Palestine

[Archied]

4 hours ago, Alph said:

 

Ceasefire. It's been the logical and correct stance for a while. Forever actually. 

Why can't they say Ceasefire? "Because we want a ceasefire that lasts". 

Er... Wtf? It makes zero sense. Because Hamas or at least a version of Hamas will rise again.

So whatever side of the argument you are on or whatever solution you think you have, you are pissing in the wind if you think a brutal military campaign leads to peace. (From either side)

A temporary ceasefire stands more chance of leading to a long term ceasefire. It just does. Knowing Hamas will repeat their actions so instead supporting Israel's ethnic cleansing is putting Israeli lives a priority over Arabs. It's a lie the government has told us about why we need to continue this war. So either they're stupid or they think people are. 

Obviously the steps taken to keep extending the ceasefire do become complex and contentious. But supporting a ceasefire is a no brainer. I have a hard time accepting the view that with just a bit more killing we'll see the benefits in the long run. 

I’m with you there , why this stupid need to not call a cease fire a cease fire , beyond me 🤷🏻‍♂️, as I’ve stated a while back ,a United Nations ( truly United Nations ) peace keeping force for a time until a workable peace can be negotiated is about the only answer but we all know this ain’t gonna happen because the nations of the world want different things to result from the conflict, I don’t know , where the duck do you go with this poo 🤷🏻‍♂️
that said I do believe those of us disgusted by this stuff have a responsibility to keep our actions ,words and protests fully clear of anything that can be remotely seen as being partisan and that includes the usual suspects attacking paintings in a safe university in a country thousands of miles away from the conflict , if you are brave enough to want to do something humanitarian ( I’m not ) then do that and be a shining example , same with waving flags of one side or the other in a safe country thousand of miles away from all the death and horror, brave mothers in Ireland of both sides of the sectarian fence took to the streets to demand an end to the killing at great risk of personal reprisals to themselves ,,,, that’s bravery , I know I will get slated for the second part of this post but that’s just how I see it , in this world of twisters we have to be really clear in our message and motives🤷🏻‍♂️

Edited March 9 by Archied

[Archied]

27 minutes ago, Archied said:

I’m with you there , why this stupid need to not call a cease fire a cease fire , beyond me 🤷🏻‍♂️, as I’ve stated a while back ,a United Nations ( truly United Nations ) peace keeping force for a time until a workable peace can be negotiated is about the only answer but we all know this ain’t gonna happen because the nations of the world want different things to result from the conflict, I don’t know , where the duck do you go with this poo 🤷🏻‍♂️
that said I do believe those of us disgusted by this stuff have a responsibility to keep our actions ,words and protests fully clear of anything that can be remotely seen as being partisan and that includes the usual suspects attacking paintings in a safe university in a country thousands of miles away from the conflict , if you are brave enough to want to do something humanitarian ( I’m not ) then do that and be a shining example , same with waving flags of one side or the other in a safe country thousand of miles away from all the death and horror, brave mothers in Ireland of both sides of the sectarian fence took to the streets to demand an end to the killing at great risk of personal reprisals to themselves ,,,, that’s bravery , I know I will get slated for the second part of this post but that’s just how I see it , in this world of twisters we have to be really clear in our message and motives🤷🏻‍♂️

As an addition , Galloway stating after his win that this is for gazza in his aggressive manner does rightly or wrongly produce fear in many ,,, why not stand up and say this is for peace and an end to the killing , I doubt there’s a person in the country that would not get behind that and see it as only a positive but no we get these bloody idiots who just inflame stuff

[Ram-Alf]

7 hours ago, Alph said:

Ceasefire. It's been the logical and correct stance for a while. Forever actually. 

There's an organisation out there that has values, Unfortunately they seem to be invisible, Take a look at what's happening in Haiti 🙄

The United Nations is an international organization founded in 1945. Its work covers five main areas

Maintain International Peace and Security

Protect Human Rights

Deliver Humanitarian Aid

Support Sustainable Development and Climate Action

Uphold International Law

The UN is an intergovernmental organization whose stated purposes are to maintain international peace and security, develop friendly relations among nations, achieve international cooperation, and serve as a centre for harmonizing the actions of nations.

[GboroRam]

2 hours ago, Archied said:

As an addition , Galloway stating after his win that this is for gazza in his aggressive manner does rightly or wrongly produce fear in many ,,, why not stand up and say this is for peace and an end to the killing , I doubt there’s a person in the country that would not get behind that and see it as only a positive but no we get these bloody idiots who just inflame stuff

It's a terrible tragedy. 

Such a great talent, wasted.  Could have been one of England's greats. 

[Alph]

1 hour ago, GboroRam said:

It's a terrible tragedy. 

Such a great talent, wasted.  Could have been one of England's greats. 

Took me ages 🤣

[Archied]

2 hours ago, GboroRam said:

It's a terrible tragedy. 

Such a great talent, wasted.  Could have been one of England's greats. 

He was ,,, the cxnt is the only English player I had to applaud scoring against Scotland 🥲

[Comrade 86]

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. It does not, however, erase the US and UK complicity in Israel's war crimes and at the appropriate time, questions must be asked of those responsible for allowing the atrocities to continue. What happens next is perhaps less clear, but will the Israelis want to risk their 'gains' by defying the UN ceasefire? I suspect there'll be some IDF sabre-rattling, before a climbdown paraded as a victory by Netanyahu and his supporters, the only question being, how much of the land-grab will remain in Israeli hands? I hope that is considered and I also hope that aid and food can now be delivered insufficient levels that the recipients can avoid famine and disease.

FROM THE BBC
The UN Security Council has called for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza, after the US did not veto the measure in a shift from its previous position.

It also demanded the immediate and unconditional release of all hostages.

It is the first time the council has called for a ceasefire since the war began in October after several failed attempts.

The move by the US signals growing divergence between it and its ally Israel over Israel's offensive in Gaza.

In an unusually strong rebuke, a statement from Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's office said the US had "abandoned" its previous position which had directly linked a ceasefire to a hostage release.

"Regrettably, the United States did not veto the new resolution," it said.

The statement said this harmed efforts to release hostages by giving Hamas hope it could use international pressure on Israel to achieve a ceasefire without freeing the captives.

It also said Mr Netanyahu had decided to cancel meetings between an Israeli delegation and US officials in Washington that were scheduled for this week.

Israel's defence minister said Israel would not stop the war in Gaza while hostages were still being held there.

Full story here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68658415

Edited March 25 by Comrade 86
link

[Alph]

They've even had to change their Eurovision lyrics. 

Just a full Pride Park full of killed Palestinians now. Where half of them are kids. 

"Complex" though innit

[Comrade 86]

On 26/03/2024 at 10:05, Alph said:

They've even had to change their Eurovision lyrics. 

Just a full Pride Park full of killed Palestinians now. Where half of them are kids. 

"Complex" though innit

Gaza war: UN rights expert accuses Israel of acts of genocide

A UN human rights expert says she believes Israel has committed "acts of genocide" in Gaza.

Francesca Albanese, the UN special rapporteur on human rights in the occupied Palestinian territories, presented her report to UN member states in Geneva on Tuesday.

But Israel has already dismissed her findings.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68667556

Meanwhile...

Israel says UN resolution damaged Gaza ceasefire talks

Israel says Hamas's rejection of a current proposal for a Gaza truce deal with Israel shows the "damage" done by the UN Security Council resolution demanding an immediate ceasefire.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's office said Israel would not surrender to what it called the Palestinian armed group's "delusional demands".

They include an end to the war and the complete withdrawal of Israeli forces.

The US called the Israeli statement "inaccurate in almost every respect".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68665247

[Alph]

Goodbye Eylon Levy. Never has one man been exposed for so many lies in such a short space of time and yet shown such respect. The embodiment of the racist colonial Israeli governments. 

Check out his highlights. Quite the pied piper for apologists

[Highgate]

The fact that this Israeli government is managing to alienate it's perennial ally the US, which currently has an avowed Zionist as president in Biden, should give us some impression of just what an extreme regime they are. 

Not that any further convincing of that fact should be needed now, looking at the remains of Gaza.  

[DarkFruitsRam7]

Horrible horrible bloke

 

[Highgate]

9 hours ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Horrible horrible bloke

 

Two horrible blokes.  

[Alph]

"They voted Hamas. Knowing what Hamas are

They allowed Hamas to carry out the coup

They didn't overthrow the government

They allowed Hamas to indoctrine an entire generation of sociopaths in Gaza

They then start a war" 

 

..... I don't even know where I'd start with that. They can't even decide on a version of history that supports their views. Is it in one of these versions of history that Poland started WW2 or is that yet another timeline? 

[GboroRam]

44 minutes ago, Alph said:

"They voted Hamas. Knowing what Hamas are

They allowed Hamas to carry out the coup

They didn't overthrow the government

They allowed Hamas to indoctrine an entire generation of sociopaths in Gaza

They then start a war" 

 

..... I don't even know where I'd start with that. They can't even decide on a version of history that supports their views. Is it in one of these versions of history that Poland started WW2 or is that yet another timeline? 

No, that's this timeline. 

[Eddie]

I think that Adolf Netanyahu's days are numbered, at least as far as the size of yesterday's protests were concerned. Personally, I'm rooting for an untreatable MRSA infection following his hernia surgery.

[Comrade 86]

2 hours ago, Eddie said:

I think that Adolf Netanyahu's days are numbered, at least as far as the size of yesterday's protests were concerned. Personally, I'm rooting for an untreatable MRSA infection following his hernia surgery.

That's how my mum passed, less the hernia bit. Much as I despise Netanyahu, I wouldn't wish that on him and his removal from office and a full and thorough investigation into his conduct and the behaviour of the IDF during hostilities to date would suffice.

That said, I do find the protests quite revealing; on the one hand and quite understandably, those marching in Tel Aviv, Jerusalem, Haifa, Be’er Sheva, Caesarea and other cities on Saturday night see Netanyahu as effectively blocking the return of the remaining Israeli hostages through his continued intransigence and reluctance to allow a meaningful halt in hostilities, or any sustained supply of food and medicine to those displaced. They're not wrong and obviously any civilised individual would sympathise with their plight. What I don't sense, however, is any such regard at all for the 32,490 Palestinians have been killed and 74,889 wounded in Israeli attacks on Gaza since October 7. Likewise the 10,000+ lying dead and rotting under the rubble that once housed them. Or the 1.9 million displaced Palestinians, hoarded like rats into corners, dying of famine and disease and still subject to ongoing Israeli incursions. Plenty of Israeli settlers are already securing beachfront slots for development in the newly occupied lands though, their haste to secure the best locations, indecent to say the least. I suppose the plight of their fellow Israelis might not be so prominent in their thinking, as that of others, or perhaps personal gain simply matters more.

And while on the subject of gross hypocrisy, Biden's posturing seems simply that in light his call for a ceasefire, whilst signing off on transfers to fund and arm the Israeli war effort worth billions of dollars. These include more than 1,800 MK84 2,000lb (900kg) bombs and 500 MK82 500lb bombs, as well as 25 F35A fighter jets, The Washington Post and Reuters news agency have said. So what we have here now is the West is no longer supporting Netanyahu and the IDF's actions, just weaponising them, a distinction that will doubtless make our Easter eggs taste all the sweeter. 

[1of4]

I'm sure most of the world want to see a peaceful end to this conflict.

While I've seen Israelis in their own country protesting and demanding that their government negotiate a ceasefire, which could lead to the removal of Prime Minister Netanyahu.   I've not seen Palestinians protesting and demanding Hamas negotiate a ceasefire.

Many of the Palestinian marches and flag waving that have taken place in the UK not only seem to be protesting against the actions of Israel, but due to the chanting of "from the river to the sea", the total destruction of Israel.

Apparently Hamas have refused to take part in any ceasefire negotiations until all their demands are met. Aren't these meeting supposedly for the two side to come to a compromise, not to rubber stamp the demands of one of the antagonists?

Are the  leaders of Hamas more concerned about the survival of their own organisation and their call for the total destruction of Israel than the safety and well-being of the Palestinian people?

There are claims that what Israel are doing in Gaza is genocide, but isn't what Hamas and their supporters are advocating for is, the total destruction of the state of Israel and it's people, an actual act of genocide?

 

[Highgate]

2 hours ago, 1of4 said:

I'm sure most of the world want to see a peaceful end to this conflict.

While I've seen Israelis in their own country protesting and demanding that their government negotiate a ceasefire, which could lead to the removal of Prime Minister Netanyahu.   I've not seen Palestinians protesting and demanding Hamas negotiate a ceasefire.

Many of the Palestinian marches and flag waving that have taken place in the UK not only seem to be protesting against the actions of Israel, but due to the chanting of "from the river to the sea", the total destruction of Israel.

Apparently Hamas have refused to take part in any ceasefire negotiations until all their demands are met. Aren't these meeting supposedly for the two side to come to a compromise, not to rubber stamp the demands of one of the antagonists?

Are the  leaders of Hamas more concerned about the survival of their own organisation and their call for the total destruction of Israel than the safety and well-being of the Palestinian people?

There are claims that what Israel are doing in Gaza is genocide, but isn't what Hamas and their supporters are advocating for is, the total destruction of the state of Israel and it's people, an actual act of genocide?

 

Hamas are an appalling organization and it's regrettable that they gained power in Gaza. But it's not an accident, it's been a deliberate ploy by Netanyahu and his ilk for decades to sideline more moderate Palestinian voices and centralize Hamas and thereby create an enemy which they can use to justify their imprisonment of Gaza and apartheid like conditions in the West Bank. 

There isn't a single good thing to say about Hamas and their years or murder and terror, and while many Palestinians probably just see Hamas in relation to the struggle with the Israeli state, there is a clear strain of religious fundamentalism in Hamas' worldview and obviously that tends to prohibit reason and compromise.  

The sad thing is, each day of violence that's been inflicted on Gaza will only make Hamas more and more popular, that's just inevitable in these situations.  I'm sure that right now, the large majority in Gaza who has lived through this horror would want to hit back at Israel in any way they can. Unfortunately that's just human nature.  

When the hardcore element within Hamas use the 'river to the sea chant' it may well be that there is genocidal intent involved. But obviously the phrase itself need not have such implications.  It could just mean that the political state of Israel be removed and replaced by a state of Palestine where both Muslims and Jews could continue to live, but the state would no longer be a 'Jewish state'...and therefore Palestinians would be 'free'.  It all depends on who is saying it and the context.  Either way though, I can't see anything like that happening for generations to come.  Interestingly Likud's party manifesto has has the same aspiration but in reverse, 'From the Jordan River to the Mediterranean, there will be only Israeli sovereignty'. 

[Archied]

57 minutes ago, Highgate said:

Hamas are an appalling organization and it's regrettable that they gained power in Gaza. But it's not an accident, it's been a deliberate ploy by Netanyahu and his ilk for decades to sideline more moderate Palestinian voices and centralize Hamas and thereby create an enemy which they can use to justify their imprisonment of Gaza and apartheid like conditions in the West Bank. 

There isn't a single good thing to say about Hamas and their years or murder and terror, and while many Palestinians probably just see Hamas in relation to the struggle with the Israeli state, there is a clear strain of religious fundamentalism in Hamas' worldview and obviously that tends to prohibit reason and compromise.  

The sad thing is, each day of violence that's been inflicted on Gaza will only make Hamas more and more popular, that's just inevitable in these situations.  I'm sure that right now, the large majority in Gaza who has lived through this horror would want to hit back at Israel in any way they can. Unfortunately that's just human nature.  

When the hardcore element within Hamas use the 'river to the sea chant' it may well be that there is genocidal intent involved. But obviously the phrase itself need not have such implications.  It could just mean that the political state of Israel be removed and replaced by a state of Palestine where both Muslims and Jews could continue to live, but the state would no longer be a 'Jewish state'...and therefore Palestinians would be 'free'.  It all depends on who is saying it and the context.  Either way though, I can't see anything like that happening for generations to come.  Interestingly Likud's party manifesto has has the same aspiration but in reverse, 'From the Jordan River to the Mediterranean, there will be only Israeli sovereignty'. 

Always makes me smile seeing people who ridicule people as conspiracy theorists happily promote conspiracy theories 😂
next you’ll be telling us the White House put terrorists on planes for 9/11 so they could ride the wave of fear and anger to achieve its aims , what’s the lives of a few thousand home grown plebs here and there

Edited April 1 by Archied