesley

[ketteringram]

1 hour ago, Stive Pesley said:

A curiously absolute statement. 

We could as individuals on PAYE and NI pay more tax and I would be happy to

We could also close lots of tax loopholes and ensure that large corporations pay their fair share 

But then your point is that still might not be enough?

OK well welcome to modern monetary theory. We're at the point where it can't possibly be any worse than the teetering house of cards we have currently 

Isn't it all a house of cards though? The banking industry? The NHS?  Education? How's the property rental situation looking? Social care? 

Seems there isn't very much that isn't broken. ?

[Carl Sagan]

23 hours ago, bimmerman said:

I realised as I was typing what was going to inevitably happen

Following day, I was in MIU as one of my wounds was bleeding a lot, whilst I was waiting I was thinking what a service we get, we can turn up, get treated and leave again. How lucky are we to just have the random luck to be born here out of the other 6 billion people who would potentially not have access to healthcare/clean water/support if needed. Yes it's not perfect but we are so lucky to have what we have

I'm pleased you're having good treatment at no extra cost but what I don't understand is why you think that's unique to here?  Anywhere in the West outside of America would treat you without payment and likely better. Universal healthcare is the norm, not some weird exception. 

Of course it's not really "free" as taxpayers foot the bill, meaning it's a shame it's so inefficient. 

Edited February 19, 2023 by Carl Sagan

[sheeponacid]

21 hours ago, Stive Pesley said:

A curiously absolute statement. 

We could as individuals on PAYE and NI pay more tax and I would be happy to 

So why don’t you pay more money to the NHS if your happy to…what’s stopping you?

Ducks me off when I hear people say this, when we. all know that there are mechanisms that allow you to contribute more money to areas that you believe in should you wish to.

Personally I don’t want to pay more tax, as I am then allowed to concentrate my additional funding we’re I want it to go, which for me is helping to address biodiversity losses…& i do this regardless of whether you or others contribute to this area

So what really stop you from giving another 5% of your earnings to the NHS….i tell you what it’s is, it’s that deep rooted streak of capitalist ideology that runs right through you….you don’t want to pay it unless everyone else does…isn’t that right Jack

[Crewton]

21 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

I'm pleased you're having good treatment at no extra cost but what I don't understand is why you think that's unique to here?  Anywhere in the West outside of America would treat you without payment and likely better. Universal healthcare is the norm, not some weird exception. 

Of course it's not really "free" as taxpayers foot the bill, meaning it's a shame it's so inefficient. 

Many countries have fees for things like GP appointments and require you to have top-up health insurance (eg: France & Japan), some of which is refunded by the state, some by your insurer, but some not at all.

It's not quite as "clean" as you paint it.

Also, as a tourist, you almost certainly won't get treatment in many countries without coughing up first even though they're not supposed to do that.

[Stive Pesley]

30 minutes ago, sheeponacid said:

So why don’t you pay more money to the NHS if your happy to…what’s stopping you?

Ducks me off when I hear people say this, when we. all know that there are mechanisms that allow you to contribute more money to areas that you believe in should you wish to.

Personally I don’t want to pay more tax, as I am then allowed to concentrate my additional funding we’re I want it to go, which for me is helping to address biodiversity losses…& i do this regardless of whether you or others contribute to this area

So what really stop you from giving another 5% of your earnings to the NHS….i tell you what it’s is, it’s that deep rooted streak of capitalist ideology that runs right through you….you don’t want to pay it unless everyone else does…isn’t that right Jack

Woah - OK. Do you want to make any more assumptions about me? 

[Tamworthram]

3 hours ago, sheeponacid said:

So why don’t you pay more money to the NHS if your happy to…what’s stopping you?

Ducks me off when I hear people say this, when we. all know that there are mechanisms that allow you to contribute more money to areas that you believe in should you wish to.

Personally I don’t want to pay more tax, as I am then allowed to concentrate my additional funding we’re I want it to go, which for me is helping to address biodiversity losses…& i do this regardless of whether you or others contribute to this area

So what really stop you from giving another 5% of your earnings to the NHS….i tell you what it’s is, it’s that deep rooted streak of capitalist ideology that runs right through you….you don’t want to pay it unless everyone else does…isn’t that right Jack

Do you really think @Stive Pesley paying an extra 5% (despite his no doubt considerable income ?) is going to make any difference at all to the NHS even if he was joined by a number of like minded people?  Same with the extra funding you say you give to fund biodiversity. In relative isolation, it’s fairly meaningless. However, if we all paid an extra 1% (or even 0.5%) on our income tax it would be a considerable sum.

[sheeponacid]

3 hours ago, Stive Pesley said:

Woah - OK. Do you want to make any more assumptions about me? 

if your already paying additional funds to the NHS from out of your earnings, because your happy do so….then you have my upmost humble apologies

if your not then why aren’t you doing so???…..do you need to be forced by governments to give more…I read to often people going on about being happy to fund certain services / causes more….so serious question without the barbs, why aren’t they? ?

 

[sheeponacid]

1 hour ago, Tamworthram said:

Do you really think @Stive Pesley paying an extra 5% (despite his no doubt considerable income ?) is going to make any difference at all to the NHS even if he was joined by a number of like minded people?  Same with the extra funding you say you give to fund biodiversity. In relative isolation, it’s fairly meaningless. However, if we all paid an extra 1% (or even 0.5%) on our income tax it would be a considerable sum.

Good job everyone doesn’t think like you eh….otherwise all manner of charities, groups and organisations that do good  work, would be a lot worse off…

People need to support the things that  they believe in, at the levels that they are happy to do so now…they don’t need to wait for others….an alien concept I know

[Tamworthram]

26 minutes ago, sheeponacid said:

Good job everyone doesn’t think like you eh….otherwise all manner of charities, groups and organisations that do good  work, would be a lot worse off…

People need to support the things that  they believe in, at the levels that they are happy to do so now…they don’t need to wait for others….an alien concept I know

Not at all. You do know there is a place for supporting local and National charities/organisations voluntarily (I am actually a trustee of a charity near me so I know a bit about the financial challenges they face) as well as funding massive organisations such as the NHS through tax and National Insurance? I don’t know why you assume  I think otherwise (you do seem to have very quickly demonstrated an ability to make assumptions though) To expect the NHS shortfall to be funded through voluntary contributions is ludicrous.