Richard Keogh

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

37 minutes ago, Grumpy Git said:

And that succinctly tells you everything about the level we were at.

Not fit to tie Jagielka's or Curtis's laces.

Keogh was a good defender when we were competing for playoffs. I like Davies and Jagielka too but when we had Keogh and Tomori, that was also a partnership that worked well. Many international appearances for his country also. Jagielka has had a very good career, as has Davies but even if it is hyperbole, the quote not fit to lace their boots is weird. Keogh was player of the season remember and rightly so.

[Wolfie20]

4 hours ago, Turnstile said:

He was just absolute crap as a footballer.One of the least talented ever to wear a Derby shirt.I just don’t understand some fans love in with him.

This is absolute nonsense. 

[Grumpy Git]

I could be player of the season (even with my two left feet), in a season where we won the square root of SFA.

I can't remember Ireland winning much at the time he "starred" for them either?

Football is somewhat like acting and the civil service where awards are given for mediocrity.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Grumpy Git

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

7 minutes ago, Grumpy Git said:

I could be player of the season (even with my two left feet), in a season where we won the square root of SFA.

I can't remember Ireland winning much at the time he "starred" for them either?

Football is somewhat like acting and the civil service where awards are given for mediocrity.

Didn’t realise winning something defines being a good player or even a good team. Giggs starred for Wales, what have they won? I saw him play a lot of games to a high standard. He wasn’t mediocre and on the whole our team wasn’t either. He wouldn’t have been selected so often if he was a poor player. 

[May Contain Nuts]

Good defender when you put the best possible protection Infront of him. Awful defender when placed under any sort of sustained pressure. One of the he worst on-pitch leaders I've ever seen, captain chaos, it was all about his personality in the dressing room.

As the captain of a club/team often they're the first port of call for a new manager to get to know what his new squad is all about, it's a position of some influence (except when that appointment is someone hotheaded and stubborn like Pearson), it's not really a surprise successive managers made him captain.

Good passer but you can probably count on one hand the number of times his runs out of defence actually produced anything over the course of 6 years. Was it really worth the number of times he'd pass it straight to the opposition or back to his central defensive partner 30 yards back?

Much was made of his passing ability being vital to us playing good football but it was baalocks. The most vital aspect was having a good defensive midfielder which we had in Eustace & Thorne. Under Rowett Huddlestone (not really a good DM but a good passer) played (very deep) and his passing was key to our ability to break away, not Keogh who wasn't given that role and was bailed out defensively by Davies many times.

We've seen similar when Bielik was in last season, defenders like Wisdom who get criticised a lot were part of defences keeping multiple clean sheets.

Plenty of other teams have played good football with far more perfunctory centre backs. No other team (or very, very few) have made a CB bringing it 50 yards up the pitch a priority and for good reason.

There were a few times where people were unsuccessfully brought to 'replace' him but they were often judged against how they could perform the same (unceccesary) role as Keogh but not on their own.merits, not given time to adjust to the team or vice versa.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[bcnram]

I understand why he was well liked by many despite his fairly obvious flaws. Very grateful for the way he lost our 19 year old debutant by remaining stationery and flat footed, while Plange thought it a good idea to take a chance on a rebound.

[cannable]

12 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Good passer but you can probably count on one hand the number of times his runs out of defence actually produced anything over the course of 6 years. Was it really worth the number of times he'd pass it straight to the opposition or back to his central defensive partner 30 yards back?

Much was made of his passing ability being vital to us playing good football but it was baalocks. The most vital aspect was having a good defensive midfielder which we had in Eustace & Thorne. Under Rowett Huddlestone (not really a good DM but a good passer) played (very deep) and his passing was key to our ability to break away, not Keogh who wasn't given that role and was bailed out defensively by Davies many times.

Keogh was our main playmaker in that Rowett side. Huddlestone was the one who would find an out ball regularly but Keogh was the one who was injecting tempo into our play. Rowett himself summed it up quite well;
 

“His performances have been amazingly consistent, I don’t think that there is a better ball-playing centre-back in the division. The way that he carries the ball out of defence allows us to start attacks, we give him the license to do that.”

[May Contain Nuts]

9 minutes ago, cannable said:

Keogh was our main playmaker in that Rowett side. Huddlestone was the one who would find an out ball regularly but Keogh was the one who was injecting tempo into our play. Rowett himself summed it up quite well;
 

“His performances have been amazingly consistent, I don’t think that there is a better ball-playing centre-back in the division. The way that he carries the ball out of defence allows us to start attacks, we give him the license to do that.”

So you can count them on one and a half hands. Now find me the compilation of him passing straight to the opposition, the number of times he got turned inside out and tangled up by opposition and got dominated by physical opposition strikers.

Also fair play but how much value do you put in the comments of someone who's been dubbed 'the snake' ?

 

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[Jimbo Ram]

34 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

Didn’t realise winning something defines being a good player or even a good team. Giggs starred for Wales, what have they won? I saw him play a lot of games to a high standard. He wasn’t mediocre and on the whole our team wasn’t either. He wouldn’t have been selected so often if he was a poor player. 

George Best played for N Ireland too. 

[Jimbo Ram]

2 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

So you can count them on one and a half hands. Now find me the compilation of him passing straight to the opposition.

Also fair play but how much value do you put in the comments of someone who's been dubbed 'the snake' ?

Quite liked his pass to Marriott in the play offs at the Dirties, did you? 

[May Contain Nuts]

3 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Quite liked his pass to Marriott in the play offs at the Dirties, did you? 

Yes very much so.

I enjoyed Marriott's finish too, I assume he's now a top Championship striker?

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[Jimbo Ram]

3 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Yes very much so.

I enjoyed Marriott's finish too, I assume he's now a top Championship striker?

I think the problem here is that posters are angry with Keogh regarding his sacking and compensation claim, I don’t agree but understandable, but are taking out that anger on how they perceived his performances in a Rams shirt. The two are two completely different things. Be angry with him if you like but don’t disregard what he did for us on the pitch. He always had an error in him but always gave everything for the Rams and regularly put in 7/10 performances and on the whole was consistently good.

[May Contain Nuts]

11 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

I think the problem here is that posters are angry with Keogh regarding his sacking and compensation claim, I don’t agree but understandable, but are taking out that anger on how they perceived his performances in a Rams shirt. The two are two completely different things. Be angry with him if you like but don’t disregard what he did for us on the pitch. He always had an error in him but always gave everything for the Rams and regularly put in 7/10 performances and on the whole was consistently good.

Except when put under any real pressure when almost without exception he turned into a 3/10.

I liked him as a player in general, but he was made out to be far more important than he was. 

I wouldn't have wanted him for one second towards the end of last season or this, regardless of his passing and even at his peak.

We'd have been better off with a more perfunctory backline as many other had without sacrificing their attacking ability, as soon as the protection of having some of the best teams around him disappeared he reverted to Calamity Keogh.

The trade off really wasn't that beneficial.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

13 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

So you can count them on one and a half hands. Now find me the compilation of him passing straight to the opposition, the number of times he got turned inside out and tangled up by opposition and got dominated by physical opposition strikers.

Also fair play but how much value do you put in the comments of someone who's been dubbed 'the snake' ?

 

There should be a compilation of last gasp saves/ tackles he made. I remember commenting between him and Carson they saved us so many points at one point.

[May Contain Nuts]

5 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

There should be a compilation of last gasp saves/ tackles he made. I remember commenting between him and Carson they saved us so many points at one point.

Yes, often to cover his own mistakes.

Not that he was allowed to be held accountable for his mistakes, but that's part of the topic I'm not posting any more about!

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

4 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Yes, often to cover his own mistakes.

Not that he was allowed to be held accountable for his mistakes, but that's part of the topic I'm not posting any more about!

Nah. Disagree. And so do all Derby managers it seems. Maybe he’s a scapegoat for Wembley. Derby fans love a scapegoat. 

[May Contain Nuts]

6 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

Nah. Disagree. And so do all Derby managers it seems. Maybe he’s a scapegoat for Wembley. Derby fans love a scapegoat. 

He's not a scapegoat. He's the anti-scapegoat.

Countless errors excused away and blamed on someone else. Many people pointing out his errors getting jumped on as soon as there's a hint that he's being blamed for something.

If he were an animal he'd be on the protected species list 

Football managers generally don't upset the status quo when they take over and rely on long serving players to give them the low down.

Nothing to do with Wembley, nothing to do with his payoff.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[Jimbo Ram]

53 minutes ago, bcnram said:

I understand why he was well liked by many despite his fairly obvious flaws. Very grateful for the way he lost our 19 year old debutant by remaining stationery and flat footed, while Plange thought it a good idea to take a chance on a rebound.

He’s not the player now he was prior to the injury is he ?

[May Contain Nuts]

4 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

He’s not the player now he was prior to the injury is he ?

Defensively he is, he just gets exposed more now.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

4 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

He's not a scapegoat. He's the anti-scapegoat.

Countless errors excused away and blamed on someone else. Many people pointing out his errors getting jumped on as soon as there's a hint that he's being blamed for something.

If he were an animal he'd be on the protected species list 

Football managers generally don't upset the status quo when they take over and rely on long serving players to give them the low down.

This football manager opinion is strange. Managers will pick the best players and often long serving players are dependable. Keogh was often our best defender so he was picked. And more than often reliable. Pointing out errors is fine, just strange when other players seemed to get a free pass and players are constantly targeted because fans become fixated against them.