Jump to content

Are we ready for possible promotion?

toddy

By toddy
in Derby County Forum

Recommended Posts

BBG83

BBG83

Posted
Posted

I'd like to think Lampard knows his way around the prem and what's required a bit more than Billy Davies - Plus he has something to prove (even if we go up) whilst Clough definitely rated himself as 'Brian Clough #2'.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 131
  • Created
  • Last Reply
toddy

toddy

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Just now, David said:

But that’s not realistic is it unless we manage to get a super agent on board. 

If that’s the type of promotion season you want we may as well give up now.

the right manager with the right quality places and then when you get into the prem you just add one or two more as you already have a settled side.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Day

Day

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, toddy said:

No, as they had to get a dozen players in..... but I think they were a better side last season in teh championship than we currently are.

Other than Wolves, can you name the clubs and which season (before any summer transfers) were in your mind ready for the Premier League? Just so I can see what kind of level your bar is set at.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BaaLocks

BaaLocks

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, toddy said:

No, as they had to get a dozen players in..... but I think they were a better side last season in teh championship than we currently are.

And Cardiff were a better team than Fulham yet they still have a chance of staying up while Fulham have been playing dead rubbers for weeks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Srg

Srg

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, David said:

Other than Wolves, can you name the clubs and which season (before any summer transfers) were in your mind ready for the Premier League? Just so I can see what kind of level your bar is set at.

Live pictures of Daveo being reeled in by Toddy

image.png.41da6cea0c42b407e95bdf9de4c9fca7.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites
LeedsCityRam

LeedsCityRam

Posted
Posted

I think the OP makes a valid point.

Lets be honest, there is no amount of money the PL could pay us to compensate us for a season as horrific as 2007-08. Although the personnel have changed entirely, its still with us, the fans.

There were some unique circumstances to 2007 that probably won't be repeated - firstly, a manager who was solely concerned with power games & secondly, a very anaemic approach to recruitment - which Davies' stand off with the board probably contributed to. I don't envisage that with Mel & Lampard at all.

That said, teams that survive in the Premiership tend to have a settled side with a couple of quality additions. As things stand, our midfield is disappearing in the summer, we're unsure on whether our first choice keeper will be staying & Tomori will also be going - we may be able to get the 3 loanees back next summer but that's out of our control. Selling teams will be aware of our situation should we go up so reinforcing the team will be very expensive.

I don't think we're ready, there's still significant changes needed to the squad and a more consistent pattern of play/performances before we consider ourselves too good for this division. That's not to say I won't be absolutely delighted if we win at Wembley but there will be a feeling of apprehension come August if we do.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
toddy

toddy

Posted
  • Author
Posted
5 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

And Cardiff were a better team than Fulham yet they still have a chance of staying up while Fulham have been playing dead rubbers for weeks.

You have to remember Cardiff have in a manager someone that knows what is required to get of a division with promotion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
GenBr

GenBr

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

Oft quoted model - my only issue with it is that I can't recall one team even getting anywhere near to executing on it. Can you?

West Brom and Villa might have been in the Prem for a while before they got relegated, but both are still in receipt of parachute payments and both are in with a good shout of going back up this year. If you go back a few years before they had their run of consecutive seasons in the Prem West Brom were almost constantly getting promoted and relegated from the Prem.

Boro also on parachute payments are still in the mix. Norwich only stopped receiving parachute payments this year and will now get them again when they come back down. - they got promoted in 10/11, relegated in 13/14, promoted in 14/15, relegated in 15/16 and now promoted again in 18/19.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
TigerTedd

TigerTedd

Posted
Posted

Hey, if the worst case scenario is that we get promoted, that’s nothing to moan about really is it. 

Best case scenario, we lose in the play offs, get rid of the deadwood this summer (as was always the plan), go again with an even fresher looking team, and obliterate the league, going up as champions.

Getting in the play offs this season (if it happens) was always a bonus  once you’re there, anything can happen. Billy Davies had a 3 year plan, and almost accidentally got promoted in the first year. We could do the same now. But you don’t turn down promotion. Hopefully you learn from past mistakes, and make a better fist of it this time.

I’d live to go up as champions one day though. I’ve seen us go up in second, and through the play offs once. Maybe we crash out gloriously in the play offs this season, and go up as champions next.

PS all things considered though. If I could command the future and you gave me a choice of play offs this season, or champions next season, I think I’d still go for play offs this season. I don’t know if the likes of Keogh and Bryson could take another play off defeat. I would love to see Keezy lift that trophy at Wembley. I’d probably cry more than I did in Endgame. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mucker1884

Mucker1884

Posted
Posted
38 minutes ago, GenBr said:

Go up, don't spend any money, get 12 points this time, win £100 mill for finishing bottom, get another £40 + mill in parachute payments, build a stronger team, this time go up as champions and then win the Prem. 

We would likely stuggle even if we did spend all our money trying to build a new team. If we did go up I'd try and save the money to build a stronger side for the Championship (even if it measn we have to yoyo for a few seasons) and not financially ruin the club like Sunderland have done.

 

10 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

Oft quoted model - my only issue with it is that I can't recall one team even getting anywhere near to executing on it. Can you?

Fester?  2 x Play Off wins mid 90's.  Promoted as runners up 02/03.  Winners 13/14.  Even managed a League one win in 08/09, so a fair bit of yo-yo-ing there in a 20 year span.  I make that an average of a promotion or relegation every 2 years... although admittedly one of each was in the wrong direction (To and from League One!), so even ignoring that, and concentrating on Championship/Prem, It's still a promotion or relegation every 2.5 years. 

In a similar period, Palace managed 1 x Championship win, and 3 PO Wins.

Remember, you've got to come back down, to go up again!

 

OK, maybe not the greatest ever post in "putting someone right", and as you rightly say, no team has perfected the Yo-Yo model, but these two seem to be now settling rather nicely with the big boys, so at least give us something to aim for (I won't mention the obvious, as that's probably a dream too far, even for the happiest of clappers amongst us)!

 

Nearly needed an edit... Ooh... Ooh... Wet Spam also... 4 promotions in 22 years between 1990 and 2012.  They've been up there for the last 7 years now!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
hintonsboots

hintonsboots

Posted
Posted
57 minutes ago, EssendonRam said:

I died in 2007. Was dead for 45 minutes apparently. Then comatose for over a month.

Awoke on the Thursday before the Saturday home match against the then 19th placed West Ham...The nurses reluctantly let me wander around the hospital at midnight on the Saturday night trying to get reception.

So, yeah, I remember...and, even when I was dead or in a coma, I had more life in me than our season ?.

But, as others have said, you take promotion whenever you can.

Fulham are the wrong comparison to make. Others have been promoted in a worse position than us and survived. They’re the precedent we follow.

If we get to the final can you stand on the goal line? 

images.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Mucker1884

Mucker1884

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, hintonsboots said:

If we get to the final can you stand on the goal line? 

images.jpeg

Ah!  So that's who floored Bamford the other day!  Clever!  Pick another one* for Sunday!  

 

*Whoever Leeds' biggest threat is... I've no idea, as I dunna watch 'em!  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
i-Ram

i-Ram

Posted
Posted
59 minutes ago, toddy said:

No, as they had to get a dozen players in..... but I think they were a better side last season in teh championship than we currently are.

The above response was to David who asked: Did you think Fulham were ready for the Premier League last year? (Before the summer)

I know a good few Fulham fans, all of whom would tell you that they made an absolute pigs ear of recruitment once they got up. They would have been better off sticking with what they had, rather than buying/loaning some of the expensive tat they assembled. Completely ruined a good vibe at that club.  A number of decent players were never given the proper opportunity to be rewarded for their promotion achievements.

If we go up, there are a number of players who already must know that they will not be with us next season (irrespective of League). I would have thought 3 or 4 decent signings, and a couple of loans, added to what we have would give us a fighting chance of finishing 17th or better.

For now though, let’s just worry about Swansea shall we?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ramarena

Ramarena

Posted
Posted

Actually the team we currently have would probably suit the Prem better than it suits the Championship, we have a team who have plenty of technical ability which would help them greatly in the Prem (as we have seen with some of our performances in the cups this season- we haven’t looked out of place), but we lack some of the grit, aggression, leadership and determination that you need to finish at the top of the champ

Are we ready? Probably not........few teams ever are. However, do we have a squad capable of making the transition? Yes I think we do if we can hold onto the loaneees and make some quality acquisitions.

There is nothing to fear by being promoted this season! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Day

Day

Posted
Posted

You would need to look more in depth into how many players featured, but I wanted to look at promotion, number of signings made and the outcome in their first season in the Premier League over the last 5 seasons.

4 out of the 5 seasons the club(s) that signed the most players stayed up. 

Newcastle 10th, Crystal Palace 11th and Watford 13th are the 3 best first seasons in the Premier League after promotion, 2 of which signed over 20 players, the most players any out of any promoted clubs.

Crystal Palace who signed the most players did it with just £29m spent, the 23 signings included 6 free transfers and 3 loans, 2 of which were ex Derby players Cameron Jerome and Tom Ince. 2 of the players they paid money for were also ex Derby players Joe Ledley and Barry Bannan (ok he was a loanee)

As I say you would need to look deeper into the signings, how many minutes they played etc. but I'm guessing you will probably find that it's a myth that clubs who go up only make a couple of signings. You're looking around 14 players on average coming in, which Derby probably would need. The beauty of it is, we will have the space not to be concerned by outgoings, more I look at it, this is the perfect time for us to go up.

12/13
1st Cardiff, 14 players signed - Finished 20th, Relegated
2nd Hull, 14 players signed - Finished 16th, Survived
5th Crystal Palace, 23 players signed - Finished 11th, Survived

13/14
1st Leicester, 13 players signed - Finished 14th, Survived
2nd Burnley, 11 players signed - Finished 19th, Relegated
4th QPR, 12 players signed - Finished 20th, Relegated

14/15
1st Bournemouth, 17 players signed - Finished 16th, Survived
2nd Watford, 21 players signed - Finished 13th, Survived
3rd Norwich, 14 players signed - Finished 19th, Relegated

15/16
1st Burnley, 9 players signed - Finished 16th, Survived
2nd Boro, 14 players signed - Finished 19th, Relegated
4th Hull, 15 players signed - Finished 18th, Relegated

16/17
1st Newcastle, 9 players signed - Finished 10th, Survived
2nd Brighton, 15 players signed - Finished 15th, Survived
5th Huddersfield, 15 players signed - Finished 16th, Survived

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...