Derby finally accept 21 point deduction.

[Curtains]

3 minutes ago, Norman said:

Nah, I'm not having this. 

We were told we were right on the line after most of the extravagant spending. Every penny counted. 

Derby fans did not encourage gambling, did not encourage spending what Mel could not afford or have the details on wages and fees paid. There is no blame on Derby fans for that. 

This 100 percent.  
Derby Fans have no blame whatsoever.

The men at the helm are to blame no question plus EFL intransigence 

[Ghost of Clough]

1 minute ago, Woodley Ram said:

@Ghost of Clough you seem to be good at looking at accounts, have you ever thought of looking at say Reading and Stokes for a comparison?

I've looked at every Championship team tbh... Both of those teams have bent the rules.

Reading - sold stadium and loaned Aluko out to owner's Chinese club for an over inflated amount.. meaning they narrowly avoided a P&S overspend up to 2019. It'll be roughly £32m overspent for the 2020 period. I think there's some other dodgy stuff but can't remember what off the top of my head.

Stoke - Something like a £20m covid impairment on players (meaning they can slash the amortisation charges. Conveniently this was exactly what they needed to stay within P&S limits.

I expect more dodgy transactions from those clubs in the 20/21 accounts.

[Anon]

Just now, Norman said:

Nah, I'm not having this. 

We were told we were right on the line after most of the extravagant spending. Every penny counted. 

Derby fans did not encourage gambling, did not encourage spending what Mel could not afford or have the details on wages and fees paid. There is no blame on Derby fans for that. 

Some fans did, some fans didn't. Attendances were dropping under GSE because people were unhappy with the perceived lack of ambition. Clough's tenure still gets slated by many on here because we spent within our means and repeatedly finished mid table. I'm not saying this absolves Mel of responsibility. If all chairmen let themselves be subject to the whims of fans then every club would be in severe financial difficulty. I am saying it should be recognized that a significant proportion of Derby fans did want increased spending and didn't really care to think about the potential consequences.

[Curtains]

Just now, Anon said:

Some fans did, some fans didn't. Attendances were dropping under GSE because people were unhappy with the perceived lack of ambition. Clough's tenure still gets slated by many on here because we spent within our means and repeatedly finished mid table. I'm not saying this absolves Mel of responsibility. If all chairmen let themselves be subject to the whims of fans then every club would be in severe financial difficulty. I am saying it should be recognized that a significant proportion of Derby fans did want increased spending and didn't really care to think about the potential consequences.

If you are told to put your hand in a fire do yo do it .

No you don’t. 

[Mucker1884]

16 hours ago, Oldben said:

I wonder if it's worth dumping a truck load of manure at efl hq

 

6 hours ago, Archie said:

I'd happily chip in for this. 

That's very kind of you, @Archie, and very much appreciated.

 

Now, if you could also find your way to making a monetary donation... 

[May Contain Nuts]

4 minutes ago, Curtains said:

The men at the helm are to blame no question plus EFL intransigence 

Oooh get you and your fancy words! ?

Edited November 11, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[Anon]

2 minutes ago, Curtains said:

If you are told to put your hand in a fire do yo do it .

No you don’t. 

I fell like my post already addressed this, but to stick with your analogy, I agree you shouldn't put your hand in a fire because you're told to, but people who go around demanding others put their hands in fires are also quite daft.

[alram]

31 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Do you have nightmares concerning DCFC/MM?

It was no "pathetic excuse for him" it was an analogy which means..."a comparison between one thing and another, typically for the purpose of explanation or clarification"

Your angst is pretty alarming fella...unless you're one of the unfortunate ones who lost their job through DCFCs Administration.

 

Why would you not be annoyed about an individual that has completely destroyed the club? The lack of accountability morris has faced throughout this has been the alarming thing. 

[Curtains]

Just now, Anon said:

I fell like my post already addressed this, but to stick with your analogy, I agree you shouldn't put your hand in a fire because you're told to, but people who go around demanding others put their hands in fires are also quite daft.

I think that’s not right to be honest. 
 

We were constantly told the club was adhering to FFP and they were taking it very seriously and they weren’t overspending.

 

[alram]

12 minutes ago, Norman said:

Nah, I'm not having this. 

We were told we were right on the line after most of the extravagant spending. Every penny counted. 

Derby fans did not encourage gambling, did not encourage spending what Mel could not afford or have the details on wages and fees paid. There is no blame on Derby fans for that. 

No Derby fan would be encouraging anything that would put us in this situtation, not ONE.

We encouraged it because we trusted the man behind it to put the money up if it goes tits up, but he didnt, he did a runner and made us all look like complete idiots

[Norman]

10 minutes ago, Anon said:

Some fans did, some fans didn't. Attendances were dropping under GSE because people were unhappy with the perceived lack of ambition. Clough's tenure still gets slated by many on here because we spent within our means and repeatedly finished mid table. I'm not saying this absolves Mel of responsibility. If all chairmen let themselves be subject to the whims of fans then every club would be in severe financial difficulty. I am saying it should be recognized that a significant proportion of Derby fans did want increased spending and didn't really care to think about the potential consequences.

Increased spending is different to the claim of gambling the club's future away. Especially as we were told we were fine. Close, but fine. 

Don't disagree with you on the rest.

If at a supporter's meeting, Mel said we were ducked on FFP, he'd have to sell the stadium to himself etc if the levels of spending continued, we would all have told him to stop spending. Not gamble it all again. 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Norman

[alram]

46 minutes ago, Eddie said:

He gambled - with the encouragement of many Derby fans (see transfer threads passim).

The numbers didn't come up. Like many gamblers, he went 'double or quits' on several occasions, and everything spun out of control, so then you end up robbing Peter to pay Paul. Unfortunately, when Peter works for HMRC, you're buggered.

For me the notion that mel is a gambler analogy doesn't work for me. mel didn't bet his entire fortune, he bet a small chunk of money and took a risk with it, but when you are risking an insitution you should be willing to cover your losses. 

[Ram-Alf]

3 minutes ago, alram said:

Why would you not be annoyed about an individual that has completely destroyed the club? The lack of accountability morris has faced throughout this has been the alarming thing. 

Why would I. I'm too long in the tooth to be upset by all the Worlds troubles, Derbys are small fry compared, I'm a lucky fella, Seen all the trophy wins from the late 60s onwards, Seen a fare bit of crap too, I understand your anger and others too, Myself, If MM brings a book out in later life and says this was his dastardly plan then I might go ?, Until then i'll share out my empathey.

[Anon]

6 minutes ago, Curtains said:

I think that’s not right to be honest. 
 

We were constantly told the club was adhering to FFP and they were taking it very seriously and they weren’t overspending.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Norman said:

Increased spending is different to the claim of gambling the club's future away. Especially as we were told we were fine. Close, but fine. 

Don't disagree with you on the rest.

If at a supporter's meeting, Mel said we were ducked on FFP, he'd have to sell the stadium to himself etc if the levels of spending continued, we would all have told him to stop spending. Not gamble it all again. 

These are fair points. I agree that a large number of fans would've encouraged Mel to rein in the finances if he'd been more transparent. I will point out, however, that GSE's budget justification to avoid spending was met with a good degree of scepticism from fans. It's much easier to believe a lie when it's what you want to hear.

[Kathcairns]

15 minutes ago, Curtains said:

If you are told to put your hand in a fire do yo do it .

No you don’t. 

You could use that saying for eveything in life, so dos'nt really wash.

[Comrade 86]

1 hour ago, alram said:

I cannot believe people continue to defend mel morris, it really is unbelievable to me.

Surprised you've not said as much before 

[Dan_Ram]

Nixon seems confident that Reading will be getting -9 and both their punishment and ours could be announced at the same time. 
 

Completely disregarding the fact that it has taken 2 years to decide our punishment (of which we have been punished via embargo the whole time) compared with 2 minutes for Reading, surely the EFL have to release the exact overspend for each team to confirm they are both at the same level. If there is no transparency provided then we need to be breaking doors down, freedom of information requests, whatever can be done to reveal the detail behind the decision.

[Kathcairns]

6 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Why would I. I'm too long in the tooth to be upset by all the Worlds troubles, Derbys are small fry compared, I'm a lucky fella, Seen all the trophy wins from the late 60s onwards, Seen a fare bit of crap too, I understand your anger and others too, Myself, If MM brings a book out in later life and says this was his dastardly plan then I might go ?, Until then i'll share out my empathey.

Same here i was lucky enough to be around in the late sixties.

[RadioactiveWaste]

The responsibility is Mel Morris' and his alone. Covid afected all organisations, that's a fact. That does not mean Mel is not responsible for the business he owned. That I never really bought the "covid cause the administration" line - with fans back in grounds, costs much reduced and things starting to recver across all sectors it's a bit of a stretch that it was at this point things had to end. That it coincided with Mel wanting out of paying for losses and realising he wasn't going to get the sale he wanted, he decided on this course of action.

All the other factors are subserviant to that.

As for anyone saying "fans expectations" or "fans were happy he spent the money" that's just BS. Fans aren't responsible for the good governance of a business turning over tens of millions of pounds a year.

 

[Comrade 86]

1 hour ago, alram said:

Why would any Derby fan have empathy or any kind of positive feelings for Mel Morris? he has burnt the club to the ground!

Well continue ranting away at other posters like a ducking loon then matey, for all the good it'll do.