Derby County v Blackburn Rovers

[GenBr]

38 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

We just lost 4-0 at home to Blackburn.

Not Brentford. Not Leeds. Not WBA. Not Fulham.

What do you expect?

Not sure what point you are trying to make here? Why is Blackburn any less of a challenge than the other teams you mentioned. Before last year you could have said the same about Brentford and before Bielsa the same about Leeds. We don't have a god given right to beat any team and this early we have no idea who the top teams in the division will be.

[EtoileSportiveDeDerby]

44 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

He needs to have a look at himself. He might beWayne Rooney but he needs to earn his keep. 

Exactly my point Rooney the coach drops his namesake in midfield and put Holmes or Shinnie in

[Turnstile]

40 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

Mumble mumble it happens in football and louie was to static mumble mumble scouse

Louie was to static.Ffs pot calling kettle there.rooney had a sign on him .Diversion this way. F... me.He sounded just like that other illiterate Agnes brown we sacked.

[Andicis]

1 hour ago, Millenniumram said:

FWIW I think the criticism of Te Weirik is incredibly harsh. He as poor, but even so, I would argue he was probably the best player in the back 4 today. Wisdom, for example, was far far worse. In fact, he put in one of the worst performances I’ve seen since Cyrus Christie at Fulham a few years back. But for some reason Mike is the scapegoat. I think he looks a good footballing centre half who will probably do well when partnered with someone better in the air, ie Matt Clarke. Wisdom and Te Weirik is a partnership that should never be seen again. With a manager who has some idea how to organise a defence, I think he’ll be ok.

Nah. We clearly didn't watch the same game. He passed it to the opposition in our box several times, tried his hardest to assist them with an awful sliding tackle at the end, couldn't pass, was poor in the air, got bullied by the striker, don't think I saw him successfully tackle an opposition player, he pretty much only fouled them, and his clearances often just went into the danger zone. Te Wierik shouldn't be seen again for Derby, keep it to Wisdom and Clarke. I'd rather see Solomon start than Te Wierik. Gash. 

[Andicis]

52 minutes ago, S8TY said:

I'll remind you.....debut was briliant against huddersfield i think it was then had a few indifferent games ending with him being dropped i think......it happened! people wrote him off...he came good and he was stepping up from league1 MTW has never played in England.....once you get into someone you never change your mind so no point  really ...think what you will pal 

Clarke never ever looked as lost as Te Wierik did today. Not ever. 

[Pearl Ram]

52 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

He's certainly made it look the hardest. 

? Harsh Roy, harsh.

[Tyler Durden]

I don't buy this stuff justifying MTWs performances as he's never played in the Championship before. Take it defenders don't kick/head the ball or make tackles then in the Eredivisie. Explains it all. 

[Andicis]

Just now, Tyler Durden said:

I don't buy this stuff justifying MTWs performances as he's never played in the Championship before. Take it defenders don't kick/head the ball or make tackles then in the Eredivisie. Explains it all. 

Clearly not, it's entirely different playing in a back four in the Netherlands and it's unfathomable for Te Wierik to do the basics of defending in his first 10 games in England, we need to give him 3 years to get up to speed. 

[S8TY]

6 minutes ago, Andicis said:

Clarke never ever looked as lost as Te Wierik did today. Not ever. 

I do get what you're saying I'm just saying give him time I'm not saying he'll get better I'm just hoping its because he needs to get up to speed...the dutch league is very different to the championship there is no excuse for Wisdom though....

[Andicis]

1 minute ago, S8TY said:

I do get what you're saying I'm just saying give him time I'm not saying he'll get better I'm just hoping its because he needs to get up to speed...the dutch league is very different to the championship there is no excuse for Wisdom though....

He didn't get the basics right. It's nothing to do with the leagues issue, the fundamentals of football are the same. 

[Dean Saunder’s hat trick]

13 minutes ago, Jayram said:

I hope not Dean. I would love things to turn around and see us ‘click’ under Cocu but having seen us at Brentford and Reading last season I really couldn’t see what he was trying to achieve then and it stills feels the same now. 

It’s what we all want at the end of the day isn’t it. I just want to see Cocu’s spell judged on him having his transfer business done and all his preferred starters fit if possible. That’s not going to be possible until mid - end of October at this rate. Assuming he gets in who he wants and we don’t have more injuries, realistically it’s going be early November before we really see what the team can do. 
Like I posted earlier, we just really need to find a way of getting some scruffy points on the board between now and then so we don’t fall too far behind. 

[Millenniumram]

4 minutes ago, Andicis said:

Nah. We clearly didn't watch the same game. He passed it to the opposition in our box several times, tried his hardest to assist them with an awful sliding tackle at the end, couldn't pass, was poor in the air, got bullied by the striker, don't think I saw him successfully tackle an opposition player, he pretty much only fouled them, and his clearances often just went into the danger zone. Te Wierik shouldn't be seen again for Derby, keep it to Wisdom and Clarke. I'd rather see Solomon start than Te Wierik. Gash. 

Clearly we are, I didn’t really see any of that, apart from the strength problem. Stats have him down as having the best past success in our backline, and he won more headers than anyone else in the team. Also made the most clearances, the most intercerptions, and wasn’t dribbled past across the entire game.

Now I’m not saying he played well - it’s certainly true that he was bullied a bit by their striker, and his lack of strength is a concern to me. But I think, if played alongside Clarke instead of Wisdom, we can cover those deficiencies. I normally agree with a lot of what you post, but you seem to have blinkers on Te Weirik. I can see you haven’t rated him since his first performance. Fair enough if you don’t, but at least give fair criticism relative to the players around him - Wisdom was the far worse centre back today.

[S8TY]

2 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

I don't buy this stuff justifying MTWs performances as he's never played in the Championship before. Take it defenders don't kick/head the ball or make tackles then in the Eredivisie. Explains it all. 

It is different much slower ....Championship is very different he needs time but he was expected to be better straight away thats the problem....give him time then can judge more accurately

[angieram]

44 minutes ago, Dean Saunder’s hat trick said:

Changing the manager every time you’re going through a rough patch whilst trying to build a team is not the answer. 

Whilst I fully agree with this I also think that changing the defence every time you're going through a rough patch whilst trying to build a team is not the answer.

Cocu, I would appreciate some consistency there as the way you're chopping and changing is no way to build understanding.

[OoooMarkWright]

1 hour ago, Millenniumram said:

FWIW I think the criticism of Te Weirik is incredibly harsh. He as poor, but even so, I would argue he was probably the best player in the back 4 today. Wisdom, for example, was far far worse. In fact, he put in one of the worst performances I’ve seen since Cyrus Christie at Fulham a few years back. But for some reason Mike is the scapegoat. I think he looks a good footballing centre half who will probably do well when partnered with someone better in the air, ie Matt Clarke. Wisdom and Te Weirik is a partnership that should never be seen again. With a manager who has some idea how to organise a defence, I think he’ll be ok.

If his surname wasn’t Te Weirik would you think he was a good footballing centre half? 

Albeit he has only had 2 games, he looks anything but. Normally you can see glimpses of things to come from a player, I see nothing from him. Physically weak, got bullied by bloody Ben Bereton. He’s a poor mans Keogh. We’ve missed him badly. Happy to be proven wrong! Today was a car crash - excuse the pun. Only way is up after that absolute turd of a performance. 

[S8TY]

2 minutes ago, Andicis said:

He didn't get the basics right. It's nothing to do with the leagues issue, the fundamentals of football are the same. 

What he needs is to be put next to someone experienced in this league not Wisdom who's a RB I blame Cocu for this I can only think Clarke was not fully fit....even Wisdom looked better at CB next to an expereinced Cb last week when with Clarke

[Andicis]

Just now, Millenniumram said:

Clearly we are, I didn’t really see any of that, apart from the strength problem. Stats have him down as having the best past success in our backline, and he won more headers than anyone else in the team. Also made the most clearances, the most intercerptions, and wasn’t dribbled past across the entire game.

Now I’m not saying he played well - it’s certainly true that he was bullied a bit by their striker, and his lack of strength is a concern to me. But I think, if played alongside Clarke instead of Wisdom, we can cover those deficiencies. I normally agree with a lot of what you post, but you seem to have blinkers on Te Weirik. I can see you haven’t rated him since his first performance. Fair enough if you don’t, but at least give fair criticism relative to the players around him - Wisdom was the far worse centre back today.

Not biased on Te Wierik at all, I just don't get what he's good at. He's no great distributor, nor in the air, nor in the tackle, and I've now see him get bullied in every game he's played. Wisdom was at LCB which isn't his position, Buchanan is young, and Byrne was poor too. But Byrne was good going forward. 

[Millenniumram]

Just now, enachops said:

If his surname wasn’t Te Weirik would you think he was a good footballing centre half? 

Albeit he has only had 2 games, he looks anything but. Normally you can see glimpses of things to come from a player, I see nothing from him. Physically weak, got bullied by bloody Ben Bereton. He’s a poor mans Keogh. We’ve missed him badly. Happy to be proven wrong! Today was a car crash - excuse the pun. Only way is up after that absolute turd of a performance. 

Yes I would, it’s nothing to do with the fact he’s Dutch. If you know my thoughts on Cocu, you’ll know I don’t judge people by their footballing background. I can see something in Te Weirik. Time will tell if I’ll be proved right, but it has happened before. I remember when everyone was slaughtering Vydra after his first few games, I said he’d come good eventually. Worked out that one did.

[lrm14]

Just now, Andicis said:

Clearly not, it's entirely different playing in a back four in the Netherlands and it's unfathomable for Te Wierik to do the basics of defending in his first 10 games in England, we need to give him 3 years to get up to speed. 

We're all upset with how the game played out today but it's getting a bit weird how much you're laying into Te Wierik. Nobody reckons he's played particularly well in any of the games it's just we're not writing him off after 2 (3 as Preston are in our division) appearances in a notoriously difficult league to adapt to. I'm all for calls to drop him , they'd be reasonable after how he's started but to suggest 'get rid' after so few games is completely irrational.

[Dean Saunder’s hat trick]

2 minutes ago, angieram said:

Whilst I fully agree with this I also think that changing the defence every time you're going through a rough patch whilst trying to build a team is not the answer.

Cocu, I would appreciate some consistency there as the way you're chopping and changing is no way to build understanding.

Can’t say I don’t agree with you on that. I’m not quite sure what’s behind dropping Clarke today? The lack of settleD centre back pairing can’t be helping. Certainly can’t be helping te Wierik settle in. Agree, there needs to be time for a new centre back partnership to build a relationship with each other on the pitch.