May Contain Nuts Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said: This football manager opinion is strange. Managers will pick the best players and often long serving players are dependable. Keogh was often our best defender so he was picked. And more than often reliable. Pointing out errors is fine, just strange when other players seemed to get a free pass and players are constantly targeted because fans become fixated against them. Tell that to the gang who rounded on anyone who pointed out Keogh's errors. Sometimes people would defend him before someone else had even had the chance to criticise him! To this day Wembley gets brought up far more by people defending him for it than anyone criticising him for it. If we're talking about free passes, he certainly got one on many occasions. Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 4 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said: Defensively he is, he just gets exposed more now. You are being silly now…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheresOnlyWanChope Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 Just now, Coconut's Beard said: Tell that to the gang who rounded on anyone who pointed out Keogh's errors. Don’t know. We had a good side a few years ago and Keogh played his part. But for me I’ve seen fans turning on own players - Shouts of Camara get him off after 5 minutes, Ironic cheers for Roos catching a ball and a fan constantly moaning about Keogh every match. These fans are annoying Jimbo Ram, Tamworthram, Miggins and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said: Don’t know. We had a good side a few years ago and Keogh played his part. But for me I’ve seen fans turning on own players - Shouts of Camara get him off after 5 minutes, Ironic cheers for Roos catching a ball and a fan constantly moaning about Keogh every match. These fans are annoying I agree wholeheartedly TheresOnlyWanChope 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 (edited) Anyway last night was my last post on the matter of his personality, that was my last post about him as a player. Hopefully he never darkens our doors again, it's all in the past now. Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Key Club King Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 27 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said: Except when put under any real pressure when almost without exception he turned into a 3/10. I liked him as a player in general, but he was made out to be far more important than he was. I wouldn't have wanted him for one second towards the end of last season or this, regardless of his passing and even at his peak. We'd have been better off with a more perfunctory backline as many other had without sacrificing their attacking ability, as soon as the protection of having some of the best teams around him disappeared he reverted to Calamity Keogh. The trade off really wasn't that beneficial. I understand that everyone has varying opinions on players and most of us fans don't really know what we are talking about, so I tend to go with manager's opinions. All the managers whilst Keogh was at Derby had him as first choice centre-half and often as captain too. We were a pretty good and very well funded (over-funded as it turned out) team during this period. I personally thought Keogh was a high-level Championship player but can see why others would put him below this level to some extent. However, "Calamity Keogh" and 3/10 every time he was put "under any real pressure" is revisionist character assassination nonsense and totally underserved. If he was as poor as you say why would he be picked ahead of Davies "who bailed him out many times"? I assume 8 successive managers just didn't have the vision you have to spot such an awful player in plain sight. GangwayD, Jimbo Ram and kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said: Defensively he is, he just gets exposed more now. Well if he's not the player he was prior to his self-inflicted injury maybe we're due some money back? Edited December 12, 2021 by RoyMac5 angieram 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Contain Nuts Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, The Key Club King said: I understand that everyone has varying opinions on players and most of us fans don't really know what we are talking about, so I tend to go with manager's opinions. All the managers whilst Keogh was at Derby had him as first choice centre-half and often as captain too. We were a pretty good and very well funded (over-funded as it turned out) team during this period. I personally thought Keogh was a high-level Championship player but can see why others would put him below this level to some extent. However, "Calamity Keogh" and 3/10 every time he was put "under any real pressure" is revisionist character assassination nonsense and totally underserved. If he was as poor as you say why would he be picked ahead of Davies "who bailed him out many times"? I assume 8 successive managers just didn't have the vision you have to spot such an awful player in plain sight. This isn't a further post about Keogh as a player or person. I've answered your questions with previous posts about the role of captain and how many new managers approach their new job. Whether you agree or not is up to you, no problems if you don't, honestly. The status quo is usually adhered to, and when it isn't you get reports of players running to the chairman complaining. Player power and a direct line to the chairman has been noted as an issue at Derby throughout that 2013-2017 period. The most influential player in the dressing room is likely to be the long standing captain, there are benefits to this and there are pitfalls. Edited December 12, 2021 by Coconut's Beard The Key Club King 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philmycock Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 2 hours ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said: Don’t know. We had a good side a few years ago and Keogh played his part. But for me I’ve seen fans turning on own players - Shouts of Camara get him off after 5 minutes, Ironic cheers for Roos catching a ball and a fan constantly moaning about Keogh every match. These fans are annoying Thankfully these are the fans that can't be arsed to go at the minute Kathcairns and Tamworthram 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBRammette Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 Please can we move on. Shouldnt this be under ex-rams? If not surely we need a Chris Martin thread - its been ages! Tyler Durden, Tamworthram, angieram and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toddisgod Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 3 hours ago, Coconut's Beard said: Good defender when you put the best possible protection Infront of him. Awful defender when placed under any sort of sustained pressure. One of the he worst on-pitch leaders I've ever seen, captain chaos, it was all about his personality in the dressing room. As the captain of a club/team often they're the first port of call for a new manager to get to know what his new squad is all about, it's a position of some influence (except when that appointment is someone hotheaded and stubborn like Pearson), it's not really a surprise successive managers made him captain. Good passer but you can probably count on one hand the number of times his runs out of defence actually produced anything over the course of 6 years. Was it really worth the number of times he'd pass it straight to the opposition or back to his central defensive partner 30 yards back? Much was made of his passing ability being vital to us playing good football but it was baalocks. The most vital aspect was having a good defensive midfielder which we had in Eustace & Thorne. Under Rowett Huddlestone (not really a good DM but a good passer) played (very deep) and his passing was key to our ability to break away, not Keogh who wasn't given that role and was bailed out defensively by Davies many times. We've seen similar when Bielik was in last season, defenders like Wisdom who get criticised a lot were part of defences keeping multiple clean sheets. Plenty of other teams have played good football with far more perfunctory centre backs. No other team (or very, very few) have made a CB bringing it 50 yards up the pitch a priority and for good reason. There were a few times where people were unsuccessfully brought to 'replace' him but they were often judged against how they could perform the same (unceccesary) role as Keogh but not on their own.merits, not given time to adjust to the team or vice versa. Nigel Pearson wanted shut of him and identified him as a huge disruptive influence with the changing room clique he’d created. Keoghs relationship at that time with MM put pay to that going no further. Bog standard Championship centre half and I’m looking forward to receiving the DVD at Xmas of his 100 best solid challenges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 (edited) On 12/12/2021 at 20:57, CBRammette said: Please can we move on. Shouldnt this be under ex-rams? If not surely we need a Chris Martin thread - its been ages! I think it was in here because of the relevance to Saturday's match, as the OP was about how people would react to his return. But you're right, all this general stuff should be in the ex-Rams section. Edited December 17, 2021 by angieram Grammar CBRammette, Kathcairns, Carl Sagan and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts