Declining attendances

[S8TY]

10 minutes ago, Newleaf said:

I’m not sticking the knife in he’s a man than can well look after himself. 

Its different perceptions.

We did play well at times I agree on the back of a poor performance at Rotherham.

Mason Bennett is the hero all of a sudden and Frank loves him .

Lets see down the line if he still feels the same about him and don’t get me wrong I want Mason to succeed.

He has  cast aside certain players like Vydra and Martin and Thorne and Butterfield and Anya etc for loanees and youth. etc etc 

Bogle is a revelation but where does that leave Wisdom  

Forsyth is back in the fold after he signed Malone .

Wilson on loan looks ok nothing more 

Are we allowed to discuss the fact he kept losing the ball and giving free kicks away as did Waghorn and why iNugent ahead of Marriott 

 

 

Mason is in on merit and if Frank doesn't feel the same about him in time then i guess his form would've dropped so yes he might get left out, Vydra needed to go to fund what our new manager wanted to do and what direction he wanted to take us in and is down to Frank,

Martin, Thorne Butters etc have not played well enough in Franks and Jodies opinion to warrant a place in the squad or do you want to tell Frank who to pick based on what exactly ??

Wisdom's form has dipped and Bogle has taken his chance and is exactly what we want to see , healthy competition for places the same can be said of the LB's Fozzy and Malone.

Wilson looks a good player to me although not in his first few games but looked bright when he came on last night and will score a few for us in my opinion so give him a chance hes just back from injury.

Nugent will always give you 100 per cent and is probably only in the team until marriott gets up to speed in the championship, Waghorn similarly will chip in with some goals this season but like most players will have to be on form to keep his place .

This is what we want surely??? competition for places with a younger squad using academy players trying to play some decent football.

As for Chelsea loanees I think they are both good players who will help us just like other loan players have helped other sides get promoted........

[The Key Club King]

3 hours ago, Boss said:

I can safely say for myself and a number of fans I know, it is ticket prices. Have had a season ticket for a number of years, including last year where I had to travel over 2 hours each way to make games. Now I have moved again for work and it is over 4 hours each way to make a game. However, I am often back mid-week due to travelling, and at weekends to see my partner and family. I would happily go to games when I can make them for around £20, but £27 to watch us at home against Brentford? £26 or whatever it was on a Tuesday against Ipswich and Blackburn? A group of 4 of us were looking to go on Saturday, but over £100 means it is a no.

Make tickets £15-£20 and you'll add on a couple of thousand fans each game. I've heard a number of owners suggest that ticket revenue doesn't make up that much of a clubs income now in comparison to TV money etc, so why not make the tickets cheaper and have more fans for a better atmosphere. Yes, of course you'll get the odd fans that'll groan because we're not scoring every 10 seconds, but I think we have many season ticket holders like that anyway.

Reality is, with more games being on TV, the club is pricing many fans out with costs like £27 to watch against Brentford at home.

Season ticket holders are an absolute priority as they make up over 80% of home ticket sales and turn up every week and tend to renew every year. If tickets were between £15 and £20 a game then this would punish the season ticket holders who pay more than this.

The TV money thing is for Premier League clubs as they get around £100-150m per year from TV revenue, whereas I think it is around £8m in the Championship. This leaves the unfortunate situation whereby top tier clubs can charge less for a higher quality game. When a team gets relegated they would likely put prices up to cover their TV revenue losses.

You obviously make a huge effort to get to games, and I agree that making them cheaper would attract a few more fans but not as many as you would think.

[Curtains]

22 minutes ago, Saity said:

Mason is in on merit and if Frank doesn't feel the same about him in time then i guess his form would've dropped so yes he might get left out, Vydra needed to go to fund what our new manager wanted to do and what direction he wanted to take us in and is down to Frank,

Martin, Thorne Butters etc have not played well enough in Franks and Jodies opinion to warrant a place in the squad or do you want to tell Frank who to pick based on what exactly ??

Wisdom's form has dipped and Bogle has taken his chance and is exactly what we want to see , healthy competition for places the same can be said of the LB's Fozzy and Malone.

Wilson looks a good player to me although not in his first few games but looked bright when he came on last night and will score a few for us in my opinion so give him a chance hes just back from injury.

Nugent will always give you 100 per cent and is probably only in the team until marriott gets up to speed in the championship, Waghorn similarly will chip in with some goals this season but like most players will have to be on form to keep his place .

This is what we want surely??? competition for places with a younger squad using academy players trying to play some decent football.

As for Chelsea loanees I think they are both good players who will help us just like other loan players have helped other sides get promoted........

Good post .

Frank will do what he wants when he wants end of. 

Supporters have no say. 

[Coneheadjohn]

It’s a combination of a lot of things.

We love nothing more than the live match but even if I leave Joel out of it there are a lot of factors which add up to make it just not worth the hassle.

I don’t think Derby as a club could do anything more to influence our decision.

I think the ticket prices are reasonable,I think we are treated well at the ground and the investment in the club is great.

It’s just changing.

 

[Curtains]

1 minute ago, coneheadjohn said:

It’s a combination of a lot of things.

We love nothing more than the live match but even if I leave Joel out of it there are a lot of factors which add up to make it just not worth the hassle.

I don’t think Derby as a club could do anything more to influence our decision.

I think the ticket prices are reasonable,I think we are treated well at the ground and the investment in the club is great.

It’s just changing.

 

Going to football can be a hassle.

There are times when you just want to say I’ll watch on TV .

I always go if I’m around Derby though which is 95 percent of the time and use my season ticket which I have had for ever it seems  .

Away days are quite frequent with me as well .

Affordability is definitely a factor for a vast majority of people .

How often do you here people say I don’t go anymore.

 

.

 

 

[Inglorius]

Too many seasons in the Championship taking its toll 

[jimbobram]

1 hour ago, Saity said:

Problem is Jimbo Football without fans attending is not good, make the tickets cheaper to get a few more in especially the shall we shan't we fans and the atmosphere will be better as Angieram has said if all tickets were 20 quid i think it would encourage more to go 27 seems a lot especially for some of the so called lesser teams 

 

1 hour ago, angieram said:

Well, we can't just give the seats away - we're only allowed to do that for a few games each season.

I think £20 is a benchmark that is acceptable for Championship Football and I very rarely get a ticket that low in price for away games.

I'm not disagreeing with your point. The more fans there the better. But 20 quid is still going to put people of who can watch it at home for free.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

Personally I think its just a case of same old same old! What I mean is that at the moment the real buzz isn't there because we (the team) have done it all before during the last few seasons (tried but failed). Football fever will only grip the town again when the casual supporter can taste & smell the arrogance of success...………..We aren't there yet this season but if we start winning a few on the trot optimism and excitement will rise...…………..Then so will  the attendances. 

[angieram]

3 minutes ago, jimbobram said:

 

I'm not disagreeing with your point. The more fans there the better. But 20 quid is still going to put people of who can watch it at home for free.

If they have a Sky subscription at around £50 a month!

But I know what you mean and for some it is genuine hardship.

For others I think it boils down to what is acceptable entertainment for them - I will always prefer to experience a game live over watching it on tv. When other factors kick in - like me not being able to get to Old Trafford next week because of work - I am more than grateful for the tv coverage.

For people who aren't too fussed either way then I'm not sure how much lower than £20 you'd have to go to tempt them. 

[sawley_ram]

1 hour ago, The Key Club King said:

Season ticket holders are an absolute priority as they make up over 80% of home ticket sales and turn up every week and tend to renew every year. If tickets were between £15 and £20 a game then this would punish the season ticket holders who pay more than this.

It's a difficult one. I have a half season ticket because I can't afford the full one and would struggle to make all of the away days. I am always at the home games though even if sometimes it means going on my own. Understandably I'd be annoyed if tickets were that cheap as we'd be overpaying, but then again the cost of the ticket means we can choose our seats.

In my group of friends alone there are genuinely a good 7-10 non-season ticket holders who would attend Derby games like the mid-week ones if the tickets were cheaper. It would put the figures up but pee off our 20k+ regular season ticket holders -- not sure that's a good price to pay.

As I said in my original post, I don't think we have anything to worry about with numbers. Our fan base is strong, yes there are games like Blackburn where we had a particularly low attendance but that is just a snapshot. Overall we always do very well on home attendance figures.

[archram]

You may say that £27 isn’t too bad. It’s not if it’s just you, but if there’s 2 of you and a couple of kids it’s still a lot, especially if you also have to travel. I’m not sure £20 would make a lot of difference mid-week but it might attract more on a Saturday?

I could be there last night and on Saturday as I can stay at my daughter’s. There’s no way I could do both if I had to pay £50 train fare both times. There must be a lot in a similar position. There’s so many calls on extra money these days that for families it’s difficult to prioritise football.

[Archied]

It’s a good topic and a question I raised in the match day thread regards the assertion by some last season that attendances were dropping because of rowettball which I didn’t believe was the case to any significant degree

[jimbobram]

26 minutes ago, angieram said:

If they have a Sky subscription at around £50 a month!

But I know what you mean and for some it is genuine hardship.

For others I think it boils down to what is acceptable entertainment for them - I will always prefer to experience a game live over watching it on tv. When other factors kick in - like me not being able to get to Old Trafford next week because of work - I am more than grateful for the tv coverage.

For people who aren't too fussed either way then I'm not sure how much lower than £20 you'd have to go to tempt them. 

Definitely the experience over watching it on tv. That's why we have ST. I think ticket prices as a whole need to come down now. They will hardly contribute to anything the club make anymore.  

[Seaside Sam]

6 hours ago, David said:

13/14 season is the yardstick that everything appears to be judged on these days, so thought I would take a look. McClaren arrived on the 30th September, these are the midweek home games that followed.

1st Oct - v Ipswich, 21,037
4th Dec - v Boro, 24,631
28th Jan - v Yeovil, 23,615
10th Feb - v QPR, 23,495
11th Mar - v Bolton, 23,435

Couple of things worth pointing out, we were bloody good that year, there was no RamsTV, no midweek flights to Prague, Spain or wherever you fancied. Also we had a different CEO at the time so these numbers may mean nothing if you know what I mean.

I would say that 23k v a bottom half team, regardless of streams or how we play is pretty much where we are and I can't see a decline.

Saturday's are a whole different story, but these will not be effected at all by Sky.

could it be that the football just ain't any good?

[Seaside Sam]

19 minutes ago, jimbobram said:

Definitely the experience over watching it on tv. That's why we have ST. I think ticket prices as a whole need to come down now. They will hardly contribute to anything the club make anymore.  

it's not just the ticket price its everything including the ticket price ,ie transport programme pie pint i know you don't have to buy those things but it all adds up ,long live the sky red button?

[Seaside Sam]

45 minutes ago, archram said:

You may say that £27 isn’t too bad. It’s not if it’s just you, but if there’s 2 of you and a couple of kids it’s still a lot, especially if you also have to travel. I’m not sure £20 would make a lot of difference mid-week but it might attract more on a Saturday?

I could be there last night and on Saturday as I can stay at my daughter’s. There’s no way I could do both if I had to pay £50 train fare both times. There must be a lot in a similar position. There’s so many calls on extra money these days that for families it’s difficult to prioritise football.

right on

[RebelScum]

So much of a clubs revenue is now generated by TV / subscription that they need to dramatically lower matchday prices to reflect this and generate more interest in actually going to the game.

[S8TY]

45 minutes ago, RebelScum said:

So much of a clubs revenue is now generated by TV / subscription that they need to dramatically lower matchday prices to reflect this and generate more interest in actually going to the game.

Agree, the day most fans stay at home and teams play in front of empty stadiums is the time football goes seriously in the wrong direction, going to a game as a kid in london usually  to West Ham with my dad I will never forget and gave me the football bug !!! 

[jimbo jones]

7 hours ago, David said:

13/14 season is the yardstick that everything appears to be judged on these days, so thought I would take a look. McClaren arrived on the 30th September, these are the midweek home games that followed.

1st Oct - v Ipswich, 21,037
4th Dec - v Boro, 24,631
28th Jan - v Yeovil, 23,615
10th Feb - v QPR, 23,495
11th Mar - v Bolton, 23,435

Couple of things worth pointing out, we were bloody good that year, there was no RamsTV, no midweek flights to Prague, Spain or wherever you fancied. Also we had a different CEO at the time so these numbers may mean nothing if you know what I mean.

I would say that 23k v a bottom half team, regardless of streams or how we play is pretty much where we are and I can't see a decline.

Saturday's are a whole different story, but these will not be effected at all by Sky.

Without taking the time to look it up (well done for doing that job ??) I’d have said 22-24,000 would be about right for midweek games in the second division against teams that don’t bring many away fans.

[rammieib]

1 hour ago, RebelScum said:

So much of a clubs revenue is now generated by TV / subscription that they need to dramatically lower matchday prices to reflect this and generate more interest in actually going to the game.

Not in the Championship. This is only true in the Premier League.

In the Championship, Gate revenue is still 40-50% of a clubs income stream so actually they need to maximise the amount of money they can generate and this becomes the priority over ticket prices.

Sure the club could choose 1 or 2 matches a year and make every ticket a tenner (i.e Like Cardiff last year) and then there will be 30,000 there. If you did that every weekday game, it would lose its effect although you may see attendances at the 26-28k mark.

I'd also say that £20 for a midweek game isn't a big difference from £25 and therefore you wouldn't see fans coming in. Why anyone would pay £33-35 for a West Stand seat for a home midweek game against Blackburn is beyond me as well.

I would love to see Derby take the option of prioritising numbers over revenue but I get they can't do this. However we will reach a saturation point whereby the product isn't worth a lot for the TV viewers. I wonder how many watched on the red button last night - 10-20,000 maybe? (Especially when its not HD and one camera only) but three TV trucks outside, I bet there was still a £10k fee for Sky to pay to broadcast it last night. I wouldn't be surprised to see Sky drop this initiative at the end of the season. I was really excited it by the idea as I thought it would be full TV coverage with multiple angles, replays, HD etc but one camera is really poor.