Mr Tibbs Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 46 minutes ago, LeedsCityRam said: In summary, some good memories but nothing more tangible than that. Like a rock band that breaks up early, his reputation is arguably enhanced by the sudden sackings. I daresay had he been here to pick up the morale of a shattered squad in 2015/16 or been tasked with promotion this season (even after how badly it was going last spring), some opinions on here would be very different. What's that actually based on though LCR? Just seems like a throw away comment to me. Good memories indeed but there was plenty of substance there too, which people seem to be forgetting. His reputation is based on one of the highest win percentages in Derby County Football Club's history, an exciting approach to winning matches (whether it happened on the day or not) and for dragging this club out of the coma it was in under NC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsCityRam Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 49 minutes ago, Mr Tibbs said: What's that actually based on though LCR? Just seems like a throw away comment to me. Good memories indeed but there was plenty of substance there too, which people seem to be forgetting. His reputation is based on one of the highest win percentages in Derby County Football Club's history, an exciting approach to winning matches (whether it happened on the day or not) and for dragging this club out of the coma it was in under NC. It's based on the situations Derby were in when he left, neither of them favourable. After the 14/15 collapse, how do you think he would have fared picking the squad back up in 15/16? Fan expectation was sky high then & a slow start could have heaped real pressure on him. Last spring he he looked exasperated with his squad & the results were increasingly poor. Again, a poor start this year may have led to fan pressure on him. Re his win %, it is the highest but Jim Smith doesn't even make our top 10 even though his reign was much more successful. It has to read in context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, LeedsCityRam said: It's based on the situations Derby were in when he left, neither of them favourable. After the 14/15 collapse, how do you think he would have fared picking the squad back up in 15/16? Fan expectation was sky high then & a slow start could have heaped real pressure on him. Last spring he he looked exasperated with his squad & the results were increasingly poor. Again, a poor start this year may have led to fan pressure on him. Re his win %, it is the highest but Jim Smith doesn't even make our top 10 even though his reign was much more successful. It has to read in context. Probably the same way he picked his team up after an even bigger mentally shattering experience at Wembley the season before? He proved he could do it, I see no reason why he wouldn't do it again. The players for his football were still there, it was that summer and our approach with manager and transfer market dealings that has hindered us most. His start was slow in 14/15, we never seem to set the world alight until the autumn comes it seems. He got us going though I see no reason why he couldn't do it again. Last spring he had a squad full of 3 differing managerial ideas in which he'd had zero summers to try and rectify. He took us from the bottom 3 to still being in with a shout of the play offs come his sacking, even despite the poor run. A run that was no poorer than we have seen this season under GR. It does still read in context though, surely. I'm not saying McClaren is better than TBE. Look at the seasons he's managed us, look as his time here in context. 3rd, 8th (missing out on the play offs by a whisker) and 10th after one of the worst starts in decades. (Still with a an unlikely shout at the play offs). I don't think anybody is saying he's the messiah, he was just pretty good here and deserves to be judged on what he actually did, not what we think may or may not have happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papahet Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 Anyone who can get to a play off final with Conor Sammon in the squad is a success in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1of4 Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 Wonderful first season, even with the disappoint of Wembley. Failed by not adding the right players to the team at the start of the following season, especially in defence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 His departure the first time did a lot of damage. His heart was not in the club at the end, his head had been turned by Newcastle and anyone who thinks otherwise is deluded. Whether that was the ultimate reason we collapsed - people will have their opinions, it was definitely a contributing factor - but at least an equally contributory factor was losing Martin and Eustace to injury. Until that point, from 13/14 and for the majority of 14/15 - best manager since Jim Smith. Best football, looked unbeatable, controlled matches. Most consistent period of football we had (better than the billy promotion and even more spectacular collapse). We didn’t have much of a plan B but we weren’t spending much cash at that time, needed a bit of luck and we didn’t get it. Other than Jim Smith era, I have never enjoyed being a Derby fan so much. However, the collapse was horrible. There were times in that run in where we had been found out and didn’t react. There had been signs (Boro away particularly), and the number of times we played well and lost or drew games in that run were too many to mention. Moral victories mean nothing and to be honest drive me insane! It wasn’t all good with McClaren, while Dawkins Christie Ibe on loan and Ince were good signings, Mascarell Albentosa Shotton and Best were highly questionable. Mascarell was obviously a huge talent, but wasn’t right for this division. Second time around - did well with a bad hand but the heavy away defeats towards the end of his tenure were alarming. The only transfer window he had, he signed Nugent who lets face it hasn’t really come off, and Julien De Sart - completely the wrong player for us, a poor version of Mascarell which leads me to question McClaren’s judgement of what is required in the championship. If McClaren had finished last season, I’m confident we’d have lost to Forest and finished lower than we did. We were only going one way. However he’d done a great job to even get us in the top half after the start we had and in my view deserved the chance to continue into this season. If he had, would we be in the playoffs? I honestly don’t know. Would we be playing good football? I’m not sure, we didn’t last season and he would’ve had the same problems Gary has faced in getting players out. Was he a failure....absolutely not and I will look back fondly to his first tenure, and to the Jim Smith era where there is no doubt that as assistant coach, McClaren had a huge influence and was a major driving force in our most successful era since the 80s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsCityRam Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 27 minutes ago, Mr Tibbs said: Probably the same way he picked his team up after an even bigger mentally shattering experience at Wembley the season before? He proved he could do it, I see no reason why he wouldn't do it again. The players for his football were still there, it was that summer and our approach with manager and transfer market dealings that has hindered us most. His start was slow in 14/15, we never seem to set the world alight until the autumn comes it seems. He got us going though I see no reason why he couldn't do it again. Last spring he had a squad full of 3 differing managerial ideas in which he'd had zero summers to try and rectify. He took us from the bottom 3 to still being in with a shout of the play offs come his sacking, even despite the poor run. A run that was no poorer than we have seen this season under GR. It does still read in context though, surely. I'm not saying McClaren is better than TBE. Look at the seasons he's managed us, look as his time here in context. 3rd, 8th (missing out on the play offs by a whisker) and 10th after one of the worst starts in decades. (Still with a an unlikely shout at the play offs). I don't think anybody is saying he's the messiah, he was just pretty good here and deserves to be judged on what he actually did, not what we think may or may not have happened. Different circumstances 13/14 to 14/15 though. The feeling after the playoff final was that of heroic losers & a real determination to go up the following year. Contrast that with the mood of the fanbase after losing 0-3 to Reading....top 2 most of the season, expecting promotion & then an horrendous run to finish 8th. No longer brave Wembley losers but 'bottlejobs'. Its fair to say confidence in McClaren would have been lower than the year before purely based on results. By the way, we're in absolute agreement that he was pretty good. I do think some on here go way beyond that assessment though & its that view I'm challenging. I also think the timing of his departures has contributed to this, hence my initial comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 7 hours ago, curtains said: That’s pathetic because no one moves on from slagging Rowett do they. Grow up ffs. I've credited him this very thread. If you're going to instigate debate try reading the responses instead of scrawling all this childish crap. You're every bit as facetious as those who give Rowett no quarter, you just can't see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scarlet Pimpernel Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 When is out fanbase on here going to stop looking back to McClaren? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 2 hours ago, BramcoteRam84 said: His departure the first time did a lot .... Beautifully written @BramcoteRam84 - I concur with all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyhill60 Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 27 minutes ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said: When is out fanbase on here going to stop looking back to McClaren? When a future manager delivers entertaining and winning football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 8 hours ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said: When is fanbase Curtains going to stop looking back to McClaren? Better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Scarlet Pimpernel Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 7 hours ago, sunnyhill60 said: When a future manager delivers entertaining and winning football Stuck in the past Sunnyhill......Why not go way back when? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted May 4, 2018 Author Share Posted May 4, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 The best derby manager since Jim Smith and certainly the one who ignited my passion for the team again after years of dull football. Should have been derbys manager for a very long time,he fitted us like a glove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rample Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 No, because although it didn't work out due to one error in the playoff final he got us that far when we we're struggling beforehand, and more importantly showed after the previous years of drudgery there was something more and it was attainable. You can't blame him for any muck ups whilst he wasn't in charge, after we took the decision to get rid (not that I'm saying that was wrong) we also chose what happened next, and failed to capitalise on where we were by employing managers afte each departure with totally opposing philosophies toward the style of football we were to play. Although I do believe there was probably a lot of 'Yes Mel' going on in Clement's interview, I think Rowett came to stabilise things, make us more resilient, and tighten the budget, purposely drawing an end to the attacking style in the hope we would be more successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ariotofmyown Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 22 hours ago, curtains said: Thoughts A good thread...during the summer, not before our biggest match of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 54 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: The best derby manager since Jim Smith and certainly the one who ignited my passion for the team again after years of dull football. Should have been derbys manager for a very long time,he fitted us like a glove. Yep can agree with your view kash and my view was that at the point he came in he fitted us like a glove and would have gone on to be a big success ( right time right place right circumstances) but sadly he didn’t grasp that and between him and mel they ( bit of blame on both sides ) buggered it up and the moment was lost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyhill60 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 1 hour ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said: Stuck in the past Sunnyhill......Why not go way back when? Better to be stuck in the past than stuck with Rowettball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsCityRam Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 2 hours ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: The best derby manager since Jim Smith and certainly the one who ignited my passion for the team again after years of dull football. Should have been derbys manager for a very long time,he fitted us like a glove. Why do you think McClaren was better than George Burley? Burley inherited a far worse position/squad, had no money at all, was dealing with the 3 Amigos but achieved the same as McClaren, in terms of a playoff defeat. His teams also played very entertaining football (once we started winning) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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